[t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Paul Menzel]

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Dear Philipp and ConTeXt folks,


what needs to be done, that the module t-rst [1] can be installed using
the following command.

	$ ./first-setup.sh --extras="t-rst"

(I. e. how can this module be included into the ConTeXt Minimals
distribution?)


Thanks,

Paul


[1] https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-rst

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Sun, May 1, 2011 at 12:18, Paul Menzel wrote:
> Dear Philipp and ConTeXt folks,
>
> what needs to be done, that the module t-rst [1] can be installed using
> the following command.
>
>        $ ./first-setup.sh --extras="t-rst"

1a. Somebody needs to check/confirmed that it is well-formed.
1b. At least somebody needs to find it useful and request it (which
you just did; should it also be added to TeX Live?).
2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).

Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
into TeX Live).

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Peter Münster]

Mojca Miklavec <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> writes:

> 2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
> put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).

Indeed, very painful ... ;)

I'm sure, that the module authors would like to run just one simple
command (e.g. "make contrib-upload") to update their modules in the
distribution, instead of filling a form in a web-browser.

Suggestion: to make it easy and fast, why not just add a new
svn directory to foudry.supelec.fr, and every author gets a
sub-directory, where they can upload their modules in TDS format. And
the first-setup.sh would just pull the modules from there.
Thus the authors can keep using bitbucket, github, etc. for their daily
work, and upload a new version by means of a new makefile-target.

-- 
           Peter
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Sun, May 1, 2011 at 14:33, Peter Münster wrote:
>
> Suggestion: to make it easy and fast, why not just add a new
> svn directory to foudry.supelec.fr, and every author gets a
> sub-directory, where they can upload their modules in TDS format. And
> the first-setup.sh would just pull the modules from there.
> Thus the authors can keep using bitbucket, github, etc. for their daily
> work, and upload a new version by means of a new makefile-target.

We'll continue the discussion with Taco today.

(I have set up SVN repository also on the garden, but whatever option
is chosen, it would be great to keep everything at a single place at
the end.)

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Aditya Mahajan]

On Sun, 1 May 2011, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> 1a. Somebody needs to check/confirmed that it is well-formed.

To clarify, by well-formed you mean that it follows TDS; not the quality 
of the module, right?

Aditya
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Sun, May 1, 2011 at 16:14, Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> On Sun, 1 May 2011, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
>>
>> 1a. Somebody needs to check/confirmed that it is well-formed.
>
> To clarify, by well-formed you mean that it follows TDS; not the quality of
> the module, right?

Preferrably both. However TDS and some other fixed rules are easy to
check. Checking the quality is much harder.

Proper form of a module is a requirement.
A decent level of quality is desired.

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Philipp Gesang]

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Hi Paul, Mojca & others,

sorry for the late answer, I was cut off from the list for a
couple of days.

On 2011-05-01 <13:18:05>, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> On Sun, May 1, 2011 at 12:18, Paul Menzel wrote:
> > Dear Philipp and ConTeXt folks,
> >
> > what needs to be done, that the module t-rst [1] can be installed using
> > the following command.
> >
> >        $ ./first-setup.sh --extras="t-rst"
> 
> 1a. Somebody needs to check/confirmed that it is well-formed.

New version 0.3 conforms with the module/namespacing guidelines.
(Thanks to Wolfgang for his valuable suggestions.) As to the
quality … I’ll be happy to apply any patches.

> 1b. At least somebody needs to find it useful and request it (which
> you just did; should it also be added to TeX Live?).

What would the inclusion into TL imply?

> 2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
> put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).

If it’s possible now I’d try it asap.

> Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
> inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
> into TeX Live).

Looks like context needs a package manager. (Something like
Arch’s PKGBUILDs, stored on the garden, could simplify the
minimals’ installation procedure a great deal.)

Best regards
Philipp

PS: Paul, thanks for the patches (was the same diff twice,
    wasn’t it?).



> Mojca
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
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> 
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Aditya Mahajan]

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On Wed, 4 May 2011, Philipp Gesang wrote:

> Looks like context needs a package manager. (Something like
> Arch’s PKGBUILDs, stored on the garden, could simplify the
> minimals’ installation procedure a great deal.)

https://github.com/adityam/context-pkgbuild

(but this only installs the modules available with --extras=all).

Aditya

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Philipp Gesang]

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On 2011-05-04 <18:02:44>, Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> On Wed, 4 May 2011, Philipp Gesang wrote:
> 
> >Looks like context needs a package manager. (Something like
> >Arch’s PKGBUILDs, stored on the garden, could simplify the
> >minimals’ installation procedure a great deal.)
> 
> https://github.com/adityam/context-pkgbuild
> 
> (but this only installs the modules available with --extras=all).

Yes, I know and though I prefer the minimals installer, you
already got my vote.

Would be no problem to write module pkgbuilds for arch. But the
minimals need to be cross platform. (Pkgbuilds use bash syntax --
however, context already brings its own cross-platform
interpreter, namely lua. Maybe the module repositories should
provide installation directives, written as a lua table, that
could then be fed to texlua? The installer would thus 1.
clone/pull the repo to somewhere safe (file integrity check done
implicitly by git/hg); 2. “dofile” the install file and 3. move
the files to their designated paths; possibly 4. build the
documentation. (Module dependencies could make this all a lot
more difficult in the end.))

tl;dr  lua might help.

Philipp



> 
> Aditya

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 19:00, Philipp Gesang wrote:
>
>> 1b. At least somebody needs to find it useful and request it (which
>> you just did; should it also be added to TeX Live?).
>
> What would the inclusion into TL imply?

That people using TeX Live could also install it.

>> 2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
>> put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).
>
> If it’s possible now I’d try it asap.

Did you have any problems? In case you did, please contact Patrick.

>> Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
>> inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
>> into TeX Live).
>
> Looks like context needs a package manager.

Do you have any suggestion how it should look like and how it should
work? mtx-update is kind-of package manager, but I admit that I miss
some GUI (but then again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Aditya Mahajan]

>> Looks like context needs a package manager.
>
> Do you have any suggestion how it should look like and how it should
> work? mtx-update is kind-of package manager, but I admit that I miss
> some GUI (but then again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).

Similar to ruby gems or perl cpan or even texlive tlmgr. Ideally, a user 
should be able to do:

package-manager search "keyword"

and get a list of modules and

package-manager install "modulename"

and be able to install the module (without updating the whole 
installation). Additional niceties like

package-manager make "module"

for preparing a zip file that can be uploaded to contextgarden will be 
nice.

ctxtools does provide the last functionality, but you need a tpm file for 
that, while tlcontrib wants a module to be submitted without a tpm file.

Aditya
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Marco]

On 2011-05-06 Mojca Miklavec <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Looks like context needs a package manager.
>
> [...] but I admit that I miss some GUI (but then again I
> have no idea how to write a portable GUI).

There are several possibilities,  GTK+ is well documented,
ported to  many platforms and operating  systems (However,
maybe not to all, ConTeXt supports)  and has Lua bindings.


Marco


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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Philipp Gesang]

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Hi Mojca & all,

On 2011-05-06 <20:55:59>, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> On Wed, May 4, 2011 at 19:00, Philipp Gesang wrote:
> >
> >> 1b. At least somebody needs to find it useful and request it (which
> >> you just did; should it also be added to TeX Live?).
> >
> > What would the inclusion into TL imply?
> 
> That people using TeX Live could also install it.

True, but I was, rather selfishly, thinking about what it would
imply for the module author. Permanent maintenance of one release
over a year? Is it really worth it? After all, most people who
come to this list asking for help with their TL context are
advised to switch to the minimals.

> >> 2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
> >> put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).
> >
> > If it’s possible now I’d try it asap.
> 
> Did you have any problems? In case you did, please contact Patrick.

I did have problems about a year ago. Probably tomorrow---
depending on the weather---I’ll add an xml interface file and
comment the module source. After that I’ll give the upload
another shot.

> >> Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
> >> inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
> >> into TeX Live).
> >
> > Looks like context needs a package manager.

> Do you have any suggestion how it should look like and how it should
> work? mtx-update is kind-of package manager, but I admit that I miss
> some GUI (but then again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).

The GUI would be the last thing I’d start worrying about.
Basically it would have to receive a list of locations and the
respective VCS, like for instance: ::

  t-filter,       git, https://github.com/adityam/filter.git 
  transliterator, hg,  https://bitbucket.org/phg/transliterator

Then it would call the VCS to checkout the tip (or latest tag or
whatever). Each should have a “.install.lua” in the base dir
containing instructions about where the files should go. (Best
thing is, probably, that no compilation is necessary because
everything’s plain text.) A local register could contain version
information, filenames, paths etc. of the modules installed.

But that’s just musings as I don’t have a clue what restrictions
other OS might put on file attributes (does luafs get rid of
these?). Someone with experience on all the main three platforms
could really help here.

Philipp


> 
> Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Wolfgang Schuster]

Am 07.05.2011 um 12:19 schrieb Philipp Gesang:

> Hi Mojca & all,
> 
>>> What would the inclusion into TL imply?
>> 
>> That people using TeX Live could also install it.
> 
> True, but I was, rather selfishly, thinking about what it would
> imply for the module author. Permanent maintenance of one release
> over a year? Is it really worth it? After all, most people who
> come to this list asking for help with their TL context are
> advised to switch to the minimals.

The problem with texlive inclusion is that you can’t use
new features from context which aren’t available in the texlive
version, e.g. \definenamespace was added after the texlive 2010
freeze and therefore you can’t use the command for modules
which are on ctan and texlive.

>>>> Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
>>>> inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
>>>> into TeX Live).
>>> 
>>> Looks like context needs a package manager.
> 
>> Do you have any suggestion how it should look like and how it should
>> work? mtx-update is kind-of package manager, but I admit that I miss
>> some GUI (but then again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).
> 
> The GUI would be the last thing I’d start worrying about.
> Basically it would have to receive a list of locations and the
> respective VCS, like for instance: ::
> 
>  t-filter,       git, https://github.com/adityam/filter.git 
>  transliterator, hg,  https://bitbucket.org/phg/transliterator
> 
> Then it would call the VCS to checkout the tip (or latest tag or
> whatever). Each should have a “.install.lua” in the base dir
> containing instructions about where the files should go. (Best
> thing is, probably, that no compilation is necessary because
> everything’s plain text.) A local register could contain version
> information, filenames, paths etc. of the modules installed.

+1

But when we have should a file it shouldn’t be requires
to have a TDS for the project files because it’s a mess
to work on a module when you have so many subdirectories.

When you take a look at one of my modules [1] you can see
that all my source files under “files” directory and i create
the zip with the correct paths from a tex file. When you can
something similar with Lua and a text file everything
is perfect.

[1] https://bitbucket.org/wolfs/annotation/src

Wolfgang

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Philipp Gesang]

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On 2011-05-07 <13:23:18>, Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
> 
> Am 07.05.2011 um 12:19 schrieb Philipp Gesang:
> 
> > Hi Mojca & all,
> > 
> >>> What would the inclusion into TL imply?
> >> 
> >> That people using TeX Live could also install it.
> > 
> > True, but I was, rather selfishly, thinking about what it would
> > imply for the module author. Permanent maintenance of one release
> > over a year? Is it really worth it? After all, most people who
> > come to this list asking for help with their TL context are
> > advised to switch to the minimals.
> 
> The problem with texlive inclusion is that you can’t use
> new features from context which aren’t available in the texlive
> version, e.g. \definenamespace was added after the texlive 2010
> freeze and therefore you can’t use the command for modules
> which are on ctan and texlive.
> 
> >>>> Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
> >>>> inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
> >>>> into TeX Live).
> >>> 
> >>> Looks like context needs a package manager.
> > 
> >> Do you have any suggestion how it should look like and how it should
> >> work? mtx-update is kind-of package manager, but I admit that I miss
> >> some GUI (but then again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).
> > 
> > The GUI would be the last thing I’d start worrying about.
> > Basically it would have to receive a list of locations and the
> > respective VCS, like for instance: ::
> > 
> >  t-filter,       git, https://github.com/adityam/filter.git 
> >  transliterator, hg,  https://bitbucket.org/phg/transliterator
> > 
> > Then it would call the VCS to checkout the tip (or latest tag or
> > whatever). Each should have a “.install.lua” in the base dir
> > containing instructions about where the files should go. (Best
> > thing is, probably, that no compilation is necessary because
> > everything’s plain text.) A local register could contain version
> > information, filenames, paths etc. of the modules installed.
> 
> +1
> 
> But when we have should a file it shouldn’t be requires
> to have a TDS for the project files because it’s a mess
> to work on a module when you have so many subdirectories.
> 
> When you take a look at one of my modules [1] you can see
> that all my source files under “files” directory and i create
> the zip with the correct paths from a tex file. When you can
> something similar with Lua and a text file everything
> is perfect.
> 
> [1] https://bitbucket.org/wolfs/annotation/src

Yes, I know that. But symlinks to a testing directory do the
trick as well; but that’s another OS specific matter … The
install instructions would probably have to look like

  [1] = { "./subdir/file1.ext", "target/dir/in/ctx/tree/file1.ext", "md5sum" },

So it would work either way. (The md5 could be redundand due to
VCS already hashing stuff.)

Philipp


> 
> Wolfgang
> 
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
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> 
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 21:08, Marco wrote:
> On 2011-05-06 Mojca Miklavec wrote:
>
>> > Looks like context needs a package manager.
>>
>> [...] but I admit that I miss some GUI (but then again I
>> have no idea how to write a portable GUI).
>
> There are several possibilities,  GTK+ is well documented,
> ported to  many platforms and operating  systems (However,
> maybe not to all, ConTeXt supports)  and has Lua bindings.

If you can prepare a very simple example and explain how to compile it
on windows, mac and windows ...

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 12:19, Philipp Gesang wrote:
>
>> > What would the inclusion into TL imply?
>>
>> That people using TeX Live could also install it.
>
> True, but I was, rather selfishly, thinking about what it would
> imply for the module author. Permanent maintenance of one release
> over a year? Is it really worth it? After all, most people who
> come to this list asking for help with their TL context are
> advised to switch to the minimals.

To me personally it doesn't imply anything special. When I update the
module for minimals, it is automatically updated on CTAN for MikTeX
and TeX Live as well.

It is true that my module is not using much of bleeding edge
technology; but when it does, I do not care about TeX Live's ConTeXt
compatibility too much. Still, having the module in TeX Live means
that when I occasionally do use TeX Live, the modules I might need are
available there as well.

>> >> 2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
>> >> put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).
>> >
>> > If it’s possible now I’d try it asap.
>>
>> Did you have any problems? In case you did, please contact Patrick.
>
> I did have problems about a year ago. Probably tomorrow---
> depending on the weather---I’ll add an xml interface file and
> comment the module source. After that I’ll give the upload
> another shot.

I keep my finders crossed for you. :)

>> >> Once 1 and 2 are met, I just add a single line to sources that trigger
>> >> inclusion of the module to minimals (and a separate one for inclusion
>> >> into TeX Live).
>> >
>> > Looks like context needs a package manager.
>
>> Do you have any suggestion how it should look like and how it should
>> work? mtx-update is kind-of package manager, but I admit that I miss
>> some GUI (but then again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).
>
> The GUI would be the last thing I’d start worrying about.
> Basically it would have to receive a list of locations and the
> respective VCS, like for instance: ::
>
>  t-filter,       git, https://github.com/adityam/filter.git
>  transliterator, hg,  https://bitbucket.org/phg/transliterator
>
> Then it would call the VCS to checkout the tip (or latest tag or
> whatever). Each should have a “.install.lua” in the base dir
> containing instructions about where the files should go. (Best
> thing is, probably, that no compilation is necessary because
> everything’s plain text.) A local register could contain version
> information, filenames, paths etc. of the modules installed.

All the needed modules are already in the garden. (Or are supposed to
be on the garden at least.) It is way easier to maintain them all at a
single source and then all users can fetch them from that single
source than to redirect each user to repository for which one might
not even have the necessary software installed (missing hg binary for
example).

It is true that at the moment you cannot switch to an older version of
the module, but that is a slightly unrelated issue that has to be
solved somewhat globaly (it is usually a much more serious problem
that one cannot roll back ConTeXt version).

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Taco Hoekwater]

On 05/07/2011 05:36 PM, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 21:08, Marco wrote:
>> On 2011-05-06 Mojca Miklavec wrote:
>>
>>>> Looks like context needs a package manager.
>>>
>>> [...] but I admit that I miss some GUI (but then again I
>>> have no idea how to write a portable GUI).
>>
>> There are several possibilities,  GTK+ is well documented,
>> ported to  many platforms and operating  systems (However,
>> maybe not to all, ConTeXt supports)  and has Lua bindings.
>
> If you can prepare a very simple example and explain how to compile it
> on windows, mac and windows ...

Installing the *right* GTK+ version on macosx is quite a challenge.
The texlive way of perl/Tk is much more portable, even though it
re-introduces perl to the mix.

Another option could be to use a http browser, using Hans' mtxrun web
server and client? That is pure lua, but of course it is not available
until after installation of context.

Best wishes,
Taco

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Marco]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 974 bytes --]

On 2011-05-07 Mojca Miklavec <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 21:08, Marco wrote:
>
> > On 2011-05-06 Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> >
> >> > Looks like context needs a package manager.
> >>
> >> [...]  but I  admit that  I miss  some GUI  (but then
> >> again I have no idea how to write a portable GUI).
> >
> > There   are  several   possibilities,  GTK+   is  well
> > documented,  ported to  many  platforms and  operating
> > systems (However, maybe not  to all, ConTeXt supports)
> > and has Lua bindings.
>
> If you can prepare a very simple example and explain how
> to compile it on windows, mac and windows ...

A simple example  of a GUI is attached and  may serve as a
starting  point (questions  to  the  example maybe  better
off-list, since it's not at all ConTeXt related).

I don't  know which  packages are  required on  windows or
macos. On  linux and solaris  it is sufficient  to install
GTK and the lua-gtk bindings.


Marco

[-- Warning: decoded text below may be mangled, UTF-8 assumed --]
[-- Attachment #2: gtkgui.lua --]
[-- Type: text/x-lua, Size: 3346 bytes --]

#! /usr/bin/env lua

Mainwin = {}
Mainwin.__index = Mainwin

List = {
    'Just',
    'some',
    'random',
    'stuff',
    'for',
    'demonstration',
}

local function UpdateProgressBar(bar)
    local oldFrac = gtk.progress_bar_get_fraction(bar)
    local frac    = 1/#List

    if (oldFrac + frac >= 1)
    then
        frac = 0
        oldFrac = 1
        gtk.main_quit()
    end

    gtk.progress_bar_set_fraction(bar, oldFrac + frac)
end

function Progressbar()
    local progress = gtk.progress_bar_new()
    gtk.progress_bar_set_text(progress, "Processing…")
    gtk.progress_bar_set_fraction(progress, 0)
    return progress
end

function Mainwin.new()
    local self = {}
    setmetatable(self, Mainwin)

    -- Set main window size, title, …
    self.w = gtk.window_new(gtk.WINDOW_TOPLEVEL)
    self.w:set_title("My Program")
    self.w:connect('destroy', gtk.main_quit)
    self.w:set_default_size(400, 400)

    -- Vertical box
    local vbox = gtk.vbox_new(false, 10)
    vbox:set_border_width(5)
    self.w:add(vbox)

    -- Tool bar
    local toolbar = gtk.toolbar_new()
    vbox:pack_start(toolbar, false, true, 0)

    -- Tool bar: items
    local items = {
        { "gtk-go-forward",  StartProcessing },
        { "SEPARATOR", nil },
        { "gtk-quit", gtk.main_quit } }

    -- Tool bar: add items to tool bar
    for _, item in pairs(items) do
        local stock   = item[1]
        local handler = item[2]
        local button, id

        if stock == 'SEPARATOR' then
            button = gtk.separator_tool_item_new()
        else
            button = gtk.tool_button_new_from_stock(stock)
            id = button:connect("clicked", handler, self)
        end
        toolbar:insert(button, -1)
    end

    -- Progress bar
    progressbar = Progressbar()
    vbox:pack_start(progressbar, false, true, 0)

    -- Scroll window
    local scrollwindow = gtk.scrolled_window_new(nil, nil)
    vbox:pack_start(scrollwindow, true, true, 0)

    -- Tree view
    local treeview = gtk.tree_view_new()
    scrollwindow:add(treeview)

    -- create store
    local store = gtk.tree_store_new(3,
        glib.TYPE_INT,          -- [0] some ID
        glib.TYPE_STRING,       -- [1] path / file name
        glib.TYPE_STRING)       -- [2] Status
    treeview:set_model(store)

    -- column with text
    local r, c
    r = gtk.cell_renderer_text_new()

    c = gtk.tree_view_column_new_with_attributes("File", r, "text", 1, nil)
    treeview:append_column(c)

    c = gtk.tree_view_column_new_with_attributes("Status", r, "text", 2, nil)
    treeview:append_column(c)

    -- add some items
    local iter1 = gtk.new "TreeIter"

    for i = 1, #List
    do
        store:append(iter1, nil)
        store:set(iter1, 0, i, 1, List[i], -1)
    end

    self.w:show_all()
    return self
end



function StartProcessing()
    DoStartProcessing_c = gnome.closure(DoStartProcessing)
    glib.timeout_add(200,
                     DoStartProcessing_c,
                     DoStartProcessing)
end

function DoStartProcessing()
    UpdateProgressBar(progressbar)
    return true
end


------------------
-- Main Program --
------------------

require "gtk"
mainwin = Mainwin.new()
gtk.main()

[-- Attachment #3: Type: text/plain, Size: 485 bytes --]

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Marco]

On 2011-05-08 Taco Hoekwater <taco@elvenkind.com> wrote:

> >> There  are   several  possibilities,  GTK+   is  well
> >> documented,  ported to  many platforms  and operating
> >> systems (However, maybe not to all, ConTeXt supports)
> >> and has Lua bindings.
> >
> > If you can  prepare a very simple  example and explain
> > how to compile it on windows, mac and windows ...
>
> Installing the *right* GTK+ version on macosx is quite a
> challenge.

I don't know, I never used macosx.

> The texlive way  of perl/Tk is much  more portable, even
> though it re-introduces perl to the mix.

I don't think it's a good  idea to introduce perl. The way
to go  is to get  rid of  the hotchpotch of  languages and
implement everything in lua, if  possible. If we prefer TK
over GTK why not use the lua Tk bindings?


Marco


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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Arthur Reutenauer]

> Another option could be to use a http browser, using Hans' mtxrun web
> server and client? That is pure lua, but of course it is not available
> until after installation of context.

  We could bootstrap the system by first downloading only the necessary
pieces, like is done for the Minimals.  It should only need half a dozen
files.  But all that needs to be actually developed, of course.

	Arthur
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Hans Hagen]

On 8-5-2011 4:56, Arthur Reutenauer wrote:
>> Another option could be to use a http browser, using Hans' mtxrun web
>> server and client? That is pure lua, but of course it is not available
>> until after installation of context.
>
>    We could bootstrap the system by first downloading only the necessary
> pieces, like is done for the Minimals.  It should only need half a dozen
> files.  But all that needs to be actually developed, of course.

can someone remind me what problem we're trying to solve here?

Hans

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 19:36, Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:
> On 8-5-2011 4:56, Arthur Reutenauer wrote:
>>>
>>> Another option could be to use a http browser, using Hans' mtxrun web
>>> server and client? That is pure lua, but of course it is not available
>>> until after installation of context.
>>
>>   We could bootstrap the system by first downloading only the necessary
>> pieces, like is done for the Minimals.  It should only need half a dozen
>> files.  But all that needs to be actually developed, of course.
>
> can someone remind me what problem we're trying to solve here?

Having a GUI installer for the minimals (to make it more user-friendly
and enable the user to choose what modules and fonts to install).

Mojca
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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Philipp Gesang]

[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 872 bytes --]

On 2011-05-07 <17:45:47>, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 12:19, Philipp Gesang wrote:
> 
> >> >> 2. Until we do something about it, it would be very very desirable to
> >> >> put it to modules.contextgarden.net (I know that it is painful).
> >> >
> >> > If it’s possible now I’d try it asap.
> >>
> >> Did you have any problems? In case you did, please contact Patrick.
> >
> > I did have problems about a year ago. Probably tomorrow---
> > depending on the weather---I’ll add an xml interface file and
> > comment the module source. After that I’ll give the upload
> > another shot.
> 
> I keep my finders crossed for you. :)

Looks like it worked now: http://modules.contextgarden.net/rst

Have fun,
Philipp

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Pontus Lurcock]

On Sun 08 May 2011, Marco wrote:

> If we prefer TK over GTK why not use the lua Tk bindings?

When I saw this discussion starting I googled the Lua Tk bindings, and
it turned out [1] that they apparently haven't been updated since
1998. A shame, since Tk is usually a good bet for easy cross-platform
GUIs.

[1] http://www.tecgraf.puc-rio.br/~celes/tklua/

Pont
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GUI for minimals WAS: Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Marco]

On 2011-05-09 Pontus Lurcock <pont@talvi.net> wrote:

> On Sun 08 May 2011, Marco wrote:
>
> > If  we prefer  TK  over GTK  why not  use  the lua  Tk
> > bindings?
>
> When I saw this discussion starting I googled the Lua Tk
> bindings,  and it  turned out  [1] that  they apparently
> haven't been updated since 1998.

What about  ltcltk [1],  it's from  2010? However  I never
used  it,  I just  did  some  simple  GUIs with  the  GTK+
binding.

[1] http://www.tset.de/ltcltk/

Marco


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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Marco]

On 2011-05-08 Mojca Miklavec <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 19:36, Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl>
> wrote:
>
> > On 8-5-2011 4:56, Arthur Reutenauer wrote:
> >
> >>> Another option could be to use a http browser, using
> >>> Hans'  mtxrun web  server and  client? That  is pure
> >>> lua, but of  course it is not  available until after
> >>> installation of context.
> >>
> >>   We could bootstrap  the system by first downloading
> >> only  the  necessary pieces,  like  is  done for  the
> >> Minimals.  It  should only  need half a  dozen files.
> >>  But  all that  needs  to be  actually developed,  of
> >> course.
> >
> > can  someone remind  me what  problem we're  trying to
> > solve here?
>
> Having a GUI installer for the minimals (to make it more
> user-friendly and enable the user to choose what modules
> and fonts to install).

Just a (maybe stupid) idea:

What about making the  existing windows GUI install and/or
update  all available  modules/fonts,  since most  windows
users don't care about a few hundred MiB disk space.

Second,  creating  a  repository  for  Debian/Ubuntu  that
enables  Linux users  to  install the  minimals using  the
system package manager. It's easy  to create a package for
the modules.

I have no idea how  package management works for MacOS, if
something  like  repositories  exist or  how  software  is
installed/updated.

And leave the existing  interface for the other platforms,
since  the vast  majority  uses either  Linux, Windows  or
MacOS.

Marco


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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On May 8, 2011, at 11:00 PM, Marco wrote:

>> Having a GUI installer for the minimals (to make it more
>> user-friendly and enable the user to choose what modules
>> and fonts to install).
> 
> Just a (maybe stupid) idea:
> 
> What about making the  existing windows GUI install and/or
> update  all available  modules/fonts,  since most  windows
> users don't care about a few hundred MiB disk space.
> 
> Second,  creating  a  repository  for  Debian/Ubuntu  that
> enables  Linux users  to  install the  minimals using  the
> system package manager. It's easy  to create a package for
> the modules.
> 
> I have no idea how  package management works for MacOS, if
> something  like  repositories  exist or  how  software  is
> installed/updated.
> 
> And leave the existing  interface for the other platforms,
> since  the vast  majority  uses either  Linux, Windows  or
> MacOS.

Just a few thoughts:

1. linux ≠ ubuntu/debian. Maintaining a repository for all different linux distros in their different package formats would be a nightmare.

2. Maintaining a cross-platform GUI is incredibly difficult. gtk is an absolute non-starter on OS X. 

3. Resources are limited. I would rather they go into development of luatex and mkiv then into eye-candy for mouse-pushers.

4. We now get reports from people (not necessarily, but sometomes newbies) going "I ran command X, and the output was Y." With a GUI we get: "I pushed the button, you know the one with the letters on it, and nothing happened." GUIs have a tendency to hide useful information, making debugging all but impossible. (I sometimes look at comp.text.tex on usenet - the number of people who confuse their editor and its shiny interface with the underlying TeX engine is staggering; the same would happen here).

5. Even if it's "easy" to create a debian package for the modules, who's going to create and maintain it? 

6. Offering a GUI sends out a wrong message to new users: it pretends that this is just something that will work the same way as their word processor or office program works. But once people actually want to do useful things, they need to learn a minimum of coding techniques. Users will then feel deceived because the shiny GUI made them believe they could just write away and click buttons.

In sum: I see no compelling reason in favor of, but many important reasons against such an installer.

Thomas

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Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Marco]

On 2011-05-08 "Thomas A. Schmitz" <thomas.schmitz@uni-bonn.de> wrote:

> 
> On May 8, 2011, at 11:00 PM, Marco wrote:
> 
> >> Having a GUI installer for the minimals (to make it more
> >> user-friendly and enable the user to choose what modules
> >> and fonts to install).
> > 
> > Just a (maybe stupid) idea:
> > 
> > What about making the  existing windows GUI install and/or
> > update  all available  modules/fonts,  since most  windows
> > users don't care about a few hundred MiB disk space.
> > 
> > Second,  creating  a  repository  for  Debian/Ubuntu  that
> > enables  Linux users  to  install the  minimals using  the
> > system package manager. It's easy  to create a package for
> > the modules.
> > 
> > I have no idea how  package management works for MacOS, if
> > something  like  repositories  exist or  how  software  is
> > installed/updated.
> > 
> > And leave the existing  interface for the other platforms,
> > since  the vast  majority  uses either  Linux, Windows  or
> > MacOS.
> 
> Just a few thoughts:
>
> 1. linux  ≠ ubuntu/debian. Maintaining a  repository for
> all different  linux distros in their  different package
> formats would be a nightmare.

ACK.

> 2.  Maintaining  a   cross-platform  GUI  is  incredibly
> difficult. gtk is an absolute non-starter on OS X.

If you  say so.  But anyway, we  should not  discuss about
which GUI toolkit  we use, since it is not  at all decided
that anything will change at this point.

> 3. Resources  are limited. I  would rather they  go into
> development of  luatex and mkiv then  into eye-candy for
> mouse-pushers.
>
> 4. We now get reports  from people (not necessarily, but
> sometomes  newbies)  going "I  ran  command  X, and  the
> output  was  Y."  With  a  GUI we  get:  "I  pushed  the
> button, you  know the  one with the  letters on  it, and
> nothing happened."  GUIs have a tendency  to hide useful
> information,  making debugging  all  but impossible.  (I
> sometimes look  at comp.text.tex on usenet  - the number
> of  people  who  confuse  their  editor  and  its  shiny
> interface with the underlying  TeX engine is staggering;
> the same would happen here).

I   agree.    My   thought   was   the    following:   The
installation/update of ConTeXt is  not integrated into the
systems default methods. How  often do we get installation
help  requests on  the mailing  list (on  every platform)!
Supporting the  default installation/update method  of the
operating system would  not necessarily need a  GUI and be
easy for the users.

> 5. Even  if it's "easy"  to create a debian  package for
> the modules, who's going to create and maintain it?

The creation of the package is scriptable. When the module
developer uploads/updates  a module  a (not  yet existing)
script is called that creates the Debian package, which is
saved in  the repository. Of course  a scriptable solution
breaks when e.g. dependencies are not met.

> 6.  Offering a  GUI sends  out  a wrong  message to  new
> users: it pretends that this is just something that will
> work  the same  way as  their word  processor or  office
> program  works.  But once  people  actually  want to  do
> useful things,  they need to  learn a minimum  of coding
> techniques. Users  will then  feel deceived  because the
> shiny GUI made  them believe they could  just write away
> and click buttons.
>
> In sum: I see no compelling reason in favor of, but many
> important reasons against such an installer.

As said before: Supporting the native package installation
mechanisms of  the major OSs/distributions would  be a big
help. For the rest the present mechanisms work fine.

Marco


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Re: GUI for minimals WAS: Re: [t-rst] inclusion into Minimals, i. e. installation using `./first-setup.sh --extras='t-rst'`

[Taco Hoekwater]

On 05/08/2011 10:07 PM, Marco wrote:
> On 2011-05-09 Pontus Lurcock<pont@talvi.net>  wrote:
>
>> On Sun 08 May 2011, Marco wrote:
>>
>>> If  we prefer  TK  over GTK  why not  use  the lua  Tk
>>> bindings?
>>
>> When I saw this discussion starting I googled the Lua Tk
>> bindings,  and it  turned out  [1] that  they apparently
>> haven't been updated since 1998.
>
> What about  ltcltk [1],  it's from  2010? However  I never
> used  it,  I just  did  some  simple  GUIs with  the  GTK+
> binding.

There is a real, serious problem with the predictability of GTK+
installations on macosx. It feels like each version of macosx in
either 32 or 64 bit needs a different version of the bundle, and
on top of that it hard to predict which one is needed.

Installation of any GTK+ bundle always appears to work, but if you
have the wrong one the runtime crashes.

Best wishes,
Taco

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