* mkiv math delimiters and <|>
@ 2009-11-13 9:03 Mojca Miklavec
2009-11-14 22:21 ` Aditya Mahajan
0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread
From: Mojca Miklavec @ 2009-11-13 9:03 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users
Hello,
I have tried to compile an old document (written in mkii times). Among
other problems that I yet need to isolate, the following minimal
example doesn't want to compile: $\bigl| x \bigr>$ since <|> aren't
recognized as candidates for delimiters. There is a workaround of
course (using \langle, \rangle, ... instead of <>), but the three
characters are just way too handy to use.
I suppose that the behaviour in mkii comes from these lines:
\definemathcharacter [<] [nothing] [sy] ["68] [ex] ["0A]
\definemathcharacter [>] [nothing] [sy] ["69] [ex] ["0B]
But I'm not sure where mkiv could be changed.
I have tried to use
adobename="greater",
...
mathspec={
{ class="binary", name="gt" },
{ class="close", name="rbrace" },
},
but without any success.
Mojca
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-13 9:03 mkiv math delimiters and <|> Mojca Miklavec @ 2009-11-14 22:21 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 6:06 ` Taco Hoekwater 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Aditya Mahajan @ 2009-11-14 22:21 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users [-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1405 bytes --] On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 4:03 AM, Mojca Miklavec < mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote: > Hello, > > I have tried to compile an old document (written in mkii times). Among > other problems that I yet need to isolate, the following minimal > example doesn't want to compile: $\bigl| x \bigr>$ since <|> aren't > recognized as candidates for delimiters. There is a workaround of > course (using \langle, \rangle, ... instead of <>), but the three > characters are just way too handy to use. > | works fine here. < and > don't. I did not know that \left< is equivalent to \left\langle even in plain tex. I suppose that the behaviour in mkii comes from these lines: > > \definemathcharacter [<] [nothing] [sy] ["68] [ex] ["0A] > \definemathcharacter [>] [nothing] [sy] ["69] [ex] ["0B] > I guess mkii is imitating plain tex here. (Though, I could not find how this is happening in plain tex) > But I'm not sure where mkiv could be changed. > I don't know how to do this. < should behave like a rel without a \left, and like a delimited with \left. > I have tried to use > adobename="greater", > ... > mathspec={ > { class="binary", name="gt" }, > { class="close", name="rbrace" }, > }, > but without any success. > rbrace!!. Probabably you want rangle. You can change the order of the two, and then > will map to rangle, but you will have to use \gt to get the relation symbol. Aditya [-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 2337 bytes --] [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/plain, Size: 486 bytes --] ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-14 22:21 ` Aditya Mahajan @ 2009-11-15 6:06 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 6:51 ` Aditya Mahajan 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 6:06 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users Aditya Mahajan wrote: > On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 4:03 AM, Mojca Miklavec < > mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I have tried to compile an old document (written in mkii times). Among >> other problems that I yet need to isolate, the following minimal >> example doesn't want to compile: $\bigl| x \bigr>$ since <|> aren't >> recognized as candidates for delimiters. There is a workaround of >> course (using \langle, \rangle, ... instead of <>), but the three >> characters are just way too handy to use. >> > > | works fine here. < and > don't. I did not know that \left< is equivalent > to \left\langle even in plain tex. > > I suppose that the behaviour in mkii comes from these lines: >> \definemathcharacter [<] [nothing] [sy] ["68] [ex] ["0A] >> \definemathcharacter [>] [nothing] [sy] ["69] [ex] ["0B] >> > > I guess mkii is imitating plain tex here. (Though, I could not find how this > is happening in plain tex) From plain.tex: \mathcode`\<="313C \delcode`\<="26830A The first (\mathcode) controls standalone use, the second (\delcode) use as a delimiter. Both can be set at the same time, and that second one got lost in the conversion, probably because it has a dedicated slot in Unicode (U+0x27E8, MATHEMATICAL LEFT ANGLE BRACKET). Perhaps this can be done with the mathspec field in char-def.lua, but I do not know how? Best wishes, Taco ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-15 6:06 ` Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 6:51 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 7:11 ` Taco Hoekwater 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Aditya Mahajan @ 2009-11-15 6:51 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users [-- Attachment #1: Type: TEXT/PLAIN, Size: 1805 bytes --] On Sun, 15 Nov 2009, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > Aditya Mahajan wrote: >> On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 4:03 AM, Mojca Miklavec < >> mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I have tried to compile an old document (written in mkii times). Among >>> other problems that I yet need to isolate, the following minimal >>> example doesn't want to compile: $\bigl| x \bigr>$ since <|> aren't >>> recognized as candidates for delimiters. There is a workaround of >>> course (using \langle, \rangle, ... instead of <>), but the three >>> characters are just way too handy to use. >>> >> >> | works fine here. < and > don't. I did not know that \left< is equivalent >> to \left\langle even in plain tex. >> >> I suppose that the behaviour in mkii comes from these lines: >>> \definemathcharacter [<] [nothing] [sy] ["68] [ex] ["0A] >>> \definemathcharacter [>] [nothing] [sy] ["69] [ex] ["0B] >>> >> >> I guess mkii is imitating plain tex here. (Though, I could not find how >> this >> is happening in plain tex) > > From plain.tex: > > \mathcode`\<="313C > \delcode`\<="26830A > > The first (\mathcode) controls standalone use, the second (\delcode) > use as a delimiter. Both can be set at the same time, and that second > one got lost in the conversion, probably because it has a dedicated > slot in Unicode (U+0x27E8, MATHEMATICAL LEFT ANGLE BRACKET). > > Perhaps this can be done with the mathspec field in char-def.lua, but > I do not know how? The attached patch gives a working solution for lmmath but does not work with cambria. I don't know if the latter is a fault of context mkiv or luatex. In any case, this is a kludge as we have to define a dummy name. It will be better if we could just say name=false. Currently, if I use name=false, \left< gives an error. Aditya [-- Attachment #2: Type: TEXT/PLAIN, Size: 1145 bytes --] diff --git a/char-def.lua b/char-def.lua index 3aec401..990bfd2 100644 --- a/char-def.lua +++ b/char-def.lua @@ -544,8 +544,10 @@ characters.data={ description="LESS-THAN SIGN", direction="on", linebreak="al", - mathclass="binary", - mathname="lt", + mathspec={ + { name="lt", class="binary" } , + { name="ltdelim", class="delimiter" }, + }, mirror=0x003E, unicodeslot=0x003C, }, @@ -568,8 +570,10 @@ characters.data={ description="GREATER-THAN SIGN", direction="on", linebreak="al", - mathclass="binary", - mathname="gt", + mathspec={ + { name="gt", class="binary" } , + { name="gtdelim", class="delimiter" }, + }, mirror=0x003C, unicodeslot=0x003E, }, diff --git a/math-vfu.lua b/math-vfu.lua index 0300bb0..1543833 100644 --- a/math-vfu.lua +++ b/math-vfu.lua @@ -566,6 +566,8 @@ fonts.enc.math["large-to-small"] = { [0x02309] = 0x07, -- rceil [0x0007B] = 0x08, -- { [0x0007D] = 0x09, -- } + [0x0003C] = 0x0A, -- < + [0x0003E] = 0x0B, -- > [0x027E8] = 0x0A, -- < [0x027E9] = 0x0B, -- > [0x0007C] = 0x0C, -- | [-- Attachment #3: Type: text/plain, Size: 486 bytes --] ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-15 6:51 ` Aditya Mahajan @ 2009-11-15 7:11 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 7:37 ` Aditya Mahajan 0 siblings, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 7:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users Aditya Mahajan wrote: > > The attached patch gives a working solution for lmmath but does not work > with cambria. I don't know if the latter is a fault of context mkiv or > luatex. "Does not work" as in: no error, but no delimiter either? That would be a side-effect of Cambria not having defined successors for LESS THAN. Best wishes, Taco ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-15 7:11 ` Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 7:37 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 7:40 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 17:25 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 2 replies; 9+ messages in thread From: Aditya Mahajan @ 2009-11-15 7:37 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users On Sun, 15 Nov 2009, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > Aditya Mahajan wrote: >> >> The attached patch gives a working solution for lmmath but does not work >> with cambria. I don't know if the latter is a fault of context mkiv or >> luatex. > > "Does not work" as in: no error, but no delimiter either? No scaled delimiter. There is no difference between \left< and <. > That would > be a side-effect of Cambria not having defined successors for LESS THAN. I personally do not like this behavior of plain tex, with \left< being same as \left\langle. In the long run, all such delimiters should be defined similar to mathml fences, \definemathfence[average][left=\langle, right=\rangle, scale=auto|none] etc. Should we be really supporting this in MKIV? Aditya ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-15 7:37 ` Aditya Mahajan @ 2009-11-15 7:40 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 17:26 ` Hans Hagen 2009-11-15 17:25 ` Hans Hagen 1 sibling, 1 reply; 9+ messages in thread From: Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 7:40 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users Aditya Mahajan wrote: > I personally do not like this behavior of plain tex, with \left< being > same as \left\langle. In the long run, all such delimiters should be > defined similar to mathml fences, > > \definemathfence[average][left=\langle, right=\rangle, scale=auto|none] > > etc. Should we be really supporting this in MKIV? That is a question for Mojca and Hans, I think. FWIW, I do not like it that much either, as there *is* a proper character for this nowadays. Best wishes, Taco ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-15 7:40 ` Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 17:26 ` Hans Hagen 0 siblings, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2009-11-15 17:26 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users Taco Hoekwater wrote: > Aditya Mahajan wrote: >> I personally do not like this behavior of plain tex, with \left< being >> same as \left\langle. In the long run, all such delimiters should be >> defined similar to mathml fences, >> >> \definemathfence[average][left=\langle, right=\rangle, scale=auto|none] >> >> etc. Should we be really supporting this in MKIV? > > That is a question for Mojca and Hans, I think. FWIW, I do not like it > that much either, as there *is* a proper character for this nowadays. indeed we should stick to what unicode provides; if some symbols is missing in lm or tx/pr ... we could fake it as i don't like returning to the times where each exception became a command with per font a different one Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
* Re: mkiv math delimiters and <|> 2009-11-15 7:37 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 7:40 ` Taco Hoekwater @ 2009-11-15 17:25 ` Hans Hagen 1 sibling, 0 replies; 9+ messages in thread From: Hans Hagen @ 2009-11-15 17:25 UTC (permalink / raw) To: mailing list for ConTeXt users Aditya Mahajan wrote: > On Sun, 15 Nov 2009, Taco Hoekwater wrote: > >> Aditya Mahajan wrote: >>> >>> The attached patch gives a working solution for lmmath but does not >>> work with cambria. I don't know if the latter is a fault of context >>> mkiv or luatex. >> >> "Does not work" as in: no error, but no delimiter either? > > No scaled delimiter. There is no difference between \left< and <. > >> That would >> be a side-effect of Cambria not having defined successors for LESS THAN. > > I personally do not like this behavior of plain tex, with \left< being > same as \left\langle. In the long run, all such delimiters should be > defined similar to mathml fences, > > \definemathfence[average][left=\langle, right=\rangle, scale=auto|none] > > etc. Should we be really supporting this in MKIV? i don't know. what i observe is that when we use \left\langle always (which is what we do in mathml in order to play safe) the first level symbol is always a bit bigger than just an < maybe it's just a matter of thresholds or prepending a smaller < to the list Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl ----------------------------------------------------------------- ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 9+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2009-11-15 17:26 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 9+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2009-11-13 9:03 mkiv math delimiters and <|> Mojca Miklavec 2009-11-14 22:21 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 6:06 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 6:51 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 7:11 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 7:37 ` Aditya Mahajan 2009-11-15 7:40 ` Taco Hoekwater 2009-11-15 17:26 ` Hans Hagen 2009-11-15 17:25 ` Hans Hagen
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