Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Ilda Khaki]

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I am trying to compare the results of Arabic typesetting between different
TeX engines to decide the best one. Can anyone send a samplwe file for
typesetting Arabic in Plain TeX over luatex where the alphabets are not
isolated?

Thanks

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Re: Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Khaled Hosny]

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On Fri, Feb 13, 2009 at 02:17:26PM +1100, Ilda Khaki wrote:
> I am trying to compare the results of Arabic typesetting between different TeX
> engines to decide the best one. Can anyone send a samplwe file for typesetting
> Arabic in Plain TeX over luatex where the alphabets are not isolated?

Currently, you can't do that unless:
* Use OCP and type1 fonts, the only publicly available font (that I know
  of) is OmegaSerifArabic, which is not that atractive.
* Typeset the plain TeX document with ConTeXt and use ConTeXt's OpenType
  layout capabilities, this will give you much better result but it
  is plain TeX+ not plain any more.

If you sent me a sample Unicode encoded plain TeX file, I'll gladly try
to typeset it either way for you.

Regards,
 Khaled

-- 
 Khaled Hosny
 Arabic localizer and member of Arabeyes.org team

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Re: Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد]

Hi,

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:17:26 -0700, Ilda Khaki <ilda.khaki@gmail.com>  
wrote:

> I am trying to compare the results of Arabic typesetting between  
> different
> TeX engines to decide the best one. Can anyone send a samplwe file for
> typesetting Arabic in Plain TeX over luatex where the alphabets are not
> isolated?

1. Mixed-up categories: Plain TeX is a macropackage, luaTeX is an engine.

2. Your question is way too general. You could use ArabTeX with the  
original TeX engine, and there are other systems out there too...

3. For real-life 21'st century practical purposes (viz utf-8 + opentype)  
your choices are XeTeX and LuaTeX.

4. Without a more precise question I cannot really recommend which way to  
go from here.

Search the wiki as well :-)

Best wishes
Idris

-- 
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shi`i Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Ilda Khaki]

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On Sat, Feb 14, 2009 at 1:52 AM, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد <
ishamid@colostate.edu> wrote:

> Hi,
>
>
> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:17:26 -0700, Ilda Khaki <ilda.khaki@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>  I am trying to compare the results of Arabic typesetting between different
>> TeX engines to decide the best one. Can anyone send a samplwe file for
>> typesetting Arabic in Plain TeX over luatex where the alphabets are not
>> isolated?
>>
>
> 1. Mixed-up categories: Plain TeX is a macropackage, luaTeX is an engine.


No. It is not. When someone uses Plain TeX in an engine, he would say Plain
TeX over the engine-name. It seems you know very little about Plain TeX.


>
>
> 2. Your question is way too general. You could use ArabTeX with the
> original TeX engine, and there are other systems out there too...


No. It seems you did not understand my question at all. If I wanted to use
arabtex, I would not bother at all to write to this list.


>
>
> 3. For real-life 21'st century practical purposes (viz utf-8 + opentype)
> your choices are XeTeX and LuaTeX.
>
> 4. Without a more precise question I cannot really recommend which way to
> go from here.


This is a sample file, I am looking for.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
\pagedir TRT \bodydir TRT \textdir TRT \pardir TRT
\font\test=zar.ttf scaled\magstep0

هل انت کیقک؟
\end
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

But I do not know how to define the font so that Arabic alphabets are not
isolated.

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Re: Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Wolfgang Schuster]

Am 15.02.2009 um 08:20 schrieb Ilda Khaki:

>>> TeX engines to decide the best one. Can anyone send a samplwe file  
>>> for
>>> typesetting Arabic in Plain TeX over luatex where the alphabets  
>>> are not
>>> isolated?
>>
>> 1. Mixed-up categories: Plain TeX is a macropackage, luaTeX is an  
>> engine.
>
> No. It is not. When someone uses Plain TeX in an engine, he would  
> say Plain
> TeX over the engine-name. It seems you know very little about Plain  
> TeX.

Your question was not clear enough and it's read as you want to compare
TeX (the program) with LuaTeX (the program). You should say Plain TeX in
or with LuaTeX.

>> 4. Without a more precise question I cannot really recommend which  
>> way to
>> go from here.
>
> This is a sample file, I am looking for.
>
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> \pagedir TRT \bodydir TRT \textdir TRT \pardir TRT
> \font\test=zar.ttf scaled\magstep0
>
> هل انت کیقک؟
> \end
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>
> But I do not know how to define the font so that Arabic alphabets  
> are not
> isolated.

You use in ConTeXt features to enable functions like kerning,  
ligatures etc.

In the higher level interface you do this with "interface=..." but  
with the
font primitive this is done with \font\...=...*featurename and in your  
example

\font\test=zar*arabic scaled\magstep0 \test % you forgot to enable the  
font

Wolfgang

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Re: Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Khaled Hosny]

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On Sun, Feb 15, 2009 at 06:20:08PM +1100, Ilda Khaki wrote:
> This is a sample file, I am looking for.
> 
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> \pagedir TRT \bodydir TRT \textdir TRT \pardir TRT
> \font\test=zar.ttf scaled\magstep0
> 
> هل انت کیقک؟
> \end
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> 
> But I do not know how to define the font so that Arabic alphabets are not
> isolated.

If you really want to use Plain TeX with LuaTeX, the only viable option
you have now is to process your document with context thus enjoying
ConTeXt's OpenType layout until there is an independent code that can be
used in Plain TeX format. (BTW, your example won't work with Plain
LuaTeX since it doesn't load TTF fonts directly, you must be using
context if you see un-joined Arabic text).

A minimal example, would be:

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
\pagedir TRT \bodydir TRT \textdir TRT \pardir TRT
\definefontfeature[fea]
    [mode=node,language=dflt,script=arab,
     isol=yes,init=yes,medi=yes,fina=yes,
     liga=yes,rlig=yes,mark=yes,mkmk=yes]
\font\test=zara*fea scaled\magstep0\test
هل انت کیقک؟
\end
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

The \definefontfeature defines a font feature that allows turning on/off
various layout features of the selected font, assuming that the font
contain OpenType layout tables.

Regards,
 Khaled


-- 
 Khaled Hosny
 Arabic localizer and member of Arabeyes.org team

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Re: Arabic typesetting in Plain TeX over LuaTeX

[Hans Hagen]

Ilda Khaki wrote:

>> 1. Mixed-up categories: Plain TeX is a macropackage, luaTeX is an engine.
> 
> 
> No. It is not. When someone uses Plain TeX in an engine, he would say Plain
> TeX over the engine-name. It seems you know very little about Plain TeX.

that's just a side effect of the engines dafaulting to some plain name 
i.e. tex->plain.fmt, pdftex->pdftex.fmt, luatex->luatex.fmt, etc

so, although luatex can use a plain.fmt format, in practice it would be 
luatex.fmt (now that we have engine subpaths a non-clashing plain.fmt 
would be posible but that's all dependent of the cnf file)

concerning plain itself ... i guess that in most macropackages you can 
use plain-like macros; it would be interesting to know what 
functionality plain offers that macro packages don't provide too; the 
main advantage of plain is that it's small and very stable, but any 
luatex related font code will make plain way bigger, slower and less stable

> This is a sample file, I am looking for.
> 
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> \pagedir TRT \bodydir TRT \textdir TRT \pardir TRT
> \font\test=zar.ttf scaled\magstep0
> 
> هل انت کیقک؟
> \end
> %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> 
> But I do not know how to define the font so that Arabic alphabets are not
> isolated.

it would probably also need something

\input a-lot-of-extra-lua-code

\font\test=zar.ttf[plus enabling arabic features] scaled\magstep0

and probably more since plain tex is meant as basis for typesetting an 
english book and not arabic

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