* web site
@ 2001-11-13 21:11 Hans Hagen
2001-11-13 22:49 ` Marco Kuhlmann
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Hans Hagen @ 2001-11-13 21:11 UTC (permalink / raw)
Hi,
I still have to re-arrange the domain name, but the new site (that is, old
site with new content) can be reached at:
ds035.xs4all.nl
it's a dedicated server on a pretty fast backbone. I still have to redo the
pod.cod sites.
There are new manuals there as well as regenerated versions of older ones.
We plan to upgrade some of them on a short notice (the beginners one,
texexec, metafun and the big one). Some of you sent me corrections, which
are not yet done but will be done.
The qrc's are a mixture of new cover and old content, but the tables will
be upgraded (new look and feel) too. This process goes hand in hand with
the xml based interface definitions.
There is also a new context zip. There are new xml things in there but the
schema's are yet inperfect. Although i still have to move some
optimizations in the kernel (testing them now) this new version should run
much faster although it may go unnoticed on small and relatively simple jobs.
I will upload more manuals and goodies later, but it may be worth to follow
the "big picture" link on the first page. This will bring you to the new
pdf based navigation shell. The basic documents is:
showcase.pdf
and the sub documents:
show-man.pdf : an overview of all manuals
show-pre.pdf : documentation of the presentation styles + examples
show-dem.pdf : the demos
show-pap.pdf : papers
show-art.pdf : articles
I tried to make them nice documents and they also show a couple of metapost
tricks. Downloading show-pre and show-man make take some time (a couple of
megs) but is worth doing. Of course this is all "work in progress". [there
is also a zip with presentation stuff under /zipped/present.zip).
If you save your documentation files in the same structure as the site
(most manuals are searched under general/manuals) you havea nice interface
to all context documents.
Later i will try to make a kind of mirror script (maybe in texexec) so that
documentation can be fetched/updated automatically [too many massive wget
--mir's will overflow our monthly bandwidth budget -)].
Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: web site
2001-11-13 21:11 web site Hans Hagen
@ 2001-11-13 22:49 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-14 11:38 ` Math module (Re[2]: web site) Giuseppe Bilotta
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Marco Kuhlmann @ 2001-11-13 22:49 UTC (permalink / raw)
Hans Hagen wrote (2001-11-13 (22:11)):
> I tried to make them nice documents and they also show a couple of metapost
> tricks. Downloading show-pre and show-man make take some time (a couple of
> megs) but is worth doing. Of course this is all "work in progress". [there
> is also a zip with presentation stuff under /zipped/present.zip).
You finally got me. I just erased latex from harddisk. :-) If
only m-math would work... <hint>
I just noticed a broken link on http://ds035.xs4all.nl/beta.htm
Thanks for this great work,
Marco
--
Marco Kuhlmann marco.kuhlmann@gmx.net
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-13 22:49 ` Marco Kuhlmann
@ 2001-11-14 11:38 ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2001-11-14 12:55 ` Hans Hagen
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Giuseppe Bilotta @ 2001-11-14 11:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: ntg-context
Tuesday, November 13, 2001 Marco Kuhlmann wrote:
MK> You finally got me. I just erased latex from harddisk. :-) If
MK> only m-math would work... <hint>
I'm not dumping LaTeX exactly for that reason. Doing math in
ConTeXt (which is basically plain TeX) is too hard.
BTW, it is possible to use m-math with the latest ConTeXt,
provided a couple of blocks are commented. Anyway, I'm reworking
another one from scratch ... will see if I can make it usefull.
--
Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-14 11:38 ` Math module (Re[2]: web site) Giuseppe Bilotta
@ 2001-11-14 12:55 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-14 16:25 ` Re[2]: " Giuseppe Bilotta
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Hans Hagen @ 2001-11-14 12:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: Marco Kuhlmann, ntg-context
At 12:38 PM 11/14/2001 +0100, Giuseppe Bilotta wrote:
>Tuesday, November 13, 2001 Marco Kuhlmann wrote:
>
>MK> You finally got me. I just erased latex from harddisk. :-) If
>MK> only m-math would work... <hint>
>
>I'm not dumping LaTeX exactly for that reason. Doing math in
>ConTeXt (which is basically plain TeX) is too hard.
>
>BTW, it is possible to use m-math with the latest ConTeXt,
>provided a couple of blocks are commented. Anyway, I'm reworking
>another one from scratch ... will see if I can make it usefull.
much of the math module can go or remapped onto other context things;
actually i want a much more higher level package (also moe tuned for
educational purposes). The main thing in the math module is the breaking of
long formulas and bold fonts.
What exactly is it that latex math has that context doesn't?
Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re[2]: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-14 12:55 ` Hans Hagen
@ 2001-11-14 16:25 ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2001-11-14 16:53 ` Hans Hagen
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Giuseppe Bilotta @ 2001-11-14 16:25 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: ntg-context
Wednesday, November 14, 2001 Hans Hagen wrote:
HH> much of the math module can go or remapped onto other context
HH> things; actually i want a much more higher level package (also
HH> moe tuned for educational purposes). The main thing in the
HH> math module is the breaking of long formulas and bold fonts.
HH> What exactly is it that latex math has that context doesn't?
Mostly user level commands to ease the use of different kinds of
equations/equation groups, and better for to plain TeX commands,
sometimes with automatic things.
All of them can be achieved via plain TeX (obviously), but with
*much* more troubles. If you want, I can send you the PDF manual
created by the .dtx file (something like a compiled module in
ConTeXt) -- 320Kb, about 90 pages of commented code.
Breaking equations is *not* an AMS-LaTeX feature. AFAIK it comes
from the (LaTeX) package breqn.
Anyway, AMS features can be summed up as:
(1) choice of placement of limits on or around integrals,
sums/products and operator names (three options), and more generic
forms of integrals. Not hard to implement, I would say. And AFAIK
functioning from Taco's module.
(2) flushing equations left or centering them. Haven't tested this
in Taco's module.
(3) a \text command which inserts standard text with appropriate
font size (small in superscripts, etc). AFAIK, functioning from
Taco's module.
(4) Poor man's bold and bold symbols. I don't need this (so I
won't try to implement it), but others might.
(5) Operator names. AFAIK, functioning from Taco's module.
(6) Math spacing commands, functioning in text as well
(7) Various ellipsis positioning (bottom, middle, etc), with
choice of autodetection of correct position depending on
surrounding text.
(8) single-command calls to \left| and friends (\lvert, etc)
(9) Fractions in the form \frac{num}{den} and friends (a LaTeX-way
wrapper around \over and friends). AFAIK, functioning from Taco's
module.
(10) different roots and radicals management.
(11) Greek letter variants which do not overwrite original defs
(12) More delimiter sizes, and more generic commands to choose
them
(13) Math accents (more and with better positioning). Very tricky,
and AFAIK the less functioning part of Taco's module. But even in
LaTeX it's a horrible hack (as it is whenever something depends on
fonts ...). Probably needs core hooks and switches. But I assume
you already had a talk with Taco on this.
(14) Extensible arrows.
And serious stuff like:
(15) subarray (for super/subscripter arrays); substack as a
variation for it
(16) matrices (including environment cases)
(17) subequations and their numbering; appropriate equation
numbering; tag (number) placement (top, bottom, center; style;
cancelling it)
(18) multiline equations, split by the user, with choice of
alignment (both full split equation and partial split equations,
as a subenvironment of another display math)
(19) equation groups with and without alignment
(20) quick choice of the different combos (aligned, nonaligned,
numbered and unnumbered). Shortcut \[ ... \] for unnumbered
displaymath.
What is basically missing from Taco's module is 18--20 (and of
course, they are the one I use most!).
I think that the only thing that needs to be done in ConTeXt core
is the math accent stuff. Everything else should be fine as it is
in Taco's module, except maybe for some font stuff which should be
adapted to the new ConTeXt internals. But this is for sure
something *I* am not able to do (would need to study ConTeXt font
internals thoroughly, and this is not the right moment).
--
Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re[2]: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-14 16:25 ` Re[2]: " Giuseppe Bilotta
@ 2001-11-14 16:53 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-15 12:23 ` Re[3]: " Giuseppe Bilotta
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Hans Hagen @ 2001-11-14 16:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: ntg-context
At 05:25 PM 11/14/2001 +0100, Giuseppe Bilotta wrote:
>I think that the only thing that needs to be done in ConTeXt core
>is the math accent stuff. Everything else should be fine as it is
>in Taco's module, except maybe for some font stuff which should be
>adapted to the new ConTeXt internals. But this is for sure
>something *I* am not able to do (would need to study ConTeXt font
>internals thoroughly, and this is not the right moment).
So, to summarize, we have several functions of the module:
(1) fonts
(2) amslatex compatible commands
(3) breaking math
Taco and I will handle (1) also because it is related to the new math
symbol collections and mathml.
If you can strip out all (2) and (3) specific thinsg (watch out: things
like smashing are context core functionality) we can incrementaly replace
m-math.
I will clean up (2) code anyway (at least check it for things that can go
into math-ext instead of a module.)
Btw, spacing issues (like classes of display math) are core functionality
already but i may need to extend it., so there will be left overs "to do".
Hans
PS. Maybe entering math in mathml syntax makes more sense; at least it is a
better way to control consistency.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re[3]: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-14 16:53 ` Hans Hagen
@ 2001-11-15 12:23 ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2001-11-15 14:07 ` Marco Kuhlmann
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Giuseppe Bilotta @ 2001-11-15 12:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: ntg-context, ntg-context
Wednesday, November 14, 2001 Hans Hagen wrote:
HH> At 05:25 PM 11/14/2001 +0100, Giuseppe Bilotta wrote:
>>I think that the only thing that needs to be done in ConTeXt core
>>is the math accent stuff. Everything else should be fine as it is
>>in Taco's module, except maybe for some font stuff which should be
>>adapted to the new ConTeXt internals. But this is for sure
>>something *I* am not able to do (would need to study ConTeXt font
>>internals thoroughly, and this is not the right moment).
HH> So, to summarize, we have several functions of the module:
HH> (1) fonts
HH> (2) amslatex compatible commands
HH> (3) breaking math
HH> Taco and I will handle (1) also because it is related to the new math
HH> symbol collections and mathml.
Yes, I've seen that most of all is there already (even if I seem
to have problems activating it ... how do you call the math symbol
collection? How do you call the symbols? Trying
\enablecollection[ams] and \symbol[varnothing] or \varnothing
fails!).
HH> If you can strip out all (2) and (3) specific thinsg (watch out: things
HH> like smashing are context core functionality) we can incrementaly replace
HH> m-math.
Uhm. I think that I will just strip (3) from the current module
--never used it, don't know how to handle it.
I will try to get something done with (2), but don't expect
anything useful too soon --I'm trying to study pretty hard for the
next couple of months.
HH> I will clean up (2) code anyway (at least check it for things that can go
HH> into math-ext instead of a module.)
Yes. The problem in (2) is that I will have to understand LaTeX
internals and how they are called, together with ConTeXt internals
and how to call them, because unless I go the "reimplementation
from stratch" way I will have to build some kind of emulation
code. Uhm.
HH> Btw, spacing issues (like classes of display math) are core functionality
HH> already but i may need to extend it., so there will be left overs "to do".
I need these. How do I access them? Are they documented? Which
ConTeXt module should I study?
HH> PS. Maybe entering math in mathml syntax makes more sense; at least it is a
HH> better way to control consistency.
No way! MathML (like all XML) is overkill and only makes sense if
an appropriate user interface (via editor or conversion) is build.
--
Giuseppe "Oblomov" Bilotta
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-15 12:23 ` Re[3]: " Giuseppe Bilotta
@ 2001-11-15 14:07 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-15 15:55 ` Hans Hagen
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Marco Kuhlmann @ 2001-11-15 14:07 UTC (permalink / raw)
Giuseppe Bilotta wrote (2001-11-15 (13:23)):
> HH> PS. Maybe entering math in mathml syntax makes more sense; at least it is a
> HH> better way to control consistency.
>
> No way! MathML (like all XML) is overkill and only makes sense if
> an appropriate user interface (via editor or conversion) is build.
Like Emacs, you mean? :-)
Earnestly, I would like to have the option of entering MathML.
Of course, you can't make it the only choice, because then you
would loose all the TeX compatibility and scare off people who
want to convert to ConTeXt.
Marco
--
Marco Kuhlmann marco.kuhlmann@gmx.net
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-15 14:07 ` Marco Kuhlmann
@ 2001-11-15 15:55 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-19 11:54 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-19 15:38 ` Taco Hoekwater
0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Hans Hagen @ 2001-11-15 15:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: ntg-context
At 02:07 PM 11/15/2001 +0000, Marco Kuhlmann wrote:
>Giuseppe Bilotta wrote (2001-11-15 (13:23)):
>
> > HH> PS. Maybe entering math in mathml syntax makes more sense; at least
> it is a
> > HH> better way to control consistency.
> >
> > No way! MathML (like all XML) is overkill and only makes sense if
> > an appropriate user interface (via editor or conversion) is build.
>
>Like Emacs, you mean? :-)
>
>Earnestly, I would like to have the option of entering MathML.
well, go ahead then:
\usemodule[mathml]
\startXMLdata
<math><apply><plus/>......
\stopXMLdata
should work right now.
Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-15 15:55 ` Hans Hagen
@ 2001-11-19 11:54 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-19 15:38 ` Taco Hoekwater
1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Marco Kuhlmann @ 2001-11-19 11:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
Hans Hagen wrote (2001-11-15 (16:55)):
> >Earnestly, I would like to have the option of entering MathML.
>
> well, go ahead then:
Sorry, I did not make myself clear. What I meant was that I
appreciate the option of entering math using MathML, but it
should not be the only way.
Marco
--
Marco Kuhlmann marco.kuhlmann@gmx.net
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-15 15:55 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-19 11:54 ` Marco Kuhlmann
@ 2001-11-19 15:38 ` Taco Hoekwater
2001-11-20 8:23 ` Hans Hagen
1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Taco Hoekwater @ 2001-11-19 15:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: marco.kuhlmann, ntg-context
For Marco:
% start demo.tex
\usemodule[mathml]
\starttext
This
\startXMLdata
<math><apply><plus/><mn>1</mn><mn>2</mn></apply></math>
\stopXMLdata
That $1+2$
\stoptext
% end demo.tex
--
groeten,
Taco
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: Math module (Re[2]: web site)
2001-11-19 15:38 ` Taco Hoekwater
@ 2001-11-20 8:23 ` Hans Hagen
0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Hans Hagen @ 2001-11-20 8:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
Cc: marco.kuhlmann, ntg-context
At 04:38 PM 11/19/2001 +0100, Taco Hoekwater wrote:
>For Marco:
>% start demo.tex
>\usemodule[mathml]
>
>\starttext
>This
>\startXMLdata
> <math><apply><plus/><mn>1</mn><mn>2</mn></apply></math>
>\stopXMLdata
>
>That $1+2$
>
>\stoptext
>% end demo.tex
<cn>1</cn>...
is more in tune with the content math wrapper "apply"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2001-11-20 8:23 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2001-11-13 21:11 web site Hans Hagen
2001-11-13 22:49 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-14 11:38 ` Math module (Re[2]: web site) Giuseppe Bilotta
2001-11-14 12:55 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-14 16:25 ` Re[2]: " Giuseppe Bilotta
2001-11-14 16:53 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-15 12:23 ` Re[3]: " Giuseppe Bilotta
2001-11-15 14:07 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-15 15:55 ` Hans Hagen
2001-11-19 11:54 ` Marco Kuhlmann
2001-11-19 15:38 ` Taco Hoekwater
2001-11-20 8:23 ` Hans Hagen
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