From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.org/gmane.linux.lib.musl.general/4059 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Rich Felker Newsgroups: gmane.linux.lib.musl.general Subject: Re: GLOB_BRACE Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 15:55:58 -0400 Message-ID: <20130923195558.GJ20515@brightrain.aerifal.cx> References: <20130923155455.GI20515@brightrain.aerifal.cx> <1379956948.1974.59@driftwood> Reply-To: musl@lists.openwall.com NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1379966171 17404 80.91.229.3 (23 Sep 2013 19:56:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 19:56:11 +0000 (UTC) To: musl@lists.openwall.com Original-X-From: musl-return-4063-gllmg-musl=m.gmane.org@lists.openwall.com Mon Sep 23 21:56:13 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: gllmg-musl@plane.gmane.org Original-Received: from mother.openwall.net ([195.42.179.200]) by plane.gmane.org with smtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VOCEt-0001mG-QG for gllmg-musl@plane.gmane.org; Mon, 23 Sep 2013 21:56:11 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 24193 invoked by uid 550); 23 Sep 2013 19:56:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact musl-help@lists.openwall.com; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: Original-Received: (qmail 24184 invoked from network); 23 Sep 2013 19:56:10 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1379956948.1974.59@driftwood> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.linux.lib.musl.general:4059 Archived-At: On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 12:22:28PM -0500, Rob Landley wrote: > >It's become arguably irrelevant > >percentage-wise because the scope of the 'market' has vastly grown, > >but in terms of absolute numbers it's still there, and it's still > >critical to most of the content-production that takes place. > > > >It's fine if you want to say you don't care about this now-niche > >market, but that doesn't solve the problem for people who are still > >dependent on it (which is still a fairly large portion of the > >computer-using population, even if only a small portion of the number > >of computers). > > Server systems migrated from glibc to musl but with systemd seems > like a fairly small niche, but if it interests you... Well I was thinking of the class "server systems migrated to musl", without anything about systemd, which is a very interesting class since musl potentially allows for much smaller (in disk and ram needs) virtual environments. Think from a standpoint of having 50x as many geographically-diverse server nodes each using 1/50 the resources, at the same cost. > People have been trying to get rid of local storage and have dumb > terminals for something like 30 years. It's been 5 years away all > that time. > > *shrug* I often use my android phone for is as a convenient USB > stick via the charger cable. How this is programmed is still up in > the air, but the hardware's there. This is pretty problematic in terms of security with Android, but it could be made very nice with a proper OS. Think of something like this: when you plug in the device, a menu pops up on the device giving you several choices: - New sandbox virtual disk, initially empty - Existing sandbox virtual disk, read-only - Existing sandbox virtual disk, read-write - Main storage, read-only - Main storage, read-write Of course there are a lot more things that could be done to make this more user-friendly and flexible; it might even make sense to virtualize the fs image presented on the virtual mass storage device so as to allow the mobile OS to log/audit the blocks accessed, changes made, etc. and report suspicious activity to the user. > >> Android's not far behind. All we have to do is prevent systemd from > >> being adopted by Android and Lennart's Hairball can get kicked up > >> into the server space with the previous generation of hardware like > >> Cobol before it, where we don't have to care unless we want to be > >> our generation's version of punched card job control wranglers for > >> the money. > > > >The problem is that we do care about server space. The naive version > >of your analogy with "mainframe -> mini -> ..." breaks down in that > >this time, it's not really the old technology and problems being > >pushed up to the servespace. Instead, the serverspace is undergoing > >its own major change to something new; in buzzword-space, this is > >called "the cloud". > > I thought "the cloud" was the name of the NSA's server? It's pretty unclear what it actually means, but the elements I was thinking of are use of CDN's, distributed virtual servers, and online/distributed data storage. Rich