From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.org/gmane.linux.lib.musl.general/6996 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jens Gustedt Newsgroups: gmane.linux.lib.musl.general Subject: Re: Re: [PATCHv3 00/24] ILP32 support in ARM64 Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 21:47:50 +0100 Message-ID: <1423687670.4203.8.camel@inria.fr> References: <20141002155217.GH32147@e104818-lin.cambridge.arm.com> <20150210181302.GA23886@brightrain.aerifal.cx> <20150211173919.GF9058@e104818-lin.cambridge.arm.com> <20150211190537.GK32724@port70.net> <359577916.509062.1423684206521.JavaMail.open-xchange@oxbaltgw09.schlund.de> <20150211201251.GK23507@brightrain.aerifal.cx> Reply-To: musl@lists.openwall.com NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-DghwvrzzOcJvCXWbrT5T" X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1423687709 29298 80.91.229.3 (11 Feb 2015 20:48:29 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2015 20:48:29 +0000 (UTC) To: musl@lists.openwall.com Original-X-From: musl-return-7009-gllmg-musl=m.gmane.org@lists.openwall.com Wed Feb 11 21:48:12 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: gllmg-musl@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from mother.openwall.net ([195.42.179.200]) by plane.gmane.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YLeCg-0003hG-AX for gllmg-musl@m.gmane.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2015 21:48:10 +0100 Original-Received: (qmail 30029 invoked by uid 550); 11 Feb 2015 20:48:08 -0000 Mailing-List: contact musl-help@lists.openwall.com; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Original-Received: (qmail 29964 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2015 20:48:02 -0000 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,560,1418079600"; d="scan'";a="121347866" In-Reply-To: <20150211201251.GK23507@brightrain.aerifal.cx> Face: 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Cj15cu23XZI4/826Px/xqB37z547sPH374oOvnKTsOb+1zuCoImZARM8ZiLlKkXcWOcoFRJ+Do/CwFO4e2DEe+9Ti+ZXA8ny/cU+X4bMKRZxZIVEiqXI6/+NKuUzPHb7z40ovnX3zx+Ctuq38HyuqWG7Tu+A0AAAAASUVORK5CYII= X-Mailer: Evolution 3.12.9-1+b1 Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.linux.lib.musl.general:6996 Archived-At: --=-DghwvrzzOcJvCXWbrT5T Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Am Mittwoch, den 11.02.2015, 15:12 -0500 schrieb Rich Felker: > I don't see why you want it to be long long. There is no harm in > passing uninitialized padding to the kernel; the kernel just needs to > do the right thing and ignore it (or avoid reading it to begin with). > Changing the C standard in an incompatible way that invalidates > existing code is not preferable over fixing an implementation bug in > one implementation. Even if C16 or so changed the requirement, people > will still be looking to C11 (and even C99) for years or decades to > come. Alignment of code to language standards moves slowly. I second that, padding or even other named fields is the way to go, the standard doesn't constrain that type other than that the two fields with the prescribed type must exist. I'd also like to add that in all that discussion I didn't hear much of a good reason to impose a change in the standard to all other implementations that maybe out there now, just because one arch got it wrong *and* there is a doable path out of that mess. I wouldn't even know how to argue a defect report for that. > The other direction, passing uninitialized data from the kernel to > userspace, would be dangerous. But it doesn't happen as long as the > userspace padding is positioned (in an endian-dependent manner) where > the high bits of the kernel type would lie. It could happen if you > used a separate conversion wrapper that ony wrote 32 bits, but if you > wanted to take that approach you'd just need the wrapper to also write > the padding field manually. >=20 > > In the kernel headers, the current plan is to provide interfaces taking > > structures=20 > > =20 > > typedef long long __kernel_time64_t; > > struct __kernel_timespec64_t { > > __kernel_time64_t tv_sec; > > long long tv_nsec; > > }; > > =20 > > at least for ioctls, to avoid the ambiguity with libc headers specifyin= g > > something else. >=20 > This seems hideous from an application standpoint. Application > programmers don't want to know, and shouldn't need to know, these > silly implementation details that make no sense except as historical > baggage. They should just be able to use "struct timespec" everywhere > and have it work. Exactly, this is what standards are for. Jens --=20 :: INRIA Nancy Grand Est ::: AlGorille ::: ICube/ICPS ::: :: ::::::::::::::: office Strasbourg : +33 368854536 :: :: :::::::::::::::::::::: gsm France : +33 651400183 :: :: ::::::::::::::: gsm international : +49 15737185122 :: :: http://icube-icps.unistra.fr/index.php/Jens_Gustedt :: --=-DghwvrzzOcJvCXWbrT5T Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iEYEABECAAYFAlTbv/YACgkQD9PoadrVN+IkFQCgi1X17iQjYPNfj9fgoAFz7e+f YikAn35JszJwT3/Y3o7Q/+8o87gJkoHh =DOpm -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-DghwvrzzOcJvCXWbrT5T--