mailing list of musl libc
 help / color / mirror / code / Atom feed
* [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> ...
@ 2025-01-25  0:24 Damian McGuckin
  2025-01-25  4:11 ` Markus Wichmann
  2025-01-27 15:22 ` Rich Felker
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Damian McGuckin @ 2025-01-25  0:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: MUSL


This is not specific to MUSL but I figured the knowledge exists in the 
list. I was doing a review for a small book I am writing.

As long as one has

   defined(_XOPEN_SOURCE) || defined(_GNU_SOURCE) || defined(_BSD_SOURCE)

the constants

 	M_E
 	M_LOG2E
 	M_LOG10E
 	M_LN2
 	M_LN10
 	M_2_SQRT_PI

Has anybody been involved in the global 'need' of these constants, i.e. 
how often they appear in people's code such that the names need to be a
global identified as long as one includes both <math.h> and does the 
appropriate #defines.

The reason I ask is that I cannot find where any of these is used in 
elementary mathematical libraries such as MUSL. Nor can I find the use
of Napier's constant (or Euler's number), i.e. 'e' or M_E, in a few 
million lines of engineering and physics software to which I have access.

The average log() or log2() or log10() programs which one might think 
could use those logarithm constants instead far more accurate ones 
instead.

I would like to say these constants have very little utility in the 
average programmer of technical software for engineering or physics
but that might be a little extreme.

Just curious.  Sadly, the people who made that decision at Berkeley in the 
eighties are quite hard to find these days, most of them enjoying their 
well-earned retirements.

Thanks - Damian

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

* Re: [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> ...
  2025-01-25  0:24 [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> Damian McGuckin
@ 2025-01-25  4:11 ` Markus Wichmann
  2025-01-25  4:44   ` Damian McGuckin
  2025-01-27 15:22 ` Rich Felker
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 4+ messages in thread
From: Markus Wichmann @ 2025-01-25  4:11 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: musl

Hi,

for questions of this type, Debian Codesearch (codesearch.debian.net) is
just awesome. I type in M_LOG2E and I immediately get something in
libreoffice using it. And GCC apparently as well. xscreensaver, too.

Yes, you get a lot of cruft to filter out. A lot of packages only copy
the definition, probably for sake of completeness, but the ones I wrote
above are actual uses of this constant I found inside of 5 minutes.

Ciao,
Markus

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

* Re: [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> ...
  2025-01-25  4:11 ` Markus Wichmann
@ 2025-01-25  4:44   ` Damian McGuckin
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Damian McGuckin @ 2025-01-25  4:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: musl

On Sat, 25 Jan 2025, Markus Wichmann wrote:

> Yes, you get a lot of cruft to filter out. A lot of packages only copy 
> the definition, probably for sake of completeness, but the ones I wrote 
> above are actual uses of this constant I found inside of 5 minutes.

Thanks heaps - Damian

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

* Re: [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> ...
  2025-01-25  0:24 [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> Damian McGuckin
  2025-01-25  4:11 ` Markus Wichmann
@ 2025-01-27 15:22 ` Rich Felker
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 4+ messages in thread
From: Rich Felker @ 2025-01-27 15:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Damian McGuckin; +Cc: MUSL

On Sat, Jan 25, 2025 at 11:24:28AM +1100, Damian McGuckin wrote:
> 
> This is not specific to MUSL but I figured the knowledge exists in
> the list. I was doing a review for a small book I am writing.
> 
> As long as one has
> 
>   defined(_XOPEN_SOURCE) || defined(_GNU_SOURCE) || defined(_BSD_SOURCE)
> 
> the constants
> 
> 	M_E
> 	M_LOG2E
> 	M_LOG10E
> 	M_LN2
> 	M_LN10
> 	M_2_SQRT_PI
> 
> Has anybody been involved in the global 'need' of these constants,
> i.e. how often they appear in people's code such that the names need
> to be a
> global identified as long as one includes both <math.h> and does the
> appropriate #defines.
> 
> The reason I ask is that I cannot find where any of these is used in
> elementary mathematical libraries such as MUSL. Nor can I find the
> use
> of Napier's constant (or Euler's number), i.e. 'e' or M_E, in a few
> million lines of engineering and physics software to which I have
> access.
> 
> The average log() or log2() or log10() programs which one might
> think could use those logarithm constants instead far more accurate
> ones instead.
> 
> I would like to say these constants have very little utility in the
> average programmer of technical software for engineering or physics
> but that might be a little extreme.
> 
> Just curious.  Sadly, the people who made that decision at Berkeley
> in the eighties are quite hard to find these days, most of them
> enjoying their well-earned retirements.

My simple explanation would be that these constants are moderately
useful to software consuming the standard math library and treating
floating point numbers as a good approximation of the reals for
specific real-world purposes, but that they're completely useless
(inadequate) for implementing high-quality general-purpose math
functions accurate across their entire domains.

Rich

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 4+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2025-01-27 15:22 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 4+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2025-01-25  0:24 [musl] Floating Point Mathematical Constanst in <math.h> Damian McGuckin
2025-01-25  4:11 ` Markus Wichmann
2025-01-25  4:44   ` Damian McGuckin
2025-01-27 15:22 ` Rich Felker

Code repositories for project(s) associated with this public inbox

	https://git.vuxu.org/mirror/musl/

This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).