Bad page breaks!

Bad page breaks!

[G.C.H.M. Verhaag]

  Dear ConTeXt-users,

I'm trying to typeset a small book using ConTeXt (TeXLive 2004), and use 
the following setup:

\setupbodyfont[rm,12pt]

\definepapersize[BOOK][width=140mm,height=210mm]

\setuppapersize[BOOK][A4]
\setuplayout[
 [topspace=24mm,
  header=8mm,
  headerdistance=10mm,
  backspace=19.5mm,
  leftmargin=15.5mm,
  rightmargin=23mm,
  footerdistance=5mm,
  footer=4mm,
  height=fit,
  width=fit,
  marking=on,
  location=middle]

Page breaks are usually calculated automatically by TeX, but I notice 
that in my case they turn out to be very bad. A lot of pages are 
involved, so I wonder how this can be improved? Sometimes even 3 lines 
could be added without any difficulty to a page by TeX before inserting 
a page break!

I've tried to use \adaptlayout but it doesn't seem to work, no effect!

Has it perhaps something to do with the setup I use?

Regards,
    Geert

-- 
Geert C.H.M. Verhaag
St. Jorisstraat 29
5954 AN Beesel
NETHERLANDS

Tel.: (+31)-774742493, E-mail: verhaaggchm@ision.nl

Re: Bad page breaks!

[h h extern]

G.C.H.M. Verhaag wrote:
>  Dear ConTeXt-users,
> 
> I'm trying to typeset a small book using ConTeXt (TeXLive 2004), and use 
> the following setup:
> 
> \setupbodyfont[rm,12pt]
> 
> \definepapersize[BOOK][width=140mm,height=210mm]
> 
> \setuppapersize[BOOK][A4]
> \setuplayout[
> [topspace=24mm,
>  header=8mm,
>  headerdistance=10mm,
>  backspace=19.5mm,
>  leftmargin=15.5mm,
>  rightmargin=23mm,
>  footerdistance=5mm,
>  footer=4mm,
>  height=fit,
>  width=fit,
>  marking=on,
>  location=middle]
> 
> Page breaks are usually calculated automatically by TeX, but I notice 
> that in my case they turn out to be very bad. A lot of pages are 
> involved, so I wonder how this can be improved? Sometimes even 3 lines 
> could be added without any difficulty to a page by TeX before inserting 
> a page break!
> 
> I've tried to use \adaptlayout but it doesn't seem to work, no effect!
> 
> Has it perhaps something to do with the setup I use?

no, more with the default penalties, compare:

(for adam: take a look at core-spa, the default setups in there may answer a few 
of the questions in your postings)

\starttext

\startsetups [test]
   \resetpenalties\widowpenalties
   \resetpenalties\clubpenalties
   \resetpenalties\interlinepenalties
\stopsetups

\startsetups [test]
   \nopenalties
\stopsetups

\setuplayout[lines=25,setups=test] \showframe

\dorecurse{10}{\input tufte \endgraf}

\stoptext

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Bad page breaks!

[G.C.H.M. Verhaag]

  h h extern wrote:

> .....
> no, more with the default penalties, compare:
>
> (for adam: take a look at core-spa, the default setups in there may 
> answer a few of the questions in your postings)
>
> \starttext
>
> \startsetups [test]
>   \resetpenalties\widowpenalties
>   \resetpenalties\clubpenalties
>   \resetpenalties\interlinepenalties
> \stopsetups

I suppose this is another test setup!

>
> \startsetups [test]
>   \nopenalties
> \stopsetups
>
Sorry, but I keep struggling with the bad page breaks! I've tried both 
suggested setups, but my document (approx. 80 pages) hardly improved, 
despite the fact that it only deals with a few figures!

I want all pages to be of the same length, one missing line is allowed 
but no more!

It's not a ConTeXt problem I suppose, so switching to LaTeX won't solve 
the problem! Do you've any suggestions for further reading regarding 
these various penalties?

Regards,
    Geert

-- 
Geert C.H.M. Verhaag
St. Jorisstraat 29
5954 AN Beesel
NETHERLANDS

Tel.: (+31)-774742493, E-mail: verhaaggchm@ision.nl

Re: Bad page breaks!

[Hans Hagen]

G.C.H.M. Verhaag wrote:
>  h h extern wrote:
> 
>> .....
>> no, more with the default penalties, compare:
>>
>> (for adam: take a look at core-spa, the default setups in there may 
>> answer a few of the questions in your postings)
>>
>> \starttext
>>
>> \startsetups [test]
>>   \resetpenalties\widowpenalties
>>   \resetpenalties\clubpenalties
>>   \resetpenalties\interlinepenalties
>> \stopsetups
> 
> 
> I suppose this is another test setup!
> 
>>
>> \startsetups [test]
>>   \nopenalties
>> \stopsetups
>>
> Sorry, but I keep struggling with the bad page breaks! I've tried both 
> suggested setups, but my document (approx. 80 pages) hardly improved, 
> despite the fact that it only deals with a few figures!
> 
> I want all pages to be of the same length, one missing line is allowed 
> but no more!
> 
> It's not a ConTeXt problem I suppose, so switching to LaTeX won't solve 
> the problem! Do you've any suggestions for further reading regarding 
> these various penalties?

did you try:

\widowpenalty=0
\clubpenalty=0


Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Bad page breaks!

[G.C.H.M. Verhaag]

  Hans Hagen wrote:

......

>
> did you try:
>
> \widowpenalty=0
> \clubpenalty=0

Sorry, for the somewhat delayed response!

I tried these penalty settings but they seem to have not effect at all! 
The only way out is probably rearranging several paragraphs.

However I find it strange that I can't influence this page breaking at all!

Geert

-- 
Geert C.H.M. Verhaag
St. Jorisstraat 29
5954 AN Beesel
NETHERLANDS

Tel.: (+31)-774742493, E-mail: verhaaggchm@ision.nl

Re: Bad page breaks!

[h h extern]

G.C.H.M. Verhaag wrote:
>  Hans Hagen wrote:
> 
> ......
> 
>>
>> did you try:
>>
>> \widowpenalty=0
>> \clubpenalty=0
> 
> 
> Sorry, for the somewhat delayed response!
> 
> I tried these penalty settings but they seem to have not effect at all! 
> The only way out is probably rearranging several paragraphs.
> 
> However I find it strange that I can't influence this page breaking at all!

can you make a small sample file that you would like to see different?

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Bad page breaks!

[G.C.H.M. Verhaag]

  h h extern wrote:

> can you make a small sample file that you would like to see different?
>
Sorry, but I find that a bit to cumbersome to do at the moment!

The layout of another book I'm trying to prepare using ConTeXt appears 
perfect, pages stay the same length, a very pleasing look! But this time 
the book contains only simple paragraphs and no figures at all.

Thanks!

Geert

-- 
Geert C.H.M. Verhaag
St. Jorisstraat 29
5954 AN Beesel
NETHERLANDS

Tel.: (+31)-774742493, E-mail: verhaaggchm@ision.nl