Are nested sections possible?

Are nested sections possible?

[mica]

Greetings,

Is it possible to have

\starttext

\startchapter
Hey a chapter!
\startsection
something.one
\startsection
someting.one.one
\startsection
something.one.one.one
\stopsection
\stopsection
\stopsection


\stopchapter

\stoptext

render as:

1. Hey a chapter!
1.1 something.one
1.1.1 something.one.one
1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one

Thanks,
Mica

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Re: Are nested sections possible?

[josephcanedo]

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Hello,


Normally for this purpose you’d use subsection, subsubsection etc … I guess.



Best regards


Joseph





From: mica@silentumbrella.com
Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎March‎ ‎11‎, ‎2016 ‎9‎:‎08‎ ‎AM
To: ntg-context@ntg.nl





Greetings,

Is it possible to have

\starttext

\startchapter
Hey a chapter!
\startsection
something.one
\startsection
someting.one.one
\startsection
something.one.one.one
\stopsection
\stopsection
\stopsection


\stopchapter

\stoptext

render as:

1. Hey a chapter!
1.1 something.one
1.1.1 something.one.one
1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one

Thanks,
Mica

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___________________________________________________________________________________

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Pablo Rodriguez]

On 03/11/2016 09:08 AM, mica@silentumbrella.com wrote:
> Greetings,
> 
> Is it possible to have
> [...] 
> render as:
> 
> 1. Hey a chapter!
> 1.1 something.one
> 1.1.1 something.one.one
> 1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one

Sorry, Mica, but which is the gain in nesting sections (whether possible
or not) over using subsections and subsubsections?

I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry, it
must be my fault.)

Let me know what I am missing. Best wishes,

Pablo
-- 
http://www.ousia.tk
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Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Mica Semrick]

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Hi Pablo,

Sorry for the brevity of my original message, it is quite late.

I'm working on styling an XML dialect, where nesting can go, and often does quite deep, and several different section level elements can be allowed to nest within each other. If nested sections were possible, I wouldn't have to write code to try and figure out how deep a nested is; ConTeXt would know and would number the sections accordingly.

-m 

On March 11, 2016 12:36:01 AM PST, Pablo Rodriguez <oinos@gmx.es> wrote:
>On 03/11/2016 09:08 AM, mica@silentumbrella.com wrote:
>> Greetings,
>> 
>> Is it possible to have
>> [...] 
>> render as:
>> 
>> 1. Hey a chapter!
>> 1.1 something.one
>> 1.1.1 something.one.one
>> 1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one
>
>Sorry, Mica, but which is the gain in nesting sections (whether
>possible
>or not) over using subsections and subsubsections?
>
>I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry, it
>must be my fault.)
>
>Let me know what I am missing. Best wishes,
>
>Pablo
>-- 
>http://www.ousia.tk
>___________________________________________________________________________________
>If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry
>to the Wiki!
>
>maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
>http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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>wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
>___________________________________________________________________________________

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Andreas Schneider]

You probably want automatic levels.
Take a look at strc-lev.mkvi.

\startsectionlevel[title=outer]
\startsectionlevel[title=inner]
\startsectionlevel[title=yet another]

\stopsectionlevel
\stopsectionlevel
\stopsectionlevel

If you need more levels than the default (which ranges from chapter to 
subsubsubsubsection), you may need to define your own using 
\definesectionlevels.

Best regards
Andreas


Am 2016-03-11 09:08, schrieb mica@silentumbrella.com:
> Greetings,
> 
> Is it possible to have
> 
> \starttext
> 
> \startchapter
> Hey a chapter!
> \startsection
> something.one
> \startsection
> someting.one.one
> \startsection
> something.one.one.one
> \stopsection
> \stopsection
> \stopsection
> 
> 
> \stopchapter
> 
> \stoptext
> 
> render as:
> 
> 1. Hey a chapter!
> 1.1 something.one
> 1.1.1 something.one.one
> 1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one
> 
> Thanks,
> Mica
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Hans Hagen]

On 3/11/2016 9:08 AM, mica@silentumbrella.com wrote:
> Greetings,
>
> Is it possible to have
>
> \starttext
>
> \startchapter
> Hey a chapter!
> \startsection
> something.one
> \startsection
> someting.one.one
> \startsection
> something.one.one.one
> \stopsection
> \stopsection
> \stopsection
>
>
> \stopchapter
>
> \stoptext
>
> render as:
>
> 1. Hey a chapter!
> 1.1 something.one
> 1.1.1 something.one.one
> 1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one

do you mean something like

sections/levels-001.tex
sections/levels-002.tex

in the test suite?

\starttext

\startstructurelevel [title=first top level]

     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
                 test
             \stopstructurelevel
         \stopstructurelevel
     \stopstructurelevel

     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
                 test
             \stopstructurelevel
         \stopstructurelevel
     \stopstructurelevel

\stopstructurelevel

\stoptext

and
\starttext

\startstructurelevel [title=first top level]

     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
                 test
             \stopstructurelevel
         \stopstructurelevel
     \stopstructurelevel

     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
                 test
             \stopstructurelevel
         \stopstructurelevel
     \stopstructurelevel

\stopstructurelevel

\stoptext


-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
       tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Mica Semrick]

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Yes that looks like what I want. Thank you!

On March 11, 2016 1:43:27 AM PST, Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:
>On 3/11/2016 9:08 AM, mica@silentumbrella.com wrote:
>> Greetings,
>>
>> Is it possible to have
>>
>> \starttext
>>
>> \startchapter
>> Hey a chapter!
>> \startsection
>> something.one
>> \startsection
>> someting.one.one
>> \startsection
>> something.one.one.one
>> \stopsection
>> \stopsection
>> \stopsection
>>
>>
>> \stopchapter
>>
>> \stoptext
>>
>> render as:
>>
>> 1. Hey a chapter!
>> 1.1 something.one
>> 1.1.1 something.one.one
>> 1.1.1.1 something.one.one.one
>
>do you mean something like
>
>sections/levels-001.tex
>sections/levels-002.tex
>
>in the test suite?
>
>\starttext
>
>\startstructurelevel [title=first top level]
>
>     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
>         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
>             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
>                 test
>             \stopstructurelevel
>         \stopstructurelevel
>     \stopstructurelevel
>
>     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
>         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
>             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
>                 test
>             \stopstructurelevel
>         \stopstructurelevel
>     \stopstructurelevel
>
>\stopstructurelevel
>
>\stoptext
>
>and
>\starttext
>
>\startstructurelevel [title=first top level]
>
>     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
>         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
>             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
>                 test
>             \stopstructurelevel
>         \stopstructurelevel
>     \stopstructurelevel
>
>     \startstructurelevel [title=first lower level]
>         \startstructurelevel [title=second lower level]
>             \startstructurelevel [title=third lower level]
>                 test
>             \stopstructurelevel
>         \stopstructurelevel
>     \stopstructurelevel
>
>\stopstructurelevel
>
>\stoptext
>
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>       tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>___________________________________________________________________________________
>If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry
>to the Wiki!
>
>maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
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>wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
>___________________________________________________________________________________

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Alan BRASLAU]

On Fri, 11 Mar 2016 09:36:01 +0100
Pablo Rodriguez <oinos@gmx.es> wrote:

> Sorry, Mica, but which is the gain in nesting sections (whether
> possible or not) over using subsections and subsubsections?
> 
> I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry, it
> must be my fault.)

Think about including source in another source, for example.

Say one has an article that becomes a book, or gets included in a book,
or the book gets parts. In the course of writing, one might decide to
add an additional level of structure and not want to change all of the
\start...\stop structure definitions.

In fact, using fixed section, subsection, subsubsection is a bit
antiquated, isn't it?

Alan
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Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Procházka Lukáš Ing.]

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Hello,

one more thing:

It would be nice to allow mixing:

- \section like commands (or \startsection ... \stopsection)
- AND \startsectionlevel ... \stopsectionlevel.

The main problem is that one may NEED to mix:

- (ancient) source files which use \section (deprecated) style
- with more versatile \start-\stopsectionlevel style in newer source files.

See the test attached - only the case 3 works universally with the \start-\stopstructurelevel;
any mixing of sectioning styles doesn't yield a desired result.

Best regards,

Lukas


On Sat, 12 Mar 2016 01:53:18 +0100, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:

> On Fri, 11 Mar 2016 09:36:01 +0100
> Pablo Rodriguez <oinos@gmx.es> wrote:
>
>> Sorry, Mica, but which is the gain in nesting sections (whether
>> possible or not) over using subsections and subsubsections?
>>
>> I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry, it
>> must be my fault.)
>
> Think about including source in another source, for example.
>
> Say one has an article that becomes a book, or gets included in a book,
> or the book gets parts. In the course of writing, one might decide to
> add an additional level of structure and not want to change all of the
> \start...\stop structure definitions.
>
> In fact, using fixed section, subsection, subsubsection is a bit
> antiquated, isn't it?
>
> Alan
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________


-- 
Ing. Lukáš Procházka | mailto:LPr@pontex.cz
Pontex s. r. o.      | mailto:pontex@pontex.cz | http://www.pontex.cz
Bezová 1658
147 14 Praha 4

Tel: +420 241 096 751
Fax: +420 244 461 038

[-- Attachment #2: Str.mkiv --]
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\starttext
  \chapter{Ch}
    \section{Sec}
      \subsection{SSec}

        \startsectionlevel[title={SSSec}]
        \stopsectionlevel

  \chapter{Ch2}
    \startsection[title={Sec2}]
      \startsubsection[title={SSec2}]

        \startsectionlevel[title={SSSec2}]
        \stopsectionlevel

      \stopsubsection
    \stopsection

  \startsectionlevel[title={Ch3}]
    \startsectionlevel[title={Sec3}]
      \startsectionlevel[title={SSec3}]
      \stopsectionlevel
    \stopsectionlevel
  \stopsectionlevel
\stoptext

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Pablo Rodriguez]

On 03/12/2016 01:53 AM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Mar 2016 09:36:01 +0100 Pablo Rodriguez wrote:
>> [...]
>> I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry, it
>> must be my fault.)
> 
> Think about including source in another source, for example.
> 
> Say one has an article that becomes a book, or gets included in a book,
> or the book gets parts. In the course of writing, one might decide to
> add an additional level of structure and not want to change all of the
> \start...\stop structure definitions.
> 
> In fact, using fixed section, subsection, subsubsection is a bit
> antiquated, isn't it?

Many thanks for your reply, Alan.

The usual suspect was found guilty: it was my fault not realizing that
fixed sectioning commands are outdated.

Pablo
-- 
http://www.ousia.tk
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Alan BRASLAU]

Indeed, Hans, it would be nice to be able to nest sectionlevels within
a chapter...section... scheme (which is NOT depreciated, although
antiquated).

Currently, \startsectionlevel will by default start a chapter. One
would like it to start a section if located within a chapter, a
subsection, if located within a section, etc. This should be possible.

Alan


On Mon, 14 Mar 2016 09:05:49 +0100
Procházka Lukáš Ing. <LPr@pontex.cz> wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> one more thing:
> 
> It would be nice to allow mixing:
> 
> - \section like commands (or \startsection ... \stopsection)
> - AND \startsectionlevel ... \stopsectionlevel.
> 
> The main problem is that one may NEED to mix:
> 
> - (ancient) source files which use \section (deprecated) style
> - with more versatile \start-\stopsectionlevel style in newer source
> files.
> 
> See the test attached - only the case 3 works universally with the
> \start-\stopstructurelevel; any mixing of sectioning styles doesn't
> yield a desired result.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Lukas
> 
> 
> On Sat, 12 Mar 2016 01:53:18 +0100, Alan BRASLAU
> <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:
> 
> > On Fri, 11 Mar 2016 09:36:01 +0100
> > Pablo Rodriguez <oinos@gmx.es> wrote:
> >  
> >> Sorry, Mica, but which is the gain in nesting sections (whether
> >> possible or not) over using subsections and subsubsections?
> >>
> >> I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry,
> >> it must be my fault.)  
> >
> > Think about including source in another source, for example.
> >
> > Say one has an article that becomes a book, or gets included in a
> > book, or the book gets parts. In the course of writing, one might
> > decide to add an additional level of structure and not want to
> > change all of the \start...\stop structure definitions.
> >
> > In fact, using fixed section, subsection, subsubsection is a bit
> > antiquated, isn't it?
> >
> > Alan
> > ___________________________________________________________________________________
> > If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an
> > entry to the Wiki!
> >
> > maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
> > http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage  :
> > http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive  :
> > http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki     :
> > http://contextgarden.net
> > ___________________________________________________________________________________  
> 
> 



-- 
Alan Braslau
CEA DSM-IRAMIS-SPEC
CNRS UMR 3680
Orme des Merisiers
91191 Gif-sur-Yvette cedex FRANCE
tel: +33 1 69 08 73 15
fax: +33 1 69 08 87 86
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On 03/15/2016 05:54 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
> Indeed, Hans, it would be nice to be able to nest sectionlevels within
> a chapter...section... scheme (which is NOT depreciated, although
> antiquated).

Oooh, shiny! In the TEI community, there are also people who repeat that 
having <div>s all the way down is modern, and <div1><div2> etc. is old 
hat. Well, I like to think about the way I structure my texts before I 
write them. I'm old fashioned that way...

But seriously: by all means, let's allow nesting. But don't let anyone 
tell you that explicit names are "antiquated." They make TeX or xml 
source documents so much more readable! And when you have to retrace 
five levels of \startsectionlevels because you want to change the 
structure of your document, you will rue the day you abandoned proper names.

Thomas
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Alan BRASLAU]

On Tue, 15 Mar 2016 18:10:27 +0100
"Thomas A. Schmitz" <thomas.schmitz@uni-bonn.de> wrote:

> But don't let anyone 
> tell you that explicit names are "antiquated." They make TeX or xml 
> source documents so much more readable! And when you have to retrace 
> five levels of \startsectionlevels because you want to change the 
> structure of your document, you will rue the day you abandoned proper
> names.

When you want to change the structure of your document when using
structure levels, all that you need do is add or subtract a level of
nesting. With named levels, it is easy to create complicated documents
that jump around in level, which would be pretty messy.

What a nightmare it would be to add or subtract a named structure level
in a complicated document.

This being said, I still mostly use named structure levels myself, as
old habits are hard to change (but don't tell Hans this!).

Alan
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Hans Hagen]

On 3/15/2016 6:10 PM, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
> On 03/15/2016 05:54 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
>> Indeed, Hans, it would be nice to be able to nest sectionlevels within
>> a chapter...section... scheme (which is NOT depreciated, although
>> antiquated).
>
> Oooh, shiny! In the TEI community, there are also people who repeat that
> having <div>s all the way down is modern, and <div1><div2> etc. is old
> hat. Well, I like to think about the way I structure my texts before I
> write them. I'm old fashioned that way...
>
> But seriously: by all means, let's allow nesting. But don't let anyone
> tell you that explicit names are "antiquated." They make TeX or xml
> source documents so much more readable! And when you have to retrace
> five levels of \startsectionlevels because you want to change the
> structure of your document, you will rue the day you abandoned proper
> names.

they are not antiquated at all

the main benefit from using \startchapter ... \stopchapter instead of 
\chapter is that we then know where something end which is handy when 
you want to finish things before starting something new (esp when 
grouping is involved it can get messy otherwise) ... it's also easier on 
the export

Hans

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Re: Are nested sections possible?

[Hans Hagen]

On 3/15/2016 8:09 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Mar 2016 18:10:27 +0100
> "Thomas A. Schmitz" <thomas.schmitz@uni-bonn.de> wrote:
>
>> But don't let anyone
>> tell you that explicit names are "antiquated." They make TeX or xml
>> source documents so much more readable! And when you have to retrace
>> five levels of \startsectionlevels because you want to change the
>> structure of your document, you will rue the day you abandoned proper
>> names.
>
> When you want to change the structure of your document when using
> structure levels, all that you need do is add or subtract a level of
> nesting. With named levels, it is easy to create complicated documents
> that jump around in level, which would be pretty messy.

on the other hand, when you look at a piece of coded document you no 
longer know if you're in an important chapter or unimportant 
subsubsubsubsubsubsection

so, in the end it all boils down to circumstances and usage which is why 
we have several methods

> What a nightmare it would be to add or subtract a named structure level
> in a complicated document.
>
> This being said, I still mostly use named structure levels myself, as
> old habits are hard to change (but don't tell Hans this!).

ha, well, if i remember right this nested anonymous sectioning was added 
on your request .. so it is now one of those orphaned features

anyway, i tend to replace

\chapter{foo}

by

\startchapter[title=foo]

\stopchapter

but at a much lower level keep using \subsubsection and alike

(also because then with chapters one can more conveniently set other 
properties)

Hans

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                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
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Re: Are nested sections possible?

[docent.einstein]

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Zdravim Lukasi,
 
Nejsem si jisty, zda se nemylim, ale pokud jsi z Brna, pak bych Te rad pozdravil.
 
Radek Pysny
 
______________________________________________________________
> Od: Procházka Lukáš Ing. <LPr@pontex.cz>
> Komu: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" <ntg-context@ntg.nl>
> Datum: 14.03.2016 09:05
> Předmět: Re: [NTG-context] Are nested sections possible?
>
Hello,
 
 one more thing:
 
 It would be nice to allow mixing:
 
 - \section like commands (or \startsection ... \stopsection)
 - AND \startsectionlevel ... \stopsectionlevel.
 
 The main problem is that one may NEED to mix:
 
 - (ancient) source files which use \section (deprecated) style
 - with more versatile \start-\stopsectionlevel style in newer source files.
 
 See the test attached - only the case 3 works universally with the \start-\stopstructurelevel;
 any mixing of sectioning styles doesn't yield a desired result.
 
 Best regards,
 
 Lukas
 
 
 On Sat, 12 Mar 2016 01:53:18 +0100, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:
 
 > On Fri, 11 Mar 2016 09:36:01 +0100
 > Pablo Rodriguez <oinos@gmx.es> wrote:
 >
 >> Sorry, Mica, but which is the gain in nesting sections (whether
 >> possible or not) over using subsections and subsubsections?
 >>
 >> I can hardly imagine the sense in the point you’re making. (Sorry, it
 >> must be my fault.)
 >
 > Think about including source in another source, for example.
 >
 > Say one has an article that becomes a book, or gets included in a book,
 > or the book gets parts. In the course of writing, one might decide to
 > add an additional level of structure and not want to change all of the
 > \start...\stop structure definitions.
 >
 > In fact, using fixed section, subsection, subsubsection is a bit
 > antiquated, isn't it?
 >
 > Alan
 > ___________________________________________________________________________________
 > If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
 >
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 > ___________________________________________________________________________________
 
 
 -- 
 Ing. Lukáš Procházka | mailto:LPr@pontex.cz
 Pontex s. r. o.      | mailto:pontex@pontex.cz | http://www.pontex.cz <http://www.pontex.cz>
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 Tel: +420 241 096 751
 Fax: +420 244 461 038
 
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