TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Taco Hoekwater]

Hi all,

There now is a wiki page documenting the setup and maintenance of mkiv:

   http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Running_Mark_IV

The page can still be improved upon (of course), so if you know
of something that needs to be added or explained better, please do so.
I wrote this page with the texlive 2008 users in mind, but I think most
of it applies to the new context minimals as well.

For the people not on the texlive list: After ample consideration and
discussion, we have decided that texlive will not attempt to do any
configuration of mkiv at all other than making sure the three commands 
(luatools, mtxrun, context) are available in the bin directory.

Everything else is left up to the user. But of course we don't want
every single texlive context user to ask the same set of questions
again and again, so it is helpful to have a wiki page that explains
post-install configuration and maintenance. If you are a mkiv user
already, or willing to experiment trying to get mkiv running, please
have a look at that wiki page.

By the way, context on texlive2008 will be 2008.05.21. Mkii (pdftex
as well as xetex) runs out of the box, no post-install intervention
needed. But if someone is willing to do some extra tests, that will
be much appreciated. How to beta-test texlive2008 is explained in

   ftp://tug.org/texlive/tlnet/tldev/README

Best wishes,
Taco


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Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Aditya Mahajan]

Quoting Taco Hoekwater <taco@elvenkind.com>:

>
> Hi all,
>
> There now is a wiki page documenting the setup and maintenance of mkiv:
>
>    http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Running_Mark_IV
>
> The page can still be improved upon (of course), so if you know
> of something that needs to be added or explained better, please do so.
> I wrote this page with the texlive 2008 users in mind, but I think most
> of it applies to the new context minimals as well.

This page is great. Thanks.

> By the way, context on texlive2008 will be 2008.05.21. Mkii (pdftex
> as well as xetex) runs out of the box, no post-install intervention
> needed. But if someone is willing to do some extra tests, that will
> be much appreciated. How to beta-test texlive2008 is explained in
>
>    ftp://tug.org/texlive/tlnet/tldev/README

Is it possible to test texlive without uninstalling texlive2007  
installed by a system package manager? Last time I tried texlive 2008,  
mkiv setup was reading texmf.cnf that came with system installed  
tl2007, and therefore could not find the correct files. I want to test  
tl2008, but at the moment cannot afford to uninstall tl2007.

Aditya
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Hans Hagen]

Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> Quoting Taco Hoekwater <taco@elvenkind.com>:
> 
>> Hi all,
>>
>> There now is a wiki page documenting the setup and maintenance of mkiv:
>>
>>    http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Running_Mark_IV
>>
>> The page can still be improved upon (of course), so if you know
>> of something that needs to be added or explained better, please do so.
>> I wrote this page with the texlive 2008 users in mind, but I think most
>> of it applies to the new context minimals as well.
> 
> This page is great. Thanks.
> 
>> By the way, context on texlive2008 will be 2008.05.21. Mkii (pdftex
>> as well as xetex) runs out of the box, no post-install intervention
>> needed. But if someone is willing to do some extra tests, that will
>> be much appreciated. How to beta-test texlive2008 is explained in
>>
>>    ftp://tug.org/texlive/tlnet/tldev/README
> 
> Is it possible to test texlive without uninstalling texlive2007  
> installed by a system package manager? Last time I tried texlive 2008,  
> mkiv setup was reading texmf.cnf that came with system installed  
> tl2007, and therefore could not find the correct files. I want to test  
> tl2008, but at the moment cannot afford to uninstall tl2007.

it's installed in a 2008 subtree so it should be possible to run them 
alongside

Hans


-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Taco Hoekwater]

Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> Is it possible to test texlive without uninstalling texlive2007  
> installed by a system package manager? Last time I tried texlive 2008,  
> mkiv setup was reading texmf.cnf that came with system installed  
> tl2007, and therefore could not find the correct files. I want to test  
> tl2008, but at the moment cannot afford to uninstall tl2007.

It should work to have both installed together (unless your packaged
texlive depends on environment variables or your system has a texmf.cnf
that is not officially part of texlive).

Best wishes,
Taco
___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[George N. White III]

On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 6:37 PM, Aditya Mahajan <adityam@umich.edu> wrote:

> Is it possible to test texlive without uninstalling texlive2007
> installed by a system package manager? Last time I tried texlive 2008,
> mkiv setup was reading texmf.cnf that came with system installed
> tl2007, and therefore could not find the correct files. I want to test
> tl2008, but at the moment cannot afford to uninstall tl2007.

I have two versions of TL2007 (Red Hat's and one I maintain from
the svn repo) and have been testing TL2008 without removing.
TL is designed to work from a self-contained tree, but there are
a few potential problems to watch for:

0. Some Windows GUI environments may store the information
    gleaned from the TeX configuration when they are first
    installed, so you need to check which versions are being
    used and be prepared to use command-line stuff if your
    editor makes bad choices.   This can also be an issue
    with some *x GUI environments whre the app is started
    by the GUI and doesn't see changes to the path made
    in your current shell.

1.  the default on is to have texlive/YYYY/texmf* trees with
    texlive/texmf-local available to all the versions.  If you have
    put updates to TL2007 in your texmf-local, they may be older
    versions than those in TL2008.  The same applies to updates
    in $HOME/texmf.

2.  on *x be careful not to have the installer create symbolic links,
    e.g., in /usr/bin.  You can then select the version you want
    by adjusting the PATH variable.

On *X I recommend the environment modules tools to manage
your PATH.  This is available in some linux distros, and comes
with SGI Irix.   Another approach that works on WIn32 and *x
is to write a script that sets the path and loads a shell.  Then
you can use that for command-line processing, or start emacs
from the command-line to use AUCTeX.

3.  formats and configs may end up in $HOME/.texliveYYYY,
    which is OK if you are using only one install for a given year,
    but can cause problems if you end up with two installs for the
    same TL version.  The solution is to make sure you use the
   <tool>-sys versions to put configs and formats into the system
   directories.


-- 
George N. White III <aa056@chebucto.ns.ca>
Head of St. Margarets Bay, Nova Scotia
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Aditya Mahajan]

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008, George N. White III wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 6:37 PM, Aditya Mahajan <adityam@umich.edu> wrote:
>
>> Is it possible to test texlive without uninstalling texlive2007
>> installed by a system package manager? Last time I tried texlive 2008,
>> mkiv setup was reading texmf.cnf that came with system installed
>> tl2007, and therefore could not find the correct files. I want to test
>> tl2008, but at the moment cannot afford to uninstall tl2007.

I also realized that I had TEXMFCNF variable set, which was causing 
havoc with tl2008.

> I have two versions of TL2007 (Red Hat's and one I maintain from
> the svn repo) and have been testing TL2008 without removing.
> TL is designed to work from a self-contained tree, but there are
> a few potential problems to watch for:
>
> 0. Some Windows GUI environments may store the information
>    gleaned from the TeX configuration when they are first
>    installed, so you need to check which versions are being
>    used and be prepared to use command-line stuff if your
>    editor makes bad choices.   This can also be an issue
>    with some *x GUI environments whre the app is started
>    by the GUI and doesn't see changes to the path made
>    in your current shell.
>
> 1.  the default on is to have texlive/YYYY/texmf* trees with
>    texlive/texmf-local available to all the versions.  If you have
>    put updates to TL2007 in your texmf-local, they may be older
>    versions than those in TL2008.  The same applies to updates
>    in $HOME/texmf.
>
> 2.  on *x be careful not to have the installer create symbolic links,
>    e.g., in /usr/bin.  You can then select the version you want
>    by adjusting the PATH variable.
>
>
> On *X I recommend the environment modules tools to manage
> your PATH.  This is available in some linux distros, and comes
> with SGI Irix.   Another approach that works on WIn32 and *x
> is to write a script that sets the path and loads a shell.  Then
> you can use that for command-line processing, or start emacs
> from the command-line to use AUCTeX.
>
> 3.  formats and configs may end up in $HOME/.texliveYYYY,
>    which is OK if you are using only one install for a given year,
>    but can cause problems if you end up with two installs for the
>    same TL version.  The solution is to make sure you use the
>   <tool>-sys versions to put configs and formats into the system
>   directories.

Thank you. I followed your instructions, and everything works perfectly. 
(Well, I did have to manually follow the post-install instructions from 
Taco). I only installed ConTeXt, american language and english 
documentation. ConTeXt works fine, but the only third party module that is 
installed in t-bib. Did I miss an option for installing ConTeXt third 
party modules, or are they not present currently?

Aditya
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Taco Hoekwater]

Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> 
> Thank you. I followed your instructions, and everything works perfectly. 
> (Well, I did have to manually follow the post-install instructions from 
> Taco). I only installed ConTeXt, american language and english 
> documentation. 

You don't really need the language, I think (but selecting one removes
the installer warning).

>                ConTeXt works fine, but the only third party module that is 
> installed in t-bib. Did I miss an option for installing ConTeXt third 
> party modules, or are they not present currently?

Nothing is present in texlive at the moment (except a typescript from
the semaphor font package). I verified this by looking at the svn 
repository.

Unless I badly misinterpreted something, Mojca is getting the modules
mirrored to CTAN so that they can be brought into texlive in the
'normal' way, but whether or not that will be sorted out in time for
the 2008 release of texlive I cannot say.

Best wishes,
Taco
___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Sun, Jul 13, 2008 at 9:53 AM, Taco Hoekwater wrote:
> Aditya Mahajan wrote:
>>
>> Thank you. I followed your instructions, and everything works perfectly.
>> (Well, I did have to manually follow the post-install instructions from
>> Taco). I only installed ConTeXt, american language and english
>> documentation.
>
> You don't really need the language, I think (but selecting one removes
> the installer warning).

I think that Norbert already implemented "if context scheme, no warning".

>>                ConTeXt works fine, but the only third party module that is
>> installed in t-bib. Did I miss an option for installing ConTeXt third
>> party modules, or are they not present currently?
>
> Nothing is present in texlive at the moment (except a typescript from
> the semaphor font package). I verified this by looking at the svn
> repository.
>
> Unless I badly misinterpreted something, Mojca is getting the modules
> mirrored to CTAN so that they can be brought into texlive in the
> 'normal' way, but whether or not that will be sorted out in time for
> the 2008 release of texlive I cannot say.

The modules are mirrored on CTAN, but Karl sent me a list of questions
(I expected that). The "problem" is that TL assumes that package names
should be the same as folders where these packages reside.

In the specific case of t-letter, that means renaming
tex/context/third/letter to tex/context/third/context-letter, else
name clash with LaTeX package letter would occur ... But some better
solution needs to be found.

Mojca
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: TeX Live and ConTeXt MKIV installation and maintenance

[Hans Hagen]

Mojca Miklavec wrote:

> In the specific case of t-letter, that means renaming
> tex/context/third/letter to tex/context/third/context-letter, else
> name clash with LaTeX package letter would occur ... But some better
> solution needs to be found.

we need to avoid too many variants, so better something like extra that 
contains letter and more

context core
context modules
context styles
context fonts

not more granularity

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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