* Re: PDF Questions @ 2000-03-28 7:13 ` Karsten Tinnefeld 2000-03-28 9:31 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Karsten Tinnefeld @ 2000-03-28 7:13 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: Ed L. Cashin, NTG-ConTeXt mailing list Hans Hagen wrote, > RC4 is a copywritten, proprietary algorithm of RSA Data Security, Inc. Adobe > Systems has licensed this algorithm for use in its Acrobat products. > Independent > software vendors may be required to license RC4 to develop software that > encrypts > or decrypts PDF documents. For further information please send e-mail to > products@rsa.com or visit the RSA web server at > http://www.rsa.com/. > > So, anyone paying for the licence ... we only need encryption -) Incredible > that they didn't use a public method. When does the patent end? Anyhow, > this encryption sort of violated portability anyway. Imagine that you would > need a decription device for novels and paperbacks. Yes, but there is another algorithm on the net that reportedly does exactly the same on all inputs anybody tested. If you want to do encrypted pdf according to the pdf specs, you of course have to license rsas property. But if you just want to produce something that works exactly as if is were encrypted pdf, though it is not, there is no point in licensing this algorithm. The source is on, e.g., http://members.tripod.com/~tomstdenis/crypto.htm On the other hand, rsa.com do not agree on this: http://remus.prakinf.tu-ilmenau.de/ssl-users/archive1/0060.html Again on the one hand, people just use and distribute it: http://moriartys.com/cryptix/ http://moriartys.com/cryptix/doc/cryptix.provider.cipher.RC4.html Karsten -- Karsten Tinnefeld tinnefeld@ls2.cs.uni-dortmund.de Fachbereich Informatik, Lehrstuhl 2 T +49 231 755-4737 Universität Dortmund, D-44221 Dortmund, Deutschland F +49 231 755-2047 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-28 7:13 ` PDF Questions Karsten Tinnefeld @ 2000-03-28 9:31 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-28 9:31 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: NTG-ConTeXt mailing list Hi Karsten, Thanks for the pointers. > http://moriartys.com/cryptix/doc/cryptix.provider.cipher.RC4.ht This is a funny one. The java code clearly says: public RC4() Looks pretty public to me, especially for non java experts -) Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
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* Re: PDF Questions @ 2000-03-28 16:01 ` Karsten Tinnefeld 2000-03-29 7:23 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Karsten Tinnefeld @ 2000-03-28 16:01 UTC (permalink / raw) > I know since NTS is prototyped in Java -) I just considered it a funny > contraditionary. They could have made it a private class. What I knew was what Phil Taylor and Karel Skoupý told us in Dortmund a year ago. That time I did not know any Java. But then again, nts.tug.org tells me you have become project leader. Wow, I guess you should know. > >Ideally, there would be a > > \pdfpermissions {/printing (enabled) > > /copying (disabled) > > /ownerpass (thelionsleepstonight) } > > This would not work, since there are no such keys. Also, it would have to > be real primitives, since pdftex does not interpret what goes into objects > and attr's. Nor did I mean, implement it in exactly this way. There are always two, the machine parser and the human parser, and there are at least two different styles for tex coding: *tex syntax using []{}-lists and ps syntax, which is used in pdftex for most pdf specialities. I thought it adequate adopting it for this stuff as well, though it is no native code. Karsten -- Karsten Tinnefeld tinnefeld@ls2.cs.uni-dortmund.de Fachbereich Informatik, Lehrstuhl 2 T +49 231 755-4737 Universität Dortmund, D-44221 Dortmund, Deutschland F +49 231 755-2047 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-28 16:01 ` Karsten Tinnefeld @ 2000-03-29 7:23 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-29 7:23 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ntg-context Hi Karsten, >> >Ideally, there would be a >> > \pdfpermissions {/printing (enabled) >> > /copying (disabled) >> > /ownerpass (thelionsleepstonight) } >> >> This would not work, since there are no such keys. Also, it would have to >> be real primitives, since pdftex does not interpret what goes into objects >> and attr's. > >Nor did I mean, implement it in exactly this way. There are always two, >the machine parser and the human parser, and there are at least two >different styles for tex coding: *tex syntax using []{}-lists and ps >syntax, which is used in pdftex for most pdf specialities. I thought it >adequate adopting it for this stuff as well, though it is no native >code. Your right, but since pdftex is also the backend, its syntax does not always fit tex. Most of those \pdfpage(s)attr, annot, resource, etc primitives are actually a special kind of \special. \pdfcatalog{/PageMode /FullScreen} is for instance just a way to force things into the catalog. Pdftex does interpret the strings. If it was a primitive, \pdfpermissions would need to be interpreted. There was a time that pdftex indeed did some interpretation in some cases. Your case could at first sight probably be solved by something: \pdftrailer{} which would just pass the content to the trailer. Then, objects could be created and set using \pdfobj that contain the copying and printing flags. The problem here is that pdftex would need to encrypt, know the password, key, etc, so here we should in fact have: \pdfcopyingpassword{...} % to be set before first shipout \pdfprintingpassword{..} % idem which probably be rather inflexible for future extensions. In context, the high level wrapper would provide: \setupinteraction[printprotection=...] with ... being: no, yes, or password. Or something like that. The problem with \pdf... primitives is that on one hand they are tex ones and the other hand driver specific ones. Pretty nasty to get that syntax right. Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
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* Re: PDF Questions @ 2000-03-28 13:05 ` Karsten Tinnefeld 2000-03-28 14:51 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Karsten Tinnefeld @ 2000-03-28 13:05 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: NTG-ConTeXt mailing list > This is a funny one. The java code clearly says: > > public RC4() > > Looks pretty public to me, especially for non java experts -) Simply means that every method may access the class, create variables of its type, call its functions, etc. Without any reply, I asked pdftex-l on February 17th, --8<-- Has anyone yet startet a project to implement the pdf standard encryption mechanism with pdfTeX? Ideally, there would be a \pdfpermissions {/printing (enabled) /copying (disabled) /ownerpass (thelionsleepstonight) } field setting permission flags, owner and user password, if any, maybe being entered/input separately. As ianal I cannot determine whether or not usage of the (fake) rc4/md5 algorithms would be a serious problem nowadays, but this (and the demand for a encrypted-only pw storage) may be a reason for a partially separate tool. Comments? --8<-- I still think that whether or not encryption is to be done in a separate pass, information about this should be kept in the tex file. Karsten -- Karsten Tinnefeld tinnefeld@ls2.cs.uni-dortmund.de Fachbereich Informatik, Lehrstuhl 2 T +49 231 755-4737 Universität Dortmund, D-44221 Dortmund, Deutschland F +49 231 755-2047 ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-28 13:05 ` Karsten Tinnefeld @ 2000-03-28 14:51 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-28 14:51 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ntg-context At 03:05 PM 3/28/2000 +0200, you wrote: >> This is a funny one. The java code clearly says: >> >> public RC4() >> >> Looks pretty public to me, especially for non java experts -) > >Simply means that every method may access the class, create variables >of its type, call its functions, etc. I know since NTS is prototyped in Java -) I just considered it a funny contraditionary. They could have made it a private class. >Without any reply, I asked pdftex-l on February 17th, >--8<-- >Has anyone yet startet a project to implement the >pdf standard encryption mechanism with pdfTeX? > >Ideally, there would be a > \pdfpermissions {/printing (enabled) > /copying (disabled) > /ownerpass (thelionsleepstonight) } This would not work, since there are no such keys. Also, it would have to be real primitives, since pdftex does not interpret what goes into objects and attr's. >field setting permission flags, owner and user password, if any, >maybe being entered/input separately. actually it's an object /Filter /Standard /V 1 /R 2 /O to which the Encrypt key points trailer<</Size 26/Info 8 0 R /Encrypt 11 0 R so \pdftrailerattr would be more appropriate. >I still think that whether or not encryption is to be done in a >separate pass, information about this should be kept in the tex file. Sure, that will not be the problem. Since that can be passed on. Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <Hans Hagen's message of "Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:50:47 +0200">]
* PDF Questions @ 2000-03-27 13:19 ` Christopher G D Tipper 2000-03-27 13:34 ` Tobias Burnus 2000-03-27 13:54 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 2 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Christopher G D Tipper @ 2000-03-27 13:19 UTC (permalink / raw) I realise this isn't a ConTeXt specific set of questions, but I see that PRAGMA-ADE is now the home for pdfTeX, so maybe Hans may have some input. Basically, I noticed that Hans had protected the ConTeXt manuals (and I wanted to highlight some minor spelling errors in the English version with Acrobat). No doubt Hans is perfectly capable of fixing his own typos, but this security thing is essential for websites. I was wondering if there was a way of manipulating the security properties of a PDF from pdfTeX using something like the \pdfliteral or \pdfobj attributes. I downloaded the Adobe PDF 1.3 Specification and it doesn't seem to mention security. Do we need to sign a non-disclosure agreement for this stuff? At the moment I feel very ripped-off for paying for Acrobat. Distiller is cool, (but Ghostscript 6.0 is catching up fast) however, if you have Word, Distiller is the way to go. But I'm trying to ween myself off Word, and Acrobat-proper is useless. The only thing I need it for now is thumbnails and security (which reminds me, the thumbpdf package in pdfLaTeX I have breaks in PDF 1.3--does anyone know how to do this in ConTeXt?) Regards, Christopher - Nil Desperandum Illegitimi - Don't let the bastards get you down (with apologies to Ovid) e-conomist - Informed analysis of the Wired World http://users.hol.gr/~ctipper/index.htm ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 13:19 ` Christopher G D Tipper @ 2000-03-27 13:34 ` Tobias Burnus 2000-03-27 14:50 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-27 13:54 ` Hans Hagen 1 sibling, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Tobias Burnus @ 2000-03-27 13:34 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ConTeXt Mailing List Hi Christopher, > Basically, I noticed that Hans had protected the ConTeXt manuals (and I wanted to highlight > some minor spelling errors in the English version with Acrobat). No doubt Hans is perfectly > capable of fixing his own typos, but this security thing is essential for websites. I was > wondering if there was a way of manipulating the security properties of a PDF from pdfTeX > using something like the \pdfliteral or \pdfobj attributes. I downloaded the Adobe PDF 1.3 > Specification and it doesn't seem to mention security. Do we need to sign a non-disclosure > agreement for this stuff? As far as I know is this a kind of postprocessing stuff, so I don't think this is doable in pdftex. > At the moment I feel very ripped-off for paying for Acrobat. Distiller is cool, (but > Ghostscript 6.0 is catching up fast) however, if you have Word, Distiller is the way to go. Why do you need Distiller for Word (instead of Ghostscript)? > But I'm trying to ween myself off Word, and Acrobat-proper is useless. The only thing I need > it for now is thumbnails and security (which reminds me, the thumbpdf package in pdfLaTeX I > have breaks in PDF 1.3--does anyone know how to do this in ConTeXt?) Concerning the thumbnail package, I would suggest to report this problem to Haiko Overdiek (hope the spelling is right). Presently ConTeXt doesn't support something like this, but I think this would be an easy part (Hans?). Concerning the Acrobat-free creation of two-pass things, you might hope for the next version of Ghostscript. Ghostscript-CVS/6.20 does already support linearisation (Adobe calls this for what ever reason `optimation'). Supporting security would be a user project. (Peter Deutsch says he is willing to include such support, if somebody contributes it.) Tobias ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 13:34 ` Tobias Burnus @ 2000-03-27 14:50 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-27 16:00 ` Ed L. Cashin 2000-03-27 21:40 ` Tobias Burnus 0 siblings, 2 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-27 14:50 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ConTeXt Mailing List At 03:34 PM 3/27/2000 +0200, Tobias Burnus wrote: >(hope the spelling is right). Presently ConTeXt doesn't support >something like this, but I think this would be an easy part (Hans?). I just took a look at the specs. I don't think we can use the xform primitive, so we some rather well defined bitmaps in ascii format and compose the object ourselves. >Concerning the Acrobat-free creation of two-pass things, you might hope >for the next version of Ghostscript. Ghostscript-CVS/6.20 does already >support linearisation (Adobe calls this for what ever reason In the first pass? As second pass? I thought it was a separate program? >`optimation'). Supporting security would be a user project. (Peter >Deutsch says he is willing to include such support, if somebody >contributes it.) I suggest you to be that someone -) Anyhow, there are enough programmers on this list to pick up that thread. Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 14:50 ` Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-27 16:00 ` Ed L. Cashin 2000-03-27 16:37 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-27 21:40 ` Tobias Burnus 1 sibling, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Ed L. Cashin @ 2000-03-27 16:00 UTC (permalink / raw) Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> writes: > >`optimation'). Supporting security would be a user project. (Peter > >Deutsch says he is willing to include such support, if somebody > >contributes it.) > > I suggest you to be that someone -) Anyhow, there are enough > programmers on this list to pick up that thread. Didn't someone knowledgable-sounding on the pdftex list say that it's complicated by the fact that Adobe is not releasing some keys necessary to make it work? -- --Ed Cashin PGP public key: ecashin@coe.uga.edu http://www.coe.uga.edu/~ecashin/pgp/ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 16:00 ` Ed L. Cashin @ 2000-03-27 16:37 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-28 10:14 ` Slawek Zak 0 siblings, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-27 16:37 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: NTG-ConTeXt mailing list >Didn't someone knowledgable-sounding on the pdftex list say that it's >complicated by the fact that Adobe is not releasing some keys >necessary to make it work? RC4 is a copywritten, proprietary algorithm of RSA Data Security, Inc. Adobe Systems has licensed this algorithm for use in its Acrobat products. Independent software vendors may be required to license RC4 to develop software that encrypts or decrypts PDF documents. For further information please send e-mail to products@rsa.com or visit the RSA web server at http://www.rsa.com/. So, anyone paying for the licence ... we only need encryption -) Incredible that they didn't use a public method. When does the patent end? Anyhow, this encryption sort of violated portability anyway. Imagine that you would need a decription device for novels and paperbacks. Hans Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 16:37 ` Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-28 10:14 ` Slawek Zak 0 siblings, 0 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Slawek Zak @ 2000-03-28 10:14 UTC (permalink / raw) > So, anyone paying for the licence ... we only need encryption -) Incredible > that they didn't use a public method. Because there would be public, freely available encoders for PDF, maybe. /s ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 14:50 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-27 16:00 ` Ed L. Cashin @ 2000-03-27 21:40 ` Tobias Burnus 2000-03-28 7:14 ` Hans Hagen 1 sibling, 1 reply; 15+ messages in thread From: Tobias Burnus @ 2000-03-27 21:40 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ConTeXt Mailing List Hi Hans et alii, > > Presently ConTeXt doesn't support > >something like this, but I think this would be an easy part (Hans?). > I just took a look at the specs. I don't think we can use the xform > primitive, so we some rather well defined bitmaps in ascii format and > compose the object ourselves. Haiko's thumbpdf works like this: 0. The user produces from his TeX source a PDF file. 1. Now the thumbnails (thumb???.png) are generated by ghostscript, if the user does not want to provide his own ones. 2. With pdfTeX a second pdf file (thumbpdf.pdf) is produced, which contains the thumbnails set by the \pdfimage command. The program `thumbpdf.tex' looks for files with names `thumb000.png' to `thumb999.png' and additional ones specified in `thumbopt.tex'. 3. Then the above generated pdf file is parsed to get the object representation of the thumbnails. This is written to a TeX readable file (thumbdta.tex). 4. If the user's TeX source include the package (thumbpdf.sty), the object data are read and inserted by the \pdfobject command. Now \pdflastobject reports the object number of the thumbnails. Before every shipout of a page the thumbnail for this page is specified in the page attributes. This is done automatically, so an user have to input the package only. > >Concerning the Acrobat-free creation of two-pass things, you might hope > >for the next version of Ghostscript. Ghostscript-CVS/6.20 does already > >support linearisation (Adobe calls this for what ever reason > In the first pass? As second pass? I thought it was a separate program? Well the first pass is PDFTeX or pdfwriter or distiller, the second pass is `pdfopt' of Ghostscript. > >`optimation'). Supporting security would be a user project. (Peter > >Deutsch says he is willing to include such support, if somebody > >contributes it.) > I suggest you to be that someone -) Anyhow, there are enough programmers on > this list to pick up that thread. I'll look into this (I think it would be great, if this would work), but I have only a slight idea what will be needed. The starting place would be PDFSpec.pdf, page 63 ff. and http://www.ozemail.com.au/~geoffk/pdfencrypt/pdf_sec.ps "Ed L. Cashin" wrote: > Didn't someone knowledgable-sounding on the pdftex list say that it's > complicated by the fact that Adobe is not releasing some keys > necessary to make it work? I don't know whether this is true, but it might be; though I wouldn't quite understand why: We can decrypt PDF files (via pdf_sec.ps), so we have quasi the private key. Why shouldn't we also get the public key? -- The other question is (a) the RSA patent (I don't know how long this is valid, and in which countries this applies) and (b) the cryption laws of the USA. This probably will prevent the direct inclusion in GS, but for the non-USA members of the list, this shouldn't be a problem during developement. (Since the key is only 40-bit long and the USA are relaxing their policies this might be a former problem, but I'm not a lawer.) Tobias ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 21:40 ` Tobias Burnus @ 2000-03-28 7:14 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-28 7:14 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ConTeXt Mailing List Hi Tobias, >> I just took a look at the specs. I don't think we can use the xform >> primitive, so we some rather well defined bitmaps in ascii format and >> compose the object ourselves. >1. Now the thumbnails (thumb???.png) are generated by ghostscript, > if the user does not want to provide his own ones. Is GS able to do this fast and efficiently, say in one call instead of 1000 launches? >3. Then the above generated pdf file is parsed to get the object > representation of the thumbnails. This is written to a TeX > readable file (thumbdta.tex). Hm. I think step 3 can be omitted and done directly. Anyhow, this process is really something for a last run -) Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
* Re: PDF Questions 2000-03-27 13:19 ` Christopher G D Tipper 2000-03-27 13:34 ` Tobias Burnus @ 2000-03-27 13:54 ` Hans Hagen 1 sibling, 0 replies; 15+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2000-03-27 13:54 UTC (permalink / raw) Cc: ConTeXt Mailing List At 04:19 PM 3/27/2000 +0300, Christopher G D Tipper wrote: > see that PRAGMA-ADE is now the home for pdfTeX, Not so much *the* home (which is thanh's site) but *a* home, at least for some samples and the manuals -) >Basically, I noticed that Hans had protected the ConTeXt manuals (and I wanted to highlight some minor spelling errors in the English version with Acrobat). No doubt Hans is perfectly capable of fixing his own typos, but this security thing is essential for websites. I was wondering if there was a way of manipulating the security properties of a PDF from pdfTeX using something like the \pdfliteral or \pdfobj attributes. I downloaded the Adobe PDF 1.3 Specification and it doesn't seem to mention security. Do we need to sign a non-disclosure agreement for this stuff? I'm not sure about what manual you talk, but the only reason I can think of protecting some of them was to tag them as 'don't change' which was a way to prevent acrobat asking 'do you want to save ...' each time a document is used, which is the case when one has fields included. [The beta manuals are definitely not protected, since that way David Arnold can send me corrections as notes, which in turn I can postprocess in context into hyperlinked endnotes.] [If there will be a command line utility I may consider protecting them for editing just to be sure they move around the internet as they are. But I suppose I will be too lazy for that.] >At the moment I feel very ripped-off for paying for Acrobat. Distiller is cool, (but Ghostscript 6.0 is catching up fast) however, if you have Word, Distiller is the way to go. But I'm trying to ween myself off Word, and Acrobat-proper is useless. The only thing I need it for now is thumbnails and security (which reminds me, the thumbpdf package in pdfLaTeX I have breaks in PDF 1.3--does anyone know how to do this in ConTeXt?) I never looked into thumbnails since I see no real reason for using them, although I must admit I have thoughts about making funny metapost ones. Thumbnails are just bitmap graphics (xforms) and pointed to by simple key value pairs. Maybe the thumbnail graphics you use are somehow broken. Protection, optimization, encryption is a multipass pass activity, and therefore beyond pdftex. You can use acrobat exchange for that (a cheap old version will do). Sometimes exchange comes on cdroms with documents. A next release of GS will come with an optimizer, and I will not be surprised if protection is part of that. Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 15+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2000-03-29 7:23 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 15+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- [not found] <Your message of "Mon, 27 Mar 2000 18:37:03 +0200." <3.0.6.32.20000327183703.00b747d0@pop.wxs.nl> 2000-03-28 7:13 ` PDF Questions Karsten Tinnefeld 2000-03-28 9:31 ` Hans Hagen [not found] <Your message of "Tue, 28 Mar 2000 16:51:39 +0200." <3.0.6.32.20000328165139.009dc100@pop.wxs.nl> 2000-03-28 16:01 ` Karsten Tinnefeld 2000-03-29 7:23 ` Hans Hagen [not found] <Your message of "Tue, 28 Mar 2000 11:31:27 +0200." <3.0.6.32.20000328113127.01535d60@pop.wxs.nl> 2000-03-28 13:05 ` Karsten Tinnefeld 2000-03-28 14:51 ` Hans Hagen [not found] <Hans Hagen's message of "Mon, 27 Mar 2000 16:50:47 +0200"> 2000-03-27 13:19 ` Christopher G D Tipper 2000-03-27 13:34 ` Tobias Burnus 2000-03-27 14:50 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-27 16:00 ` Ed L. Cashin 2000-03-27 16:37 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-28 10:14 ` Slawek Zak 2000-03-27 21:40 ` Tobias Burnus 2000-03-28 7:14 ` Hans Hagen 2000-03-27 13:54 ` Hans Hagen
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