From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.org/gmane.linux.lib.musl.general/3773 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Rob Landley Newsgroups: gmane.linux.lib.musl.general Subject: Re: embedded newbies site. Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2013 15:01:23 -0500 Message-ID: <1375128083.3031.40@driftwood> References: <1374886708.3031.23@driftwood> <20130727025025.GX4284@brightrain.aerifal.cx> Reply-To: musl@lists.openwall.com NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; DelSp=Yes; Format=Flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1375128097 31651 80.91.229.3 (29 Jul 2013 20:01:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2013 20:01:37 +0000 (UTC) Cc: musl@lists.openwall.com To: musl@lists.openwall.com Original-X-From: musl-return-3777-gllmg-musl=m.gmane.org@lists.openwall.com Mon Jul 29 22:01:40 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: gllmg-musl@plane.gmane.org Original-Received: from mother.openwall.net ([195.42.179.200]) by plane.gmane.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1V3tdU-0007ha-3h for gllmg-musl@plane.gmane.org; Mon, 29 Jul 2013 22:01:40 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 29847 invoked by uid 550); 29 Jul 2013 20:01:39 -0000 Mailing-List: contact musl-help@lists.openwall.com; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Original-Received: (qmail 29833 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2013 20:01:39 -0000 X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=date:from:subject:to:cc:references:in-reply-to:x-mailer:message-id :mime-version:content-type:content-disposition :content-transfer-encoding:x-gm-message-state; bh=+w3bLNOZYlmuofREuz9Jj/jWCsfGUCyR0MQVPuF4acs=; b=hzFgEY4zn303M81r+YoTkBqZZ4G/5+6YSCFNFRtANwyFKp58sgrB94Dm4hSNQVPKBm xFqyAaxQ3KDjq2sL0RiznBiJPrIorgsvi0GQWH0Y44ww6SQpjB74VLPgfZbiQOnBlUJX XWalpIx6105BTQHg5buDCD+i+h9tPC/XrICcCtQ1hwuqCAnRQCe36cozdh8HV/+y/j0t XL/L8hxoQ7+qTJ2oLiV6AFHLa/X9tY0eAqPDvamsNYZqpnUanXMcfxzhBoTjV54U93MQ sUWVTRH20USNY/J5L3e42/gHRC6EWZg9g7O3T3M9v0gvCSk69SLkAERidPAjWCitprg2 0KRA== X-Received: by 10.52.34.74 with SMTP id x10mr16524542vdi.13.1375128087343; Mon, 29 Jul 2013 13:01:27 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20130727025025.GX4284@brightrain.aerifal.cx> (from dalias@aerifal.cx on Fri Jul 26 21:50:25 2013) X-Mailer: Balsa 2.4.11 Content-Disposition: inline X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkIqJJnL2Fz5zCb0WDDAQUDJVEhfl3GyELG1aVFnm0Lt+xqrRbRlVN5IHSJXY4exPVOXTSu Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.linux.lib.musl.general:3773 Archived-At: On 07/26/2013 09:50:25 PM, Rich Felker wrote: > On Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 09:01:48PM -0500, Strake wrote: > > On 26/07/2013, Rob Landley wrote: > > > On 07/22/2013 07:12:39 PM, Strake wrote: > > >> On 21/07/2013, Rob Landley wrote: > > >> > What did you have in mind? > > >> > > >> >> > - efficient (elegant) programming > > >> >> > - Why C and scritpting languages, why NOT C++ and =20 > autoconf > > >> > > >> This. Too, why not glib, and other such garbage. > > > > > > Never having used glib, I'm not qualified to warn people away =20 > from it. >=20 > glib is basically the C++ STL written in C, but lacking exceptions so > that there's no way to handle errors. If we have a "libraries you might want to look at" page, we probably =20 want to have a "libraries we'd like to warn you away from" page. And =20 that's a marvelous summary of glib on such a page. > While debugging the heap-check crash that turned out to be memalign, I > dug into the glib and libxml2 code a bit. Just casually inspecting > less than 500 lines, I found cases of UB that don't break now but will > break down the road with fancier compilers, lack of synchronization > where needed, and various other small to medium bugs, not to mention > 75%-redundant code in multiple code paths (lack of any proper > factoring). Offhand I would guess the whole GNOME family of code has > something like 4-10 bugs per 100 LoC.... Gnome is GNU: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Project#GNOME So of course the code's crap. GNU is a political project, not an =20 engineering project. The technology is never the focus of the effort, =20 and always subservient to other interests. Rob=