Need help with bibliography

Need help with bibliography

[Mika Ritola]

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Hello,

I'm planning to write my Master's thesis in history using ConTeXt, and I've
done some experimenting on it to see if it's actually suitable for my
purposes. Everything seems to be quite simple except for one thing: the
bibliography. The bibliography guidelines for our history department are
rather complex in comparison to the formats that come packaged with ConTeXt,
and I have no idea how to implement them. So far, I've run into two
problems:

1. This one's probably very simple: there's the /insertauthors macro for
inserting the whole name of the author. But how do you insert just the last
name of the author?

2. This one, on the other hand, is likely to be rather non-trivial: the
bibliography needs to be broken up into several categories of sources. For
example, audiovisual sources, newspaper sources and books should be listed
under separate headings, somewhat like this:

BIBLIOGRAPHY

I. AUDIOVISUAL SOURCES

[some sources]

II. NEWSPAPER SOURCES

[...]

III. BOOKS

[...]

I've tried to decipher the source code of the Bib module but as I'm not
particularly fluent in TeX, I haven't been able to make much headway so far.
I'd appreciate some hints on where to start with this. I don't suppose
there's any existing code for something like this? Maybe I'd be better off
writing the bibliography by hand?

Thanks for reading,

Mika

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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Hans Hagen]

Mika Ritola wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I'm planning to write my Master's thesis in history using ConTeXt, and I've
> done some experimenting on it to see if it's actually suitable for my
> purposes. Everything seems to be quite simple except for one thing: the
> bibliography. The bibliography guidelines for our history department are
> rather complex in comparison to the formats that come packaged with ConTeXt,
> and I have no idea how to implement them. So far, I've run into two
> problems:
> 
> 1. This one's probably very simple: there's the /insertauthors macro for
> inserting the whole name of the author. But how do you insert just the last
> name of the author?
> 
> 2. This one, on the other hand, is likely to be rather non-trivial: the
> bibliography needs to be broken up into several categories of sources. For
> example, audiovisual sources, newspaper sources and books should be listed
> under separate headings, somewhat like this:
> 
> BIBLIOGRAPHY
> 
> I. AUDIOVISUAL SOURCES
> 
> [some sources]
> 
> II. NEWSPAPER SOURCES
> 
> [...]
> 
> III. BOOKS
> 
> [...]
> 
> I've tried to decipher the source code of the Bib module but as I'm not
> particularly fluent in TeX, I haven't been able to make much headway so far.
> I'd appreciate some hints on where to start with this. I don't suppose
> there's any existing code for something like this? Maybe I'd be better off
> writing the bibliography by hand?

currently the bibtex support is being integrated in the core so if some 
extension is needed, we can try to deal with it, but only in mkiv (btw, 
next year it so we will provide a new (extra) interface to bibliographies)

- concerning 1: i'm sure users on this list can help you with that

- concerning 2: it is not that complex to add an extra level of 
filtering (using the type key), but we need an example first; best 
coordinate this with Thomas Schmitz who does testing of the latest code

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

Hi,

I'm not sure I can be of much help (hopefully Taco will have a look),  
but just a few thoughts:

On Sep 20, 2009, at 1:30 PM, Mika Ritola wrote:

>
> 1. This one's probably very simple: there's the /insertauthors macro  
> for inserting the whole name of the author. But how do you insert  
> just the last name of the author?
>
If you just want the last name, you can use \cite[author][<citekey>],  
but I'm not sure if this what you're after, maybe you'll need to tell  
us more.

> 2. This one, on the other hand, is likely to be rather non-trivial:  
> the bibliography needs to be broken up into several categories of  
> sources. For example, audiovisual sources, newspaper sources and  
> books should be listed under separate headings, somewhat like this:
>
> BIBLIOGRAPHY
>
> I. AUDIOVISUAL SOURCES
>
> [some sources]
>
> II. NEWSPAPER SOURCES
>
> [...]
>
> III. BOOKS
>
> [...]
>
> I've tried to decipher the source code of the Bib module but as I'm  
> not particularly fluent in TeX, I haven't been able to make much  
> headway so far. I'd appreciate some hints on where to start with  
> this. I don't suppose there's any existing code for something like  
> this? Maybe I'd be better off writing the bibliography by hand?
>
That sounds harder. You basically need three separate bibliographies,  
each of them sorted in some way. I'm not certain the current  
implementation of the bib module can do that (i.e. I'm almost certain  
it can't). How do you want to refer to these items in your text?  
Again, we'll probably need some more information about what you want  
to achieve.

Best

Thomas
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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Hans Hagen]

Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:

> That sounds harder. You basically need three separate bibliographies, 
> each of them sorted in some way. I'm not certain the current 
> implementation of the bib module can do that (i.e. I'm almost certain it 
> can't). How do you want to refer to these items in your text? Again, 
> we'll probably need some more information about what you want to achieve.

if we need an additional filtering on book|article etc, i.e. field 't' 
then this can probably be done without too much effort (in mkiv we can 
load the original bbl file for that purpose)

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Need help with bibliography

[Mika Ritola]

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2009/9/20 Thomas A. Schmitz <thomas.schmitz@uni-bonn.de>

>
> On Sep 20, 2009, at 1:30 PM, Mika Ritola wrote:
>
>
>> 1. This one's probably very simple: there's the /insertauthors macro for
>> inserting the whole name of the author. But how do you insert just the last
>> name of the author?
>>
>>
> If you just want the last name, you can use \cite[author][<citekey>], but
> I'm not sure if this what you're after, maybe you'll need to tell us more.
>
I'll try to give a clearer explanation. First of all, when I cite a source
using e.g. \cite[Smith2000], this should appear in the text as "Smith 2000".
I've already managed to do this. Now, each entry in the bibliography should
begin with the same string that was used to identify it within the text. So,
the above example should look something like this:

Smith 2000<tab>John Smith. Generic Book Title. Whatever Publishing Company,
New York 2000.

I know I can get the "John Smith" by using \insertauthors in
\setuppublicationlayout. But how do I get just the last name? The answer is
probably so simple that I should be ashamed that I can't figure it out by
myself but I haven't quite gotten the hang of ConTeXt and TeX yet...

>
>  2. This one, on the other hand, is likely to be rather non-trivial: the
>> bibliography needs to be broken up into several categories of sources. For
>> example, audiovisual sources, newspaper sources and books should be listed
>> under separate headings, somewhat like this:
>>
>> BIBLIOGRAPHY
>>
>> I. AUDIOVISUAL SOURCES
>>
>> [some sources]
>>
>> II. NEWSPAPER SOURCES
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> III. BOOKS
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> I've tried to decipher the source code of the Bib module but as I'm not
>> particularly fluent in TeX, I haven't been able to make much headway so far.
>> I'd appreciate some hints on where to start with this. I don't suppose
>> there's any existing code for something like this? Maybe I'd be better off
>> writing the bibliography by hand?
>>
>>  That sounds harder. You basically need three separate bibliographies,
> each of them sorted in some way. I'm not certain the current implementation
> of the bib module can do that (i.e. I'm almost certain it can't). How do you
> want to refer to these items in your text? Again, we'll probably need some
> more information about what you want to achieve.
>
> I think it would be easiest if I could refer to them in the usual way,
using \cite[Smith2000]. Of course, each item in the .bib file should have
some kind of a tag, so that ConTeXt could automagically insert it under the
correct heading.

Thanks,

Mika

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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Aditya Mahajan]

On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, Mika Ritola wrote:

> 2009/9/20 Thomas A. Schmitz <thomas.schmitz@uni-bonn.de>
>
>>
>> On Sep 20, 2009, at 1:30 PM, Mika Ritola wrote:
>>
>>
>>> 1. This one's probably very simple: there's the /insertauthors macro for
>>> inserting the whole name of the author. But how do you insert just the last
>>> name of the author?
>>>
>>>
>> If you just want the last name, you can use \cite[author][<citekey>], but
>> I'm not sure if this what you're after, maybe you'll need to tell us more.
>>
> I'll try to give a clearer explanation. First of all, when I cite a source
> using e.g. \cite[Smith2000], this should appear in the text as "Smith 2000".
> I've already managed to do this. Now, each entry in the bibliography should
> begin with the same string that was used to identify it within the text. So,
> the above example should look something like this:
>
> Smith 2000<tab>John Smith. Generic Book Title. Whatever Publishing Company,
> New York 2000.
>
> I know I can get the "John Smith" by using \insertauthors in
> \setuppublicationlayout. But how do I get just the last name?

I do not know an inbuilt way of doing this. You can probably use an ugly 
hacks like this:

\usemodule[bib]

\unprotect
\def\authorlastname#1#2#3#4#5%
   {%\bibdoif{#1}{#1\bibalternative\c!firstnamesep}%
    \bibdoif{#2}{#2\bibalternative\c!vonsep}%
    #3%
    \bibdoif{#5}{\bibalternative\c!surnamesep#5\unskip}%
    % Set a macro for full name
    \def\fullauthorname{\invertedauthor{#1}{#2}{#3}{#4}{#5}}}
\protect

\setuppublicationlayout[article]%
  {\insertartauthors {} {\space\insertpubyear{}{}{}\quad\fullauthorname,} 
{}%
  % The above statement uses the full name set in authorlastname
   \insertarttitle   {\space\quotation\bgroup}
                                  {,\egroup} {}%
   \insertjournal    {\space\bgroup \it}
                         {\unskip\/\egroup} {}%
   \insertvolume     {,\space vol.~}
         {\insertissue {,\space no.~} {} {}} {}%
   \insertpages      {,\space pp.\space}       {} {}%
   \insertpubyear    {,\space\insertmonth{}{\space}{}}
                                          {} {}%
   \insertnote       {.\space}            {.} {.}}


\setuppublicationlist
    [artauthor=\authorlastname]

\startpublication[k=smith:2000,t=article,
a={{Smith}},y=2000,
n=1,s=Smt00]
\artauthor[]{John}[J.]{}{Smith}
\pubyear{2000}
\arttitle{The theory of everything}
\journal{A fancy journal}
\volume{22}
\pages{379-423}
\month{7}
\stoppublication

\starttext

See~\cite[smith:2000]

\placepublications

\stoptext


> The answer is probably so simple that I should be ashamed that I can't 
> figure it out by myself but I haven't quite gotten the hang of ConTeXt 
> and TeX yet...

With TeX, simple things are not always simple.

Aditya
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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Aditya Mahajan]

On Sun, 20 Sep 2009, Aditya Mahajan wrote:

> On Mon, 21 Sep 2009, Mika Ritola wrote:
>
>> 2009/9/20 Thomas A. Schmitz <thomas.schmitz@uni-bonn.de>
>> 
>>> 
>>> On Sep 20, 2009, at 1:30 PM, Mika Ritola wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 1. This one's probably very simple: there's the /insertauthors macro for
>>>> inserting the whole name of the author. But how do you insert just the 
>>>> last
>>>> name of the author?
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> If you just want the last name, you can use \cite[author][<citekey>], but
>>> I'm not sure if this what you're after, maybe you'll need to tell us more.
>>> 
>> I'll try to give a clearer explanation. First of all, when I cite a source
>> using e.g. \cite[Smith2000], this should appear in the text as "Smith 
>> 2000".
>> I've already managed to do this. Now, each entry in the bibliography should
>> begin with the same string that was used to identify it within the text. 
>> So,
>> the above example should look something like this:
>> 
>> Smith 2000<tab>John Smith. Generic Book Title. Whatever Publishing Company,
>> New York 2000.
>> 
>> I know I can get the "John Smith" by using \insertauthors in
>> \setuppublicationlayout. But how do I get just the last name?
>
> I do not know an inbuilt way of doing this. You can probably use an ugly 
> hacks like this:

Slightly more clean solution. The current value of the citation is stored 
as \@@pbk, so you can use \cite to extract whatever data you want. So,

\setuppublicationlayout[article]%
  {\insertartauthors {\cite[alternative=authoryear,
 			   left=,right={\quad}][\@@pbk]} {,} {}%
   \insertarttitle   {\space\quotation\bgroup}
                                  {,\egroup} {}%
   \insertjournal    {\space\bgroup \it}
                         {\unskip\/\egroup} {}%
   \insertvolume     {,\space vol.~}
         {\insertissue {,\space no.~} {} {}} {}%
   \insertpages      {,\space pp.\space}       {} {}%
   \insertpubyear    {,\space\insertmonth{}{\space}{}}
                                          {} {}%
   \insertnote       {.\space}            {.} {.}}


Aditya
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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On Sep 21, 2009, at 12:41 AM, Mika Ritola wrote:

> I'll try to give a clearer explanation. First of all, when I cite a  
> source using e.g. \cite[Smith2000], this should appear in the text  
> as "Smith 2000". I've already managed to do this. Now, each entry in  
> the bibliography should begin with the same string that was used to  
> identify it within the text. So, the above example should look  
> something like this:
>
> Smith 2000<tab>John Smith. Generic Book Title. Whatever Publishing  
> Company, New York 2000.
>
> I know I can get the "John Smith" by using \insertauthors in  
> \setuppublicationlayout. But how do I get just the last name? The  
> answer is probably so simple that I should be ashamed that I can't  
> figure it out by myself but I haven't quite gotten the hang of  
> ConTeXt and TeX yet...

Ah, so it turns out you're looking for something else altogether. In  
your case, you want a special kind of label for your bibliographic  
list. See if Aditya's hack gives the result you want. But generally  
speaking, I think your setup is pretty common in the humanities, so it  
should be added as a key to the processactionlist in l. 308-316 of  
bibl-tra.mkiv. Hans, Taco, is there a proper syntax for getting the  
lastname and year of the current bib item?

>
> 2. This one, on the other hand, is likely to be rather non-trivial:  
> the bibliography needs to be broken up into several categories of  
> sources. For example, audiovisual sources, newspaper sources and  
> books should be listed under separate headings, somewhat like this:
>
> BIBLIOGRAPHY
>
> I. AUDIOVISUAL SOURCES
>
> [some sources]
>
> II. NEWSPAPER SOURCES
>
> [...]
>
> III. BOOKS
>
> [...]
>
> I've tried to decipher the source code of the Bib module but as I'm  
> not particularly fluent in TeX, I haven't been able to make much  
> headway so far. I'd appreciate some hints on where to start with  
> this. I don't suppose there's any existing code for something like  
> this? Maybe I'd be better off writing the bibliography by hand?
>
> That sounds harder. You basically need three separate  
> bibliographies, each of them sorted in some way. I'm not certain the  
> current implementation of the bib module can do that (i.e. I'm  
> almost certain it can't). How do you want to refer to these items in  
> your text? Again, we'll probably need some more information about  
> what you want to achieve.
>
> I think it would be easiest if I could refer to them in the usual  
> way, using \cite[Smith2000]. Of course, each item in the .bib file  
> should have some kind of a tag, so that ConTeXt could automagically  
> insert it under the correct heading.

Well, Hans said it was possible. You'll need to define an additional  
field to filter your items and then have three lists typeset.

Thomas

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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Taco Hoekwater]

Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
> 
> On Sep 21, 2009, at 12:41 AM, Mika Ritola wrote:
> 
>> I'll try to give a clearer explanation. First of all, when I cite a 
>> source using e.g. \cite[Smith2000], this should appear in the text as 
>> "Smith 2000". I've already managed to do this. Now, each entry in the 
>> bibliography should begin with the same string that was used to 
>> identify it within the text. So, the above example should look 
>> something like this:
>>
>> Smith 2000<tab>John Smith. Generic Book Title. Whatever Publishing 
>> Company, New York 2000.
>>
>> I know I can get the "John Smith" by using \insertauthors in 
>> \setuppublicationlayout. But how do I get just the last name? The 
>> answer is probably so simple that I should be ashamed that I can't 
>> figure it out by myself but I haven't quite gotten the hang of ConTeXt 
>> and TeX yet...
> 
> Ah, so it turns out you're looking for something else altogether. In 
> your case, you want a special kind of label for your bibliographic list. 
> See if Aditya's hack gives the result you want. But generally speaking, 
> I think your setup is pretty common in the humanities, so it should be 
> added as a key to the processactionlist in l. 308-316 of bibl-tra.mkiv. 
> Hans, Taco, is there a proper syntax for getting the lastname and year 
> of the current bib item?

The best approach may be to put the lastname+space+year in the 's'
key, and use

   \setuppublications[refcommand=short,
                      numbering=short]

Best wishes,
Taco

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Need help with bibliography

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On Sep 21, 2009, at 9:54 AM, Taco Hoekwater wrote:

> The best approach may be to put the lastname+space+year in the 's'
> key, and use
>
>  \setuppublications[refcommand=short,
>                     numbering=short]

You been by massaging the bbl file with the help of a clever lua script?

Thomas
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Re: Need help with bibliography

[Taco Hoekwater]

Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
> 
> On Sep 21, 2009, at 9:54 AM, Taco Hoekwater wrote:
> 
>> The best approach may be to put the lastname+space+year in the 's'
>> key, and use
>>
>>  \setuppublications[refcommand=short,
>>                     numbering=short]
> 
> You been by massaging the bbl file with the help of a clever lua script?

Yes (and/or altering the bst file)

Best wishes,
Taco
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