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From: Isaac Dunham <idunham@lavabit.com>
To: musl@lists.openwall.com
Subject: Re: Summary of 1.0 marketing plan/scheme/nefarious plot from IRC.
Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2012 00:18:48 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20121201001848.62b99ad1.idunham@lavabit.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20121201040620.GE20323@brightrain.aerifal.cx>

On Fri, 30 Nov 2012 23:06:20 -0500
Rich Felker <dalias@aerifal.cx> wrote:

> > 
> > I'm tempted to analyze each libc variant: eglibc, uClibc, klibc,
> > dietlibc, newlib. Look at it, figure out what specifically its users
> > get out of it, figure out if musl can meet their needs.
> 
> I can give you the short version...
<snip>
> 
> uClibc I think you know. :-)
> 
> klibc is probably only relevant to initrd. In principle it's a lot
> like Bionic -- a "thin" libc that said "screw standards as long as we
> can provide the libc functionality needed in our very-limited domain".
clone() & pthreads are unsupported, because it's not threadsafe.

klibc does have one very large advantage over musl, especially wrt. intrds: It supports most Linux arches (musl would need to port to several more before becoming a full replacement).
Arches they support but we don't: alpha, cris, ia64 (static only), parisc, ppc64, s390, s390x, sparc.  

Of those, Debian officially supports ia64, ppc64, s390, and sparc (they have sparc 32-bit userland on sparc64).
s390x, parisc, and alpha are unofficial ports.

klibc also has a few untested ports:
m32r, m68k, arm-thumb, sh, sparc64. 

> dietlibc's user base seems to be mostly fefe/djb fans, and maybe
> people making rescue disks and such. It's not secure or robust enough
> for internet-facing use or for many embedded uses.
> 
> newlib's niche is systems with no kernel, or kernels very different
> from POSIX-oriented ones. I don't think it would be used on any
> systems any of the other libcs you mentioned get used on.

It also _is_ used on Linux. newlib on Linux is LGPL, and has more features than other platforms.

newlib is a pretty random assortment: it looks like someone tried to collect all the permissive code they could find and call it a libc...

> Among these, I think the only two against which musl wins in all
> respects are klibc and dietlibc. As for the others:

-- 
Isaac Dunham <idunham@lavabit.com>



  reply	other threads:[~2012-12-01  8:18 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 32+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2012-11-30  2:21 idunham
2012-12-01  2:04 ` Rob Landley
2012-12-01  4:06   ` Rich Felker
2012-12-01  8:18     ` Isaac Dunham [this message]
2012-12-04 20:48     ` Rob Landley
2012-12-04 21:45       ` Rich Felker
2012-12-04 23:01         ` Isaac Dunham
2012-12-04 23:22           ` Rich Felker
2012-12-05  0:58         ` Rob Landley
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2012-11-29 20:50 Rob Landley
2012-11-29 21:15 ` Justin Cormack
2012-11-29 21:51   ` Luca Barbato
2012-11-30  1:30   ` Rich Felker
2012-12-01  0:04     ` Rob Landley
2012-11-30  9:21   ` Rob Landley
2012-11-30 11:08     ` Szabolcs Nagy
2012-12-01  2:00       ` Rob Landley
2012-11-30  1:27 ` Rich Felker
2012-11-30  8:11   ` Truls Becken
2012-11-30 14:29   ` Luca Barbato
2012-11-30 19:05     ` Rich Felker
2012-11-30 20:16       ` nwmcsween
2012-11-30 20:20         ` Rich Felker
2012-11-30 20:32           ` nwmcsween
2012-11-30 20:25       ` Szabolcs Nagy
2012-11-30 20:26         ` Rich Felker
2012-11-30 21:14           ` Luca Barbato
2012-11-30 21:26             ` Rich Felker
2012-12-01  0:04   ` Rob Landley
2012-11-30  4:38 ` Jens Staal
2012-11-30  7:08   ` Daniel Bainton
2012-11-30 13:26 ` Hiltjo Posthuma

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