"standard" for bibliographies

"standard" for bibliographies

[Mojca Miklavec]

There used to be discussions about some "common standard" for storing
bibliographies.

I'm testing
    http://www.mendeley.com/
and would like to export to ConTeXt-friendly database (bibtex export
is supported). It seems that for that one would have to use
    http://citationstyles.org/
so I will try to figure out if "The Citation Style Language" can be
used to export data to what is currently required by ConTeXt. But if
you are thinking about xml-based format for the future, it might be
worth taking a look at the second website.

Mojca
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Re: "standard" for bibliographies

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On 05/10/2012 01:29 PM, Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> There used to be discussions about some "common standard" for storing
> bibliographies.
>
> I'm testing
>      http://www.mendeley.com/
> and would like to export to ConTeXt-friendly database (bibtex export
> is supported). It seems that for that one would have to use
>      http://citationstyles.org/
> so I will try to figure out if "The Citation Style Language" can be
> used to export data to what is currently required by ConTeXt. But if
> you are thinking about xml-based format for the future, it might be
> worth taking a look at the second website.

Just a very quick note: CSL has been developed by Bruce D'Arcus, who 
used to be pretty active on the context list a couple of years ago, so 
you might be able to get some help there. I tried using zotero for a 
while and also looked at CSL, but in the end, I gave up. It is based on 
xml, but I couldn't get my head around it and was just hitting too many 
limitations. But that may have been me, maybe you have more success!

All best

Thomas
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Re: "standard" for bibliographies

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

On 05/10/2012 01:35 PM, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
> but I couldn't get my head around it and was just hitting too many
> limitations

And a short follow-up (because Mojca's question made me google this 
again): one glaring omission to me was the lack of support for 
cross-references within bibliographical lists (e.g., you have a chapter 
in a book and want to refer back to item X in your list). This has been 
asked again and again on the zotero forums. Answer 2007: yes, this is 
coming real soon now. 2008: Well, it needs support from CSL, and may be 
a bit longer. 2009-2011: more requests, no reply. 2012, one of the 
developers: not any time soon... This makes CSL worthless to me, I'm 
afraid. Reference (there are more threads): 
http://forums.zotero.org/discussion/3031/book-section-link-to-book-entered-once/

Thomas
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Re: "standard" for bibliographies

[Pontus Lurcock]

On Thu 10 May 2012, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:

>  one glaring omission to me was the lack of support for
> cross-references within bibliographical lists (e.g., you have a
> chapter in a book and want to refer back to item X in your list).
> This has been asked again and again on the zotero forums. Answer
> 2007: yes, this is coming real soon now. 2008: Well, it needs
> support from CSL, and may be a bit longer. 2009-2011: more requests,
> no reply. 2012, one of the developers: not any time soon... This
> makes CSL worthless to me, I'm afraid.

This is certainly a limitation for Zotero (I noticed it as well when I
tried it out a little while ago) but I'm not sure that it's a problem
for CSL. As I understand it, CSL defines formatting for typeset
citations and bibliography entries. It's not meant to handle tasks
such as cross-referencing chapter entries to their book entries --
that should be the job of the software (Zotero, Mendeley, etc.) which
is using CSL for its formatting. My experience with CSL is limited,
though, so I could be wrong about this.

At any rate, CSL seems to be achieving a critical mass of usage and
support, and there's a huge number of predefined, publicly available
styles ( https://github.com/citation-style-language/styles/wiki ).

Pont
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Re: "standard" for bibliographies

[Hans Hagen]

On 10-5-2012 19:25, Pontus Lurcock wrote:
> On Thu 10 May 2012, Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
>
>>   one glaring omission to me was the lack of support for
>> cross-references within bibliographical lists (e.g., you have a
>> chapter in a book and want to refer back to item X in your list).
>> This has been asked again and again on the zotero forums. Answer
>> 2007: yes, this is coming real soon now. 2008: Well, it needs
>> support from CSL, and may be a bit longer. 2009-2011: more requests,
>> no reply. 2012, one of the developers: not any time soon... This
>> makes CSL worthless to me, I'm afraid.
>
> This is certainly a limitation for Zotero (I noticed it as well when I
> tried it out a little while ago) but I'm not sure that it's a problem
> for CSL. As I understand it, CSL defines formatting for typeset
> citations and bibliography entries. It's not meant to handle tasks
> such as cross-referencing chapter entries to their book entries --
> that should be the job of the software (Zotero, Mendeley, etc.) which
> is using CSL for its formatting. My experience with CSL is limited,
> though, so I could be wrong about this.
>
> At any rate, CSL seems to be achieving a critical mass of usage and
> support, and there's a huge number of predefined, publicly available
> styles ( https://github.com/citation-style-language/styles/wiki ).

It should not be that hard to support it if only I had a reason to spend 
time on it (as I never need to use citations etc).

Hans


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