German ß

German ß

[Wolfgang Zillig]

Hello,

i have some problems with an selfcreated typescriptfile. Until one of
the last context-updates everythin works fine. The font I use is from
the hfbright package (the hfbright package is a free version of the
cmbright font) but when I created that typescript I did't relalize that
a full font package was available and I renamed the fonts (therefore I
will not provide that ugly typescript file here). I don't know what has
changed but the german ß is not working any more. I use as font encoding
ec and as regime win.

I'm a bit confused where exactly my problem lies: either the encoding is
wrong, but I do't know which one is right because in the latex package
hfbright the encoding is called OT1. Has anyone an idea how to fix this
problem or can anyone help me to set up a context module like the
hfbright-module?

Many thanks

Wolfgang

Re: German ß

[Mojca Miklavec]

Wolfgang Zillig <wolfgang.zillig@student.kuleuven.be> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> i have some problems with an selfcreated typescriptfile. Until one of
> the last context-updates everythin works fine. The font I use is from
> the hfbright package (the hfbright package is a free version of the
> cmbright font) but when I created that typescript I did't relalize that
> a full font package was available and I renamed the fonts (therefore I
> will not provide that ugly typescript file here). I don't know what has
> changed but the german ß is not working any more. I use as font encoding
> ec and as regime win.
>
> I'm a bit confused where exactly my problem lies: either the encoding is
> wrong, but I do't know which one is right because in the latex package
> hfbright the encoding is called OT1. Has anyone an idea how to fix this
> problem or can anyone help me to set up a context module like the
> hfbright-module?
>
> Many thanks
>
> Wolfgang

Out of curiosity: what happens if you add the following line somewhere
after the definition of encoding and after font switching?

    \definecharacter ssharp 25

Also try to test a word like "bi\ssharp chen" (this should prevent
problems with input regime).

If this works, it's necessary to add support for OT1 (if this is not
already default), see
http://source.contextgarden.net/enco-ec.tex for example.

Ec is not supposed to work properly (in LaTeX it's known under the
name T1), texnansi also has other character positions, but ssharp
could work there.

Mojca

Re: German ß

[Wolfgang Zillig]

Hello,

I tried following things:
1.    \enableregime[win]
        äöü is working; ß is shown as SS
2. \enableregime \[il1]
       öäü and ß comes wrong
3.  \enableregime[win]
     \definecharacter ssharp 255
    äöü is working; ß is shown as SS
    \ssharp results in ß
4. \enableregime[il1]
     \definecharacter ssharp 255
    äöü are wrong; ß is shown as ß

5. and completely strage: using \ss in the text changes from there on to 
the font LMSans12! And there ß and öäü is working.

I really have to state that I don't understand the font font handling 
completely but I think some things changed here in the last time.

I hope that anybody can give me a hint how to use fonts (especially that 
ones from the latex-hfbright package)

Wolfgang


Mojca Miklavec schrieb:

>Wolfgang Zillig <wolfgang.zillig@student.kuleuven.be> wrote:
>  
>
>>Hello,
>>
>>i have some problems with an selfcreated typescriptfile. Until one of
>>the last context-updates everythin works fine. The font I use is from
>>the hfbright package (the hfbright package is a free version of the
>>cmbright font) but when I created that typescript I did't relalize that
>>a full font package was available and I renamed the fonts (therefore I
>>will not provide that ugly typescript file here). I don't know what has
>>changed but the german ß is not working any more. I use as font encoding
>>ec and as regime win.
>>
>>I'm a bit confused where exactly my problem lies: either the encoding is
>>wrong, but I do't know which one is right because in the latex package
>>hfbright the encoding is called OT1. Has anyone an idea how to fix this
>>problem or can anyone help me to set up a context module like the
>>hfbright-module?
>>
>>Many thanks
>>
>>Wolfgang
>>    
>>
>
>Out of curiosity: what happens if you add the following line somewhere
>after the definition of encoding and after font switching?
>
>    \definecharacter ssharp 25
>
>Also try to test a word like "bi\ssharp chen" (this should prevent
>problems with input regime).
>
>If this works, it's necessary to add support for OT1 (if this is not
>already default), see
>http://source.contextgarden.net/enco-ec.tex for example.
>
>Ec is not supposed to work properly (in LaTeX it's known under the
>name T1), texnansi also has other character positions, but ssharp
>could work there.
>
>Mojca
>_______________________________________________
>ntg-context mailing list
>ntg-context@ntg.nl
>http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
>
>  
>

Re: German ß

[Mojca Miklavec]

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Wolfgang Zillig wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I tried following things:
> 1.    \enableregime[win]
>         äöü is working; ß is shown as SS

Strange. If you take a look at enco-def.tex, you'll notice that
\Ssharp will expand into SS, but I have no idea why this would happen
with \ssharp. Where did I miss the definition?

> 2. \enableregime \[il1]
>        öäü and ß comes wrong
> 3.  \enableregime[win]
>      \definecharacter ssharp 255
>     äöü is working; ß is shown as SS
>     \ssharp results in ß
> 4. \enableregime[il1]
>      \definecharacter ssharp 255
>     äöü are wrong; ß is shown as ß

When I take a look to regi-win.tex and regi-il1.tex, both definitions
for the character 223 appear to be OK (\defineactivetoken 223
{\ssharp}). I have no idea where the difference comes from.

You have to write
\definecharacter ssharp 25, not 225. If you look at the .enc or .afm
files of your font, there's a "germandbls" located on the 25th slot.

But I can't really track down your examples. They are too confusing.

> 5. and completely strage: using \ss in the text changes from there on to
> the font LMSans12! And there ß and öäü is working.

\ss stands for "sans" in ConTeXt (just as if someone would try to
switch the language to Slovenian with \sl). I'm not sure about which
meaning of "\ss" would have the priority here, but I'm almost sure
that it won't be changed. You can use \ssharp or the proper regime.

> I really have to state that I don't understand the font font handling
> completely but I think some things changed here in the last time.
>
> I hope that anybody can give me a hint how to use fonts (especially that
> ones from the latex-hfbright package)

I have absolutely no idea about the fonts (I'm unable to install one),
but I can explain you a bit about the mechanism behind. It's not a
very clear way of explaining - I hope that you'll catch at least a
little bit of it.

There are (at least) two layers of "encodings" The first one, called
"regime" in ConTeXt (and inputenc in LaTeX) takes care that the bytes
in your input file transform into something meaningful for TeX and the
second layer, "encoding" in ConTeXt (fontenc in LaTeX) takes care that
this "something meaningful" chooses the proper glyph from the font you
provided.

Examples of regimes are il1 (iso latin 1), win (cp1252), utf (utf-8),
... They are pretty standard and if there's a mistake in the
regi-*.tex file, it should be removed right away.

Examples of encodings (font encodings) are OT1 (standard in TeX),
ec/cork/T1, texnansi, ... They are supposed to be standard, but it may
be that some glyphs in your font are missing, that font comes in some
obscure font encoding, that encodings themselves are buggy and
nonstandard (ec contains some glyphs with strange names and some
duplucates), that there is no standard at all (Arabic, symbol fonts)
...

TeXnansi is supposed to be somehow recommended for the usage with
ConTeXt for Western European. It may also be that it is the default
(instead of the default OT1 in TeX) and that there's no "undo
texnansi" except if you delete a couple of lines in ConTeXt source or
if you write your own enco-ot1.tex file. OT1 is needed for your font
(you could recode the font as well, but this requires some additional
skills and you would have to do that on every computer where you want
to compile your document then).


When you define a regime (such as il1 or win), the bytes in your input
file will turn into "named glyphs". If there's a char 223 in your file
(which is defined to be ß in iso latin 1, but may be just any other
character in another regime), you'll see the definition
\defineactivetoken 223 {\ssharp}
in regi-win.tex.

Now that you have this \ssharp you have to tell TeX which glyph from
the chosen font to use. Fonts have only 256 slots and ß is located at
position 25 in OT1 (default) encoding. But you have to tell ConTeXt
about that. This happens in enco-xxx.tex when you choose an encoding.
If you had a font in ec encoding, the definition
\definecharacter ssharp          255
in enco-ec.tex would do that for you. ConTeXt processes the
enco-def.tex file first. Strange letters that are not present in your
font, but could be faked, are defined there. \Ssharp expands into SS
there, \ssharp goes into the character 25, some accents are built
there, ...
When you tell ConTeXt that you would like to use ec font encoding,
some of the definitions are replaced.
\definecharacter Thorn           222
in enco-ec.tex will explain to ConTeXt that character 222 can be used
when someone types in \Thorn or "Þ" in the proper encoding. In any
other encoding \Thorn would be ignored.


I don't know how you prepared your typescript file (and I guess that I
wouldn't understand it anyway), but the problem may be that you are
instructing ConTeXt to use the wrong encoding. Perhaps even if you
don't define any encoding explicitly, it perhaps defaults to texnansi.


(sorry for philosophising)

Mojca


> Mojca Miklavec schrieb:
>
> >Wolfgang Zillig <wolfgang.zillig@student.kuleuven.be> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Hello,
> >>
> >>i have some problems with an selfcreated typescriptfile. Until one of
> >>the last context-updates everythin works fine. The font I use is from
> >>the hfbright package (the hfbright package is a free version of the
> >>cmbright font) but when I created that typescript I did't relalize that
> >>a full font package was available and I renamed the fonts (therefore I
> >>will not provide that ugly typescript file here). I don't know what has
> >>changed but the german Я is not working any more. I use as font encoding
> >>ec and as regime win.
> >>
> >>I'm a bit confused where exactly my problem lies: either the encoding is
> >>wrong, but I do't know which one is right because in the latex package
> >>hfbright the encoding is called OT1. Has anyone an idea how to fix this
> >>problem or can anyone help me to set up a context module like the
> >>hfbright-module?
> >>
> >>Many thanks
> >>
> >>Wolfgang
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Out of curiosity: what happens if you add the following line somewhere
> >after the definition of encoding and after font switching?
> >
> >    \definecharacter ssharp 25
> >
> >Also try to test a word like "bi\ssharp chen" (this should prevent
> >problems with input regime).
> >
> >If this works, it's necessary to add support for OT1 (if this is not
> >already default), see
> >http://source.contextgarden.net/enco-ec.tex for example.
> >
> >Ec is not supposed to work properly (in LaTeX it's known under the
> >name T1), texnansi also has other character positions, but ssharp
> >could work there.
> >
> >Mojca

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Re: German ß

[Adam Lindsay]

Wolfgang Zillig said this at Sun, 16 Oct 2005 19:57:35 +0200:

>The font I use is from
>the hfbright package (the hfbright package is a free version of the
>cmbright font) but when I created that typescript I did't relalize that
>a full font package was available and I renamed the fonts (therefore I
>will not provide that ugly typescript file here). I don't know what has
>changed but the german ß is not working any more. I use as font encoding
>ec and as regime win.

Hi. I'm just catching up with this issue.
Mojca is giving you the right information. I've installed hfbright on my
machine and can confirm that it is OT1 (context's `default' encoding)
only. The easiest way to fix this for you is to return to the
typescripts and make sure they say:
  [encoding=default] instead of
  [encoding=ec]

As you are probably aware, there are issues with hyphenation and the OT1
encoding. However, the TFMs and free Type 1 glyphs for this font simply
are not around.

May I suggest looking at the new Latin Modern light sans fonts for text,
and using hfbright for mathematics only?

adam
--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
 Adam T. Lindsay, Computing Dept.     atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
 Lancaster University, InfoLab21        +44(0)1524/510.514
 Lancaster, LA1 4WA, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/510.492
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Re: German ß

[Adam Lindsay]

[Wolfgang, I hope you don't mind me copying parts of your response to
the list. -adam]

Wolfgang Zillig said this at Mon, 17 Oct 2005 14:06:32 +0200:

>Hello Adam,
>
>thanks for your answer!
>
>>Hi. I'm just catching up with this issue.
>>Mojca is giving you the right information. I've installed hfbright on my
>>machine and can confirm that it is OT1 (context's `default' encoding)
>>only. The easiest way to fix this for you is to return to the
>>typescripts and make sure they say:
>>  [encoding=default] instead of
>>  [encoding=ec]
>>
>>
>>
>ok, I did not know that OT1 is equal default.

It's another FAQ...

>>As you are probably aware, there are issues with hyphenation and the OT1
>>encoding. However, the TFMs and free Type 1 glyphs for this font simply
>>are not around.
>>
>>
>>
>in the package hfbright there are pfb included (I think this are the
>type 1). tfms are also on my system

Yes, on my system, the TFMs are actually from the CMBright package, and
the map file redirects to the HFBright Type1/.pfb files.

>I don't know much about hyphenantion, but why are there problems?

There's a little bit of explanation here:
<http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Encodings_and_Regimes>
...but basically, TeX's hyphenation trickery doesn't know how to deal
with composite characters (when it puts an " atop a u [pardon my 7-bit
rendition]). If a word contains a composite "u as a character, it won't
break. If it contains a full ü, TeX can deal with it.

>
>>May I suggest looking at the new Latin Modern light sans fonts for text,
>>and using hfbright for mathematics only?
>>
>>
>>
>Propably you are right and I should go the easy way and simply use an
>other font. Do you know if there is a ready package for the Latin Modern
>light sans?

Um, disregard that. I must have hallucinated that font. It doesn't
exist. Sorry.

adam
--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
 Adam T. Lindsay, Computing Dept.     atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
 Lancaster University, InfoLab21        +44(0)1524/510.514
 Lancaster, LA1 4WA, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/510.492
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Re: German

[Hans Hagen]

Adam Lindsay wrote:

>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>Propably you are right and I should go the easy way and simply use an 
>>other font. Do you know if there is a ready package for the Latin Modern 
>>light sans?
>>    
>>
>Um, disregard that. I must have hallucinated that font. It doesn't
>exist. Sorry.
>  
>
well, there since the monospaces is a sans, and since there is a light monospaced in latin modern it may have been some subconscious mix up 

Hans 


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