Unicode greek in Context

Unicode greek in Context

[Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος]

Hello,

I am evaluating context for using it to write long greek documents. So far I 
have not succeeded in typesetting unicode greek in live-context. I have 
tried scanning the documentation and mailing list archive with no success. I 
must admit I am not a very technical user. This is what I have tried so far 
(unseccessfuly):

\enableregime[utf-8]
\mainlanguage[gr]
\starttext
Hello world!
Καλημέρα κόσμε!
\stoptext

Is there something wrong with that? Sorry if I am wasting your time -- if 
there is a good "RTFM" answer I would not mind.

Vassilis


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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

Hi Vassilis,

short answer because I'm on the run right now: you could either try to  
typeset your example with ConTeXt + XeTeX; this should work "out of  
the box." Or you could try my Greek module (lookn on the contextgarden  
under "third party modules"). It's designed for ancient Greek but  
should work with the modern variety as well. If you want more support  
for typographical conventions of modern Greek, it should be fairly  
easy to implement that yourself. And welcome to ConTeXt!

Thomas

On Feb 5, 2008, at 8:24 PM, Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος  
wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I am evaluating context for using it to write long greek documents.  
> So far I
> have not succeeded in typesetting unicode greek in live-context. I  
> have
> tried scanning the documentation and mailing list archive with no  
> success. I
> must admit I am not a very technical user. This is what I have tried  
> so far
> (unseccessfuly):
>
> \enableregime[utf-8]
> \mainlanguage[gr]
> \starttext
> Hello world!
> Καλημέρα κόσμε!
> \stoptext
>
> Is there something wrong with that? Sorry if I am wasting your time  
> -- if
> there is a good "RTFM" answer I would not mind.
>
> Vassilis
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an  
> entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Feb 5, 2008 8:24 PM, Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I am evaluating context for using it to write long greek documents. So far I
> have not succeeded in typesetting unicode greek in live-context. I have
> tried scanning the documentation and mailing list archive with no success. I
> must admit I am not a very technical user. This is what I have tried so far
> (unseccessfuly):
>
> \enableregime[utf-8]
> \mainlanguage[gr]
> \starttext
> Hello world!
> Καλημέρα κόσμε!
> \stoptext
>
> Is there something wrong with that? Sorry if I am wasting your time -- if
> there is a good "RTFM" answer I would not mind.

ConTeXt Live didn't work because the default font (Latin Modern) has
almost no Greek glyphs present. You need to use another font, but then
again - the garden might be lacking good greek fonts. You shold add at
least

\usetypescript[antykwa-torunska]
\setupbodyfont[antykwa]

and choose XeTeX or LuaTeX.

But then again - I bothered Taco so much about the urge to upload the
latest version of ConTeXt to CTAN, and completely forgot that the
latest LM font release broke the ConTeXt live as well.

ConTeXt live is based on TeX Live 2007 + latest ConTeXt - we will
probably move it to use the "new minimals". In the meantime I will try
to replace the Latin Modern fonts.

The misfunction of live ConTeX should not be the showstopper.

Mojca
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Arthur Reutenauer]

> ConTeXt Live didn't work because the default font (Latin Modern) has
> almost no Greek glyphs present.

  Actually there's more to it, Greek letters seem to be given a weird
treatment: when trying the sample file Vassilis posted, I see vowels
with tonos are rendered as an apostrophe followed by the Latin
equivalent letter (!), and -- except for the capital Kappa -- the other
letters are obviously taken from Latin Modern Math Italic (so the
absence of the glyphs from the roman fonts is not such a problem, but
the result is typographically very poor).

  With XeTeX or LuaTeX, the glyphs are missing altogether, which is
actually what I expected (of course I have to get rid of \enableregime
first).  I guess Mark II tries to be smart and fake Greek letters with
Math Italic, but fails to render the letter with accents correctly.

  Then I try with Antykwa Toruńska which indeed has the glyphs:

> \usetypescript[antykwa-torunska]
> \setupbodyfont[antykwa]

  First of all, these two lines don't change anything for me, I have to
specify an encoding, but I don't know which one to use for Greek so I
took my chances with ec and replaced the first line with
“\usetypescript[antykwa-torunska][ec]”.

  Then, with pdfTeX, the result is more or less the same as with Latin
Modern (roman capital Kappa, italic small letters, 'e for epsilon with
tonos).  With XeTeX it's a bit better but the mu are missing (?), and
with LuaTeX it looks right. My head hurts ...

  But isn't it possible to use Silvio Levy and Claudio Beccari's Greek
fonts?  They are part of the minimal distribution, and I see there is a
whole typescript file for them (type-cbg), and I would expect to use
them for Greek, rather than the Polish fonts.  The only thing I don't
know, actually, is which encoding to use (in LaTeX this would be LGR, I
think, but it doesn't seem to work here).

	Arthur

P-S: OK, on a second try the mu's are actually there with XeTeX as well ...
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Hans Hagen]

Arthur Reutenauer wrote:

>   Actually there's more to it, Greek letters seem to be given a weird
> treatment: when trying the sample file Vassilis posted, I see vowels
> with tonos are rendered as an apostrophe followed by the Latin
> equivalent letter (!), and -- except for the capital Kappa -- the other
> letters are obviously taken from Latin Modern Math Italic (so the
> absence of the glyphs from the roman fonts is not such a problem, but
> the result is typographically very poor).

this is because when no greek is present (keep in min dthat we talk of 
fonts with at most 256 chars) the defaults are real stupid defaults just 
to get something ... in enco-def there are definitions like:

\definecharacter greekAlphatonos       {'A}


>   With XeTeX or LuaTeX, the glyphs are missing altogether, which is
> actually what I expected (of course I have to get rid of \enableregime
> first).  I guess Mark II tries to be smart and fake Greek letters with
> Math Italic, but fails to render the letter with accents correctly.
> 
>   Then I try with Antykwa Toruńska which indeed has the glyphs:
> 
>> \usetypescript[antykwa-torunska]
>> \setupbodyfont[antykwa]
> 
>   First of all, these two lines don't change anything for me, I have to
> specify an encoding, but I don't know which one to use for Greek so I
> took my chances with ec and replaced the first line with
> “\usetypescript[antykwa-torunska][ec]”.
> 
>   Then, with pdfTeX, the result is more or less the same as with Latin
> Modern (roman capital Kappa, italic small letters, 'e for epsilon with
> tonos).  With XeTeX it's a bit better but the mu are missing (?), and
> with LuaTeX it looks right. My head hurts ...

with luatex there is some more trickery .. trying to find a match using 
the unicode tables but even then if fonts lack the chars ... well .. bad 
luck (if tex would not have math and therefore math greek one would 
never notice the differerences in such defaults)

>   But isn't it possible to use Silvio Levy and Claudio Beccari's Greek
> fonts?  They are part of the minimal distribution, and I see there is a
> whole typescript file for them (type-cbg), and I would expect to use
> them for Greek, rather than the Polish fonts.  The only thing I don't
> know, actually, is which encoding to use (in LaTeX this would be LGR, I
> think, but it doesn't seem to work here).

Hans

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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος]

OK, that worked with XeTeX. Thank you all.

Now, if I could just install the thing...

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mojca Miklavec" <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com>
To: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" <ntg-context@ntg.nl>
Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 2:03 PM
Subject: Re: [NTG-context] Unicode greek in Context


> On Feb 5, 2008 8:24 PM, Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I am evaluating context for using it to write long greek documents. So 
>> far I
>> have not succeeded in typesetting unicode greek in live-context. I have
>> tried scanning the documentation and mailing list archive with no 
>> success. I
>> must admit I am not a very technical user. This is what I have tried so 
>> far
>> (unseccessfuly):
>>
>> \enableregime[utf-8]
>> \mainlanguage[gr]
>> \starttext
>> Hello world!
>> Καλημέρα κόσμε!
>> \stoptext
>>
>> Is there something wrong with that? Sorry if I am wasting your time -- if
>> there is a good "RTFM" answer I would not mind.
>
> ConTeXt Live didn't work because the default font (Latin Modern) has
> almost no Greek glyphs present. You need to use another font, but then
> again - the garden might be lacking good greek fonts. You shold add at
> least
>
> \usetypescript[antykwa-torunska]
> \setupbodyfont[antykwa]
>
> and choose XeTeX or LuaTeX.
>
> But then again - I bothered Taco so much about the urge to upload the
> latest version of ConTeXt to CTAN, and completely forgot that the
> latest LM font release broke the ConTeXt live as well.
>
> ConTeXt live is based on TeX Live 2007 + latest ConTeXt - we will
> probably move it to use the "new minimals". In the meantime I will try
> to replace the Latin Modern fonts.
>
> The misfunction of live ConTeX should not be the showstopper.
>
> Mojca
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to 
> the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> 


___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Feb 6, 2008 11:00 PM, Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος <me01593@cc.uoi.gr> wrote:
> OK, that worked with XeTeX. Thank you all.
>
> Now, if I could just install the thing...

What is wrong? Which OS?

You can try one of
    http://minimals.contextgarden.net/setup/
(if you don't have MikTeX or TeX Live)

And then run
  ./first-setup.sh
  cd tex
 . setuptex
(if you're on unix)

Mojca
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maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Unicode greek in Context

[Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος]

I recently got a Windows Vista PC, and I am fighting with it all the time. I 
had installed ConTeXt in Mac OS X previously with no problems.

I will disable User Account Control and try again today...

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mojca Miklavec" <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com>
To: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" <ntg-context@ntg.nl>
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 12:06 AM
Subject: Re: [NTG-context] Unicode greek in Context


> On Feb 6, 2008 11:00 PM, Βασίλης Γκολφινόπουλος <me01593@cc.uoi.gr> wrote:
>> OK, that worked with XeTeX. Thank you all.
>>
>> Now, if I could just install the thing...
>
> What is wrong? Which OS?
>
> You can try one of
>    http://minimals.contextgarden.net/setup/
> (if you don't have MikTeX or TeX Live)
>
> And then run
>  ./first-setup.sh
>  cd tex
> . setuptex
> (if you're on unix)
>
> Mojca
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to 
> the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> 


___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________