Re: does context support vietnamese?

Re: does context support vietnamese?

[Hans Hagen]

The Thanh Han wrote:

> do you have a test file for another language, for example english or
> czech? Then I can translate that file to get a test file for vietnamese.
> What is the current status of context support for czech?
> 
> BTW, the current official vietnamese font encoding used by plain and
> latex is named T5 instead of X5. You can get the latest stable version
> of vntex (fonts + latex/plain support) at vntex.sf.net

Can those working on vietnamese also cc Thanh (the famous pdftex author)?

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
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Re: Re: does context support vietnamese?

[Adam Lindsay]

Hans Hagen said this at Wed, 17 Nov 2004 11:05:21 +0100:

>The Thanh Han wrote:
>
>> do you have a test file for another language, for example english or
>> czech? Then I can translate that file to get a test file for vietnamese.
>> What is the current status of context support for czech?
>> 
>> BTW, the current official vietnamese font encoding used by plain and
>> latex is named T5 instead of X5. You can get the latest stable version
>> of vntex (fonts + latex/plain support) at vntex.sf.net
>
>Can those working on vietnamese also cc Thanh (the famous pdftex author)?

I have been.

Thanh, would you say that T5 is a replacement, an update for X5, or a new
thing (meaning the enco-x5 work you did for ConTeXt should stay around)?
-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
 Adam T. Lindsay, Computing Dept.     atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
 Lancaster University, InfoLab21        +44(0)1524/510.514
 Lancaster, LA1 4WA, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/510.492
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Czech support (Was: Re: does context support vietnamese?)^[

[David Antos]

On Wed, Nov 17, 2004 at 11:05:21AM +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
> The Thanh Han wrote:
> >What is the current status of context support for czech?

Hello,

Hyphenation patterns work OK for Czech. Settings for Czech seem to be
reasonable (I'd only redefine subsentence setting and mainly date),
generated words (Chapter, ...) work fine, at least it is easy to
redefine them to one's personal taste :-)

System messages and names of macros are available in Czech (although I
cannot imagine anyone who would use them; things like "nastavramovani"
for setupframed seem really perverted to me:-).

Index sorting is missing in the distribution; in any case, Czech sorting
rules are really ugly and need incorporation of Cz::Sort into texutil. I
don't keep an eye on ConTeXt development very carefully so I might be
out-of-sync, nevertheless it'd be nice to have a sorting module
pluggable into texutil (just a suggestion).

The Czech support is based on master thesis of Tomas Hudec. After
finishing his study, he disappeared and I have no knowledge about him.
Fortunately, I have the complete sources of his work, so the missing
parts could be filled. I've prepared a Bc. thesis assignment saying in
fact "take Tomas' thesis and make it really work" but I haven't manage
anybody to do that :-(

Currently, I'm pretty busy (and use ConTeXt to write in English), so if
a Czech speaking ConTeXt user wants to have a look at it, I can send
him/her the archive.

Regards,
D.A.

-- 
I either want less decadence or more chance to participate in it.

Re: Czech support (Was: Re: does context support vietnamese?)^[

[h h extern]

David Antos wrote:

> Hyphenation patterns work OK for Czech. Settings for Czech seem to be
> reasonable (I'd only redefine subsentence setting and mainly date),
> generated words (Chapter, ...) work fine, at least it is easy to
> redefine them to one's personal taste :-)

since there are more czech users on this list (if i'm right), if you team up and 
send me patches ...

> System messages and names of macros are available in Czech (although I
> cannot imagine anyone who would use them; things like "nastavramovani"
> for setupframed seem really perverted to me:-).

hm, it's not something obscene i hope

we need indeed someone to go over the czech interface

> Index sorting is missing in the distribution; in any case, Czech sorting
> rules are really ugly and need incorporation of Cz::Sort into texutil. I
> don't keep an eye on ConTeXt development very carefully so I might be
> out-of-sync, nevertheless it'd be nice to have a sorting module
> pluggable into texutil (just a suggestion).

ok, i have to pick up that thread

> The Czech support is based on master thesis of Tomas Hudec. After
> finishing his study, he disappeared and I have no knowledge about him.
> Fortunately, I have the complete sources of his work, so the missing
> parts could be filled. I've prepared a Bc. thesis assignment saying in
> fact "take Tomas' thesis and make it really work" but I haven't manage
> anybody to do that :-(
> 
> Currently, I'm pretty busy (and use ConTeXt to write in English), so if
> a Czech speaking ConTeXt user wants to have a look at it, I can send
> him/her the archive.

btw, coming distributions will carry new styles for typesetting the setups

texmfstart texexec.pl --pdf --global --purge --interface=en --result=setup-en 
x-set-12.tex

i think in the new layout you will recognize some of the things we both 
discussed long ago (this goes hand in hand to moving to xml descriptions)

Hans


-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Czech support (Was: Re: does context support vietnamese?)^[

[Vit Zyka]

h h extern wrote:
> David Antos wrote:
> 
>> Hyphenation patterns work OK for Czech. Settings for Czech seem to be
>> reasonable (I'd only redefine subsentence setting and mainly date),
>> generated words (Chapter, ...) work fine, at least it is easy to
>> redefine them to one's personal taste :-)
> 
> since there are more czech users on this list (if i'm right), if you 
> team up and send me patches ...

I can have a look on it but not now. Until the end of year I am quite 
busy. That the work of Tomas Hudec deal with if it was a Master Thesis?
Can David send me the data, please?

>> System messages and names of macros are available in Czech (although I
>> cannot imagine anyone who would use them; things like "nastavramovani"
>> for setupframed seem really perverted to me:-).
> 
> hm, it's not something obscene i hope

No. But practically useless and uncatchy.

>> Index sorting is missing in the distribution; in any case, Czech sorting
>> rules are really ugly and need incorporation of Cz::Sort into texutil. I
>> don't keep an eye on ConTeXt development very carefully so I might be
>> out-of-sync, nevertheless it'd be nice to have a sorting module
>> pluggable into texutil (just a suggestion).
> 
> ok, i have to pick up that thread

It would be very nice. I was asking on it a year ago but with no 
response :-(

Regards,
Vit Zyka

Re: Re: does context support vietnamese?

[The Thanh Han]

Hi Adam,

ET5 was the first proposed font encoding for vietnamese; then it was
renamed to X5 with a few modifications. T5 is a minor update -- it's
heavily based on X5 but I don't remember what has been changed.

Thanh

On Wed, Nov 17, 2004 at 10:10:57AM +0000, Adam Lindsay wrote:
> Hans Hagen said this at Wed, 17 Nov 2004 11:05:21 +0100:
> 
> >The Thanh Han wrote:
> >
> >> do you have a test file for another language, for example english or
> >> czech? Then I can translate that file to get a test file for vietnamese.
> >> What is the current status of context support for czech?
> >> 
> >> BTW, the current official vietnamese font encoding used by plain and
> >> latex is named T5 instead of X5. You can get the latest stable version
> >> of vntex (fonts + latex/plain support) at vntex.sf.net
> >
> >Can those working on vietnamese also cc Thanh (the famous pdftex author)?
> 
> I have been.
> 
> Thanh, would you say that T5 is a replacement, an update for X5, or a new
> thing (meaning the enco-x5 work you did for ConTeXt should stay around)?
> -- 
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>  Adam T. Lindsay, Computing Dept.     atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
>  Lancaster University, InfoLab21        +44(0)1524/510.514
>  Lancaster, LA1 4WA, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/510.492
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> 

Re: Re: does context support vietnamese?

[Adam Lindsay]

The Thanh Han said this at Thu, 18 Nov 2004 08:36:05 +0700:

>Hi Adam,
>
>ET5 was the first proposed font encoding for vietnamese; then it was
>renamed to X5 with a few modifications. T5 is a minor update -- it's
>heavily based on X5 but I don't remember what has been changed.

Thanks. The questions now seem to be, is there a significant amount of
fonts/support files/work that relied on x5 that needs to be supported?
Because I just discovered that there were some serious bugs in the
ConTeXt interpretation of the x5 encoding, and that any regular user
would have demanded that something be changed!

Cheers,
adam
-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
 Adam T. Lindsay, Computing Dept.     atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
 Lancaster University, InfoLab21        +44(0)1524/510.514
 Lancaster, LA1 4WA, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/510.492
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Re: Re: does context support vietnamese?

[The Thanh Han]

On Thu, Nov 18, 2004 at 01:45:17AM +0000, Adam Lindsay wrote:
> The Thanh Han said this at Thu, 18 Nov 2004 08:36:05 +0700:
> 
> >Hi Adam,
> >
> >ET5 was the first proposed font encoding for vietnamese; then it was
> >renamed to X5 with a few modifications. T5 is a minor update -- it's
> >heavily based on X5 but I don't remember what has been changed.
> 
> Thanks. The questions now seem to be, is there a significant amount of
> fonts/support files/work that relied on x5 that needs to be supported?
> Because I just discovered that there were some serious bugs in the
> ConTeXt interpretation of the x5 encoding, and that any regular user
> would have demanded that something be changed!

afaik nobody has used vietnamese with context yet, so just forget
backward compability and do what is needed.

Thanh

Re: Re: does context support vietnamese?

[h h extern]

The Thanh Han wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 18, 2004 at 01:45:17AM +0000, Adam Lindsay wrote:
> 
>>The Thanh Han said this at Thu, 18 Nov 2004 08:36:05 +0700:
>>
>>
>>>Hi Adam,
>>>
>>>ET5 was the first proposed font encoding for vietnamese; then it was
>>>renamed to X5 with a few modifications. T5 is a minor update -- it's
>>>heavily based on X5 but I don't remember what has been changed.
>>
>>Thanks. The questions now seem to be, is there a significant amount of
>>fonts/support files/work that relied on x5 that needs to be supported?
>>Because I just discovered that there were some serious bugs in the
>>ConTeXt interpretation of the x5 encoding, and that any regular user
>>would have demanded that something be changed!
> 
> 
> afaik nobody has used vietnamese with context yet, so just forget
> backward compability and do what is needed.

so we can drop x5 and go for t5 (i.e. lm only needs to support t5)

thanh: adam got most font stuff working like a charm! i'll add things to the 
distribution

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Re: does context support vietnamese?

[The Thanh Han]

On Mon, Nov 22, 2004 at 12:24:30AM +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
> The Thanh Han wrote:
> >On Thu, Nov 18, 2004 at 01:45:17AM +0000, Adam Lindsay wrote:
> >
> >>The Thanh Han said this at Thu, 18 Nov 2004 08:36:05 +0700:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Hi Adam,
> >>>
> >>>ET5 was the first proposed font encoding for vietnamese; then it was
> >>>renamed to X5 with a few modifications. T5 is a minor update -- it's
> >>>heavily based on X5 but I don't remember what has been changed.
> >>
> >>Thanks. The questions now seem to be, is there a significant amount of
> >>fonts/support files/work that relied on x5 that needs to be supported?
> >>Because I just discovered that there were some serious bugs in the
> >>ConTeXt interpretation of the x5 encoding, and that any regular user
> >>would have demanded that something be changed!
> >
> >
> >afaik nobody has used vietnamese with context yet, so just forget
> >backward compability and do what is needed.
> 
> so we can drop x5 and go for t5 (i.e. lm only needs to support t5)
> 
> thanh: adam got most font stuff working like a charm! i'll add things to 
> the distribution

wonderful. When Quy translates the latex2context howto to Vietnamese, I
will give another try to switch to context :)

Thanh