Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[John Culleton]

On Monday 10 February 2003 13:03, Maarten Sneep wrote:
> Hello,
>
> On Mon, 10 Feb 2003, Hans Hagen wrote:
> > At 12:58 PM 2/10/2003 +0100, Maarten Sneep wrote:
> > >``Welcome to typeface hell'', describes my feelings correctly. I'm
> > > trying to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX (urw
> > > palatino, times, helvetica, courier and various others, you know
> > > the list) in ec encoding.
> > >
-- 
Never forget that Context uses pdfetex which derives from plain
tex which uses the tex primitives. So you can always define a font
using the \font statement and do font-switching in plain-tex mode.
Indeed that is probably the best way to start off. It avoids massive
frustration. 

Of course it does not comport with many of the advanced features of
Context so it is best just a stop-gap. But it relieves frustration and
gets your project off the ground.

\font\rm=pncr8r at 10pt

will work, and now you have a Palatino Roman font for body text. No
muss, no fuss, no misery.  Just issue the command \rm when you want
that font. 

This also works, although it is probably wrong :-)

 \definebodyfont[10pt,12pt,14pt,16pt][rm][tf=pncr8r sa 1, bf=pncb8r sa 
1, it=pncri8r sa 1, sl=pncro8r sa 1, bs=pncbo8r sa 1, bi=pncbi8r sa 1]

After you get to that point you can begin to explore the marvelous
intricacies and idiosyncrasies of Context font handling in its full
glory. But try something that works, first. 

John Culleton
Subscribe to the Self_Publisher's Newsletter!
Just send an email to selfpub@wexfordpress.com

Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Maarten Sneep]

Hi Contexters,

``Welcome to typeface hell'', describes my feelings correctly. I'm trying
to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX (urw palatino,
times, helvetica, courier and various others, you know the list) in ec
encoding.

I thinks I followed the instructions correctly, but still no luck. I'm
using teTeX 2.0 with the TeXLive binaries (the ``Gerben Wierda''
distribution) on Mac OS X 10.2.3 (Jaguar). The frustrating bit is that in
LaTeX everything comes preconfigured, but for ConTeXt I have to do it
myself. I also use this as a testcase before buying the lucida typefaces
(I want to be very sure I can install my fonts before shelling out the
money).

Here's a summary of what I've tried and noticed:

1 - I've used texfont on the type-ftm.dat file in the default installation
    of the distribution. This fails, because the ec.enc file isn't found.
    This seems correct, as it is named EC.enc (note that this is on hfs, a
    case insensitive system). I renamed the file to ec.enc and tried again.

2 - This time the encoding vector is found, and some files are generated.
    However I get a nice bunch of rectangles, I assume mean that some
    glyphs are missing. In fact I think the only glyphs that showed up are
    `borrowed' from Computer Modern.

Help!

My direct questions:
a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
    using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)
b - What were the exact commands that you used? Can you send me a simple
    test file?
c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?
d - Do other platforms have the same problems with teTeX 2.0 (Hans: What
    version of teTeX are you using on your linux system, since at your
    place it obviously works ;-)

Thanks in advance for any help,

Maarten Sneep

>>>--------------------------------------------------
2 + 2 = 5                       (George Orwell, 1984)

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Hans Hagen]

At 12:58 PM 2/10/2003 +0100, Maarten Sneep wrote:
>Hi Contexters,
>
>``Welcome to typeface hell'', describes my feelings correctly. I'm trying
>to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX (urw palatino,
>times, helvetica, courier and various others, you know the list) in ec
>encoding.
>
>I thinks I followed the instructions correctly, but still no luck. I'm
>using teTeX 2.0 with the TeXLive binaries (the ``Gerben Wierda''
>distribution) on Mac OS X 10.2.3 (Jaguar). The frustrating bit is that in
>LaTeX everything comes preconfigured, but for ConTeXt I have to do it
>myself. I also use this as a testcase before buying the lucida typefaces
>(I want to be very sure I can install my fonts before shelling out the
>money).
>
>Here's a summary of what I've tried and noticed:
>
>1 - I've used texfont on the type-ftm.dat file in the default installation
>     of the distribution. This fails, because the ec.enc file isn't found.
>     This seems correct, as it is named EC.enc (note that this is on hfs, a
>     case insensitive system). I renamed the file to ec.enc and tried again.

strange, i noticed some problems with the texnansi vector (different 
versions) btu not with ec

>2 - This time the encoding vector is found, and some files are generated.
>     However I get a nice bunch of rectangles, I assume mean that some
>     glyphs are missing. In fact I think the only glyphs that showed up are
>     `borrowed' from Computer Modern.

are you sure that you said \useencodign [ec] ?


>Help!
>
>My direct questions:
>a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
>     using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)

all these fonts should work ok, did you try

\usetypescript [berry] [ec]
\setupencoding[default=ec]

......

>b - What were the exact commands that you used? Can you send me a simple
>     test file?
>c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?

this is new to me, in my opinion all filenames should be lowercase

>d - Do other platforms have the same problems with teTeX 2.0 (Hans: What
>     version of teTeX are you using on your linux system, since at your
>     place it obviously works ;-)

tex live

but, there are mac users on this list so ...


Hans
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                       Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
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Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Maarten Sneep]

Hello,

On Mon, 10 Feb 2003, Hans Hagen wrote:

> At 12:58 PM 2/10/2003 +0100, Maarten Sneep wrote:
> >``Welcome to typeface hell'', describes my feelings correctly. I'm trying
> >to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX (urw palatino,
> >times, helvetica, courier and various others, you know the list) in ec
> >encoding.
> >
> >I thinks I followed the instructions correctly, but still no luck. I'm
> >using teTeX 2.0 with the TeXLive binaries (the ``Gerben Wierda''
> >distribution) on Mac OS X 10.2.3 (Jaguar). The frustrating bit is that in
> >LaTeX everything comes preconfigured, but for ConTeXt I have to do it
> >myself. I also use this as a testcase before buying the lucida typefaces
> >(I want to be very sure I can install my fonts before shelling out the
> >money).
> >
> >Here's a summary of what I've tried and noticed:
> >
> >1 - I've used texfont on the type-ftm.dat file in the default installation
> >     of the distribution. This fails, because the ec.enc file isn't found.
> >     This seems correct, as it is named EC.enc (note that this is on hfs, a
> >     case insensitive system). I renamed the file to ec.enc and tried again.
>
> strange, i noticed some problems with the texnansi vector (different
> versions) btu not with ec

I just checked a recent version of SuSE linux (8.1), which still uses a
beat of teTeX 2, where I find ./dvips/base/EC.enc in the texmf tree.

> >2 - This time the encoding vector is found, and some files are generated.
> >     However I get a nice bunch of rectangles, I assume mean that some
> >     glyphs are missing. In fact I think the only glyphs that showed up are
> >     `borrowed' from Computer Modern.
>
> are you sure that you said \useencodign [ec] ?

Where should I have said that? (so apparently I didn't follow the
instructions...)

> >My direct questions:
> >a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
> >     using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)
>
> all these fonts should work ok, did you try
>
> \usetypescript [berry] [ec]
> \setupencoding[default=ec]

I'll try again this evening. What should be the extra command for using
the standard postscript fonts, is that still \setupbodyfont[pos,10pt]?

> >c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?
>
> this is new to me, in my opinion all filenames should be lowercase

There is an cork.enc file. Since the ec encoding is also known as the Cork
encoding, this might be something. It seems to be something in the new
teTeX, unrelated to the Mac.

> >d - Do other platforms have the same problems with teTeX 2.0 (Hans: What
> >     version of teTeX are you using on your linux system, since at your
> >     place it obviously works ;-)
>
> tex live
>
> but, there are mac users on this list so ...

I'll wait and see if some of them show up.

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Bruce D'Arcus]

On Monday, February 10, 2003, at 07:42  AM, Hans Hagen wrote:

>> d - Do other platforms have the same problems with teTeX 2.0 (Hans: 
>> What
>>     version of teTeX are you using on your linux system, since at your
>>     place it obviously works ;-)
>
> tex live
>
> but, there are mac users on this list so ...

I haven't tried to use these in awhile, but I recall having similar 
problems.  All the files are there for LaTeX support, so I had hoped to 
see a ConTeXt typescriptfile and maybe some environment files to access 
the fonts.

Bruce

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Patrick Gundlach]

Maarten Sneep <sneep@nat.vu.nl> writes:

Hello Maarten,

> ``Welcome to typeface hell'', describes my feelings correctly. 

Welcome to the club.


> I'm trying to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX
> (urw palatino, times, helvetica, courier and various others, you
> know the list) in ec encoding.

I'll send you a testfile off list. Please tell me if it is working. A
couple days ago I have sent a testfile (I think it was to Wolfgang)
with a changed berry typeface (from type-enc.tex).

> I thinks I followed the instructions correctly, but still no luck. I'm
> using teTeX 2.0 with the TeXLive binaries (the ``Gerben Wierda''
> distribution) on Mac OS X 10.2.3 (Jaguar). The frustrating bit is that in

could you please send me the psfonts.map and pdftex.map files from
your distribution?

> 1 - I've used texfont on the type-ftm.dat file in the default installation

Oh you don't need to reinstall your fonts! The TeX font files already
a complete mess in an average TeX distribution. No need to increase
this mess. 

> My direct questions:
> a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
>     using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)

I am not using tetex 2.0 on Mac OS X. Only texlive. And i had a
successfull attempt.

> b - What were the exact commands that you used? Can you send me a simple
>     test file?

Yes.

> c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?

(I am not using texfont)


Patrick

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Adam Lindsay]

Maarten Sneep said this at Mon, 10 Feb 2003 12:58:39 +0100:

>a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
>    using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)

Yes, but noy , I did with TeXLive7 on MacOSX, at least, which is a
superset of GW's distro.

>b - What were the exact commands that you used? Can you send me a simple
>    test file?

The key thing for me (perhaps obvious to others) was making sure the
source font tree was in the same place as the destination tree, so...

  cd texmf/fonts/afm
  sudo mv bit bitstrea
  cd ../../..
  cp -R texmf/fonts/afm texmf/fonts/tfm texmf-local/fonts
  cp -R texmf/fonts/type1 texmf/fonts/vf texmf-local/fonts
  cd ~/Documents/temp
  texfont /usr/local/teTeX/texmf/context/data/type-tmf.dat --en=texnansi
         --fontroot=/usr/local/teTeX/texmf-local --install --makepath

Re-reading your email, I'm not sure that'll be exactly what you need, but
it's what I learned, at least.

>c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?

I used the Hans-suggested texnansi encoding, which may have helped. I did
a diff between GW/tetex2.0's new EC.enc and the older ec.enc. Just one
line different:
  diff texmf/dvips/base/ec.enc share/texmf/dvips/base/EC.enc
67c67
<   /ldot /zacute /zcaron /zdotaccent /ij /exclamdown /questiondown /sterling
---
>   /ydieresis /zacute /zcaron /zdotaccent /ij /exclamdown /questiondown
/sterling

>d - Do other platforms have the same problems with teTeX 2.0 (Hans: What
>    version of teTeX are you using on your linux system, since at your
>    place it obviously works ;-)

I compiled the teTeX binaries myself and overlaid them on top of my
TeXLive tree. Only my MP graph problems so far suggest it might not have
been the best idea. :) I haven't dealt with the rest of the teTeX 2.0
tree, yet.

Cheers,
adam


-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
 Adam T. Lindsay                      atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
 Computing Dept, Lancaster University   +44(0)1524/594.537
 Lancaster, LA1 4YR, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/593.608
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Maarten Sneep]

Thanks for the advice. No luck yet. Thanks for the diff, I don't think it 
should make a lot of difference. I'll check with the texfont manual, I think 
the encodings are displayed there. (what does an /ldot look like anyway :-)

On Monday 10 February 2003 15:30, you wrote:
> Maarten Sneep said this at Mon, 10 Feb 2003 12:58:39 +0100:
> >a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
> >    using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)
>
> Yes, but noy , I did with TeXLive7 on MacOSX, at least, which is a
> superset of GW's distro.

With some bugfixes: bitsream is correclty named.

> >b - What were the exact commands that you used? Can you send me a simple
> >    test file?
>
> The key thing for me (perhaps obvious to others) was making sure the
> source font tree was in the same place as the destination tree, so...

>   texfont /usr/local/teTeX/texmf/context/data/type-tmf.dat --en=texnansi
>          --fontroot=/usr/local/teTeX/texmf-local --install --makepath

I tried this on the main texmf tree (which makes sure that the source and 
dest are the same).

> >c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?
>
> I used the Hans-suggested texnansi encoding, which may have helped. I did
> a diff between GW/tetex2.0's new EC.enc and the older ec.enc. Just one
> line different:
>   diff texmf/dvips/base/ec.enc share/texmf/dvips/base/EC.enc
> 67c67
> <   /ldot /zacute /zcaron /zdotaccent /ij /exclamdown /questiondown
> /sterling ---
>
> >   /ydieresis /zacute /zcaron /zdotaccent /ij /exclamdown /questiondown
>
> /sterling

Thanks.

> >d - Do other platforms have the same problems with teTeX 2.0 (Hans: What
> >    version of teTeX are you using on your linux system, since at your
> >    place it obviously works ;-)
>
> I compiled the teTeX binaries myself and overlaid them on top of my
> TeXLive tree. Only my MP graph problems so far suggest it might not have
> been the best idea. :) I haven't dealt with the rest of the teTeX 2.0
> tree, yet.

That's funny: Gerben uses the other combination: binaries from texlive, texmf 
tree from teTeX and some additions on top.

Kind regards,

Maarten Sneep

Re: Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Maarten Sneep]

Thanks for the suggestions. Here are the results.

On Monday 10 February 2003 15:28, you wrote:
> Maarten Sneep <sneep@nat.vu.nl> writes:
> > I'm trying to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX
> > (urw palatino, times, helvetica, courier and various others, you
> > know the list) in ec encoding.
>
> I'll send you a testfile off list. Please tell me if it is working. A
> couple days ago I have sent a testfile (I think it was to Wolfgang)
> with a changed berry typeface (from type-enc.tex).

With \usetypescriptfile[debian] it is working. The standard way (as defined 
by Hans Hagen) doesn't.

> could you please send me the psfonts.map and pdftex.map files from
> your distribution?

See the attachments.

> > 1 - I've used texfont on the type-ftm.dat file in the default
> > installation
>
> Oh you don't need to reinstall your fonts! The TeX font files already
> a complete mess in an average TeX distribution. No need to increase
> this mess.

But how do you then generate the virtual fonts, or is there some trick in the 
map files to reencode on the fly?

> > My direct questions:
> > a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
> >     using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)
>
> I am not using tetex 2.0 on Mac OS X. Only texlive. And i had a
> successfull attempt.
>
> > b - What were the exact commands that you used? Can you send me a simple
> >     test file?
>
> Yes.
>
> > c - Did you experience the same EC.enc vs ec.enc naming problem?
>
> (I am not using texfont)

But at some point the ec.enc file must be read...

Kind regards,

Maarten Sneep

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Maarten Sneep]

On Monday 10 February 2003 13:42, Hans Hagen wrote:
>At 12:58 PM 2/10/2003 +0100, Maarten Sneep wrote:
>>Hi Contexters,
>>
>>``Welcome to typeface hell'', describes my feelings correctly. I'm trying
>>to use the free postscript fonts that come with teTeX (urw palatino,
>>times, helvetica, courier and various others, you know the list) in ec
>>encoding.

[snip]

>>My direct questions:
>>a - Did anyone succeed in using the free postscript fonts on Mac OS X,
>>     using a distribution that I use (i.e. the most recent version)
>
>
>all these fonts should work ok, did you try
>
>\usetypescript [berry] [ec]
>\setupencoding[default=ec]
>
>.......

Thanks to all who replied. I still didn't have any luck. I do have a longer 
log-file for anyone interested in helping further. It seems slightly specific 
to Mac OS X, so I'll post to that list as well.

Thanks,

Maarten Sneep

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Patrick Gundlach]

Maarten Sneep <sneep@nat.vu.nl> writes:

Hello Maarten,

>> Oh you don't need to reinstall your fonts! The TeX font files already
>> a complete mess in an average TeX distribution. No need to increase
>> this mess.
>
> But how do you then generate the virtual fonts, or is there some trick in the 
> map files to reencode on the fly?

For the basic fonts: they are shipped with the TeX system.
For the additional fonts: fontinst (I don't like it very much) afm2tfm
(don't rename your files). There are others out there. Siep has once
written a replacement for afm2tfm (which I still have to test) and
there is autofont.

> But at some point the ec.enc file must be read...

Only when creating vf's.


Patrick

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Harri Hakula]

It seems that a number of .map files (ec-...) are missing on Mac OS X. 
It is my understanding that  these should have been generated during 
the initialization of the texmf tree? If this is indeed the case, then 
Gerben Wierda no doubt issues a quick fix.

Harri Hakula

On Tuesday, February 11, 2003, at 03:29 PM, Maarten Sneep wrote:

> Thanks to all who replied. I still didn't have any luck. I do have a 
> longer
> log-file for anyone interested in helping further. It seems slightly 
> specific
> to Mac OS X, so I'll post to that list as well.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Maarten Sneep

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Patrick Gundlach]

Harri Hakula <Harri.Hakula@hut.fi> writes:

Hello Harri,

> It seems that a number of .map files (ec-...) are missing on Mac OS
> X.

All TeX-systems that I have seen so far (not very many I have to
admit) use virtual fonts to map from ec to 8r. There was no need so
far for a map file with ec support. Doesn't Gerben's iinstaller-based
TeX system provide the ec virtual fonts?

Patrick

Re: Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Bruce D'Arcus]

On Tuesday, February 11, 2003, at 03:32 PM, Patrick Gundlach wrote:

> All TeX-systems that I have seen so far (not very many I have to
> admit) use virtual fonts to map from ec to 8r. There was no need so
> far for a map file with ec support. Doesn't Gerben's iinstaller-based
> TeX system provide the ec virtual fonts?

Here's what I see when I run the file you posted:

pdftex         : needs map file: original-ams-cmr.map
pdftex         : needs map file: original-ams-euler.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-adobe-utopia.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-bit-charter.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-public-antp.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-public-antt.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-urw-bookman.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-urw-courier.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-urw-helvetica.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-urw-palatino.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-urw-times.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-urw-zapfchan.map
pdftex         : needs map file: original-youngryu-px.map
pdftex         : needs map file: original-youngryu-tx.map
pdftex         : needs map file: ec-bh-lucida.map

I don't really know what's going on, but the above map file names are 
not what I'd expect to see if I ran a similar file in LaTeX.

Bruce

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Patrick Gundlach]

"Bruce D'Arcus" <bdarcus@fastmail.fm> writes:

Hello Bruce,

> Here's what I see when I run the file you posted:
>
> pdftex         : needs map file: original-ams-cmr.map
> pdftex         : needs map file: original-ams-euler.map
> pdftex         : needs map file: ec-adobe-utopia.map
> pdftex         : needs map file: ec-bit-charter.map

[...]


now that you say this... I usually ignore these messages. They always
show up but the fonts work well here. This is because I use the
original map files that are shipped with texlive7 that have the
mappings like 

ptmr8r Times-Roman "TeXBase1Encoding ReEncodeFont" <8r.enc

already built in. Along with the virtual fonts (ec to 8r encoding)
and these map files, there should not be any problem!

> I don't really know what's going on, 

neither do I ;-)

> but the above map file names are not what I'd expect to see if I ran
> a similar file in LaTeX.

Right. LaTeX does not use the run-time loading of mapfiles.


Pat

Re: Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Hans Hagen]

At 10:34 PM 2/11/2003 +0100, Patrick Gundlach wrote:
>"Bruce D'Arcus" <bdarcus@fastmail.fm> writes:
>
>Hello Bruce,
>
> > Here's what I see when I run the file you posted:
> >
> > pdftex         : needs map file: original-ams-cmr.map
> > pdftex         : needs map file: original-ams-euler.map
> > pdftex         : needs map file: ec-adobe-utopia.map
> > pdftex         : needs map file: ec-bit-charter.map
>
>[...]
>
>
>now that you say this... I usually ignore these messages. They always

no problem, they're just a warning that in case you don't have some global 
file (as you have) you should use these

>show up but the fonts work well here. This is because I use the
>original map files that are shipped with texlive7 that have the
>mappings like
>
>ptmr8r Times-Roman "TeXBase1Encoding ReEncodeFont" <8r.enc
>
>already built in. Along with the virtual fonts (ec to 8r encoding)
>and these map files, there should not be any problem!

although ... here i prefer cleaned up files,

   name <encoding <pfbname

in order to avoid problems with names Font-Names and embedding

> > I don't really know what's going on,
>
>neither do I ;-)

just a warning

> > but the above map file names are not what I'd expect to see if I ran
> > a similar file in LaTeX.
>
>Right. LaTeX does not use the run-time loading of mapfiles.

here i've split up the files (otherwise they become anoyingly large) 
(actually, this is why latex pdftex people have proposed to patch pdftex, 
because it's so slow on the large map files, something i never noticed 
since i use small ones -)

Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
                       Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
  tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
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                        information: http://www.pragma-ade.com/roadmap.pdf
                     documentation: http://www.pragma-ade.com/showcase.pdf
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Patrick Gundlach]

Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> writes:

Hello out there,

>>Right. LaTeX does not use the run-time loading of mapfiles.
>
> here i've split up the files (otherwise they become anoyingly large)
> (actually, this is why latex pdftex people have proposed to patch
> pdftex, because it's so slow on the large map files, something i never
> noticed since i use small ones -)

If I remember correctly there was a sub-optimal sorting algorithm
used. With 3000+ lines in my mapfile this is getting very slow :( And
even in tetex 2.0 this is (as I have heard) not fixed.


Patrick

Re: Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Hartmut Henkel]

Don't know what is slow for your PC. I'm just looking into pdftex
mapfile.c, and there is in line 142 a for-loop for checking duplicate
mapfile entries (tfm). This runs some 3000*0.5*3000 times for parsing
your mapfile lines, always checking for some strcmp() == 0. You can
speed this up if you put a line "if (*(e->tfm_name) != *buf) continue;"
into the begin of the for-loop (you need braces then!). Then the loop
goes to the next map line already, if the 1st letters do not match. I
have generated some 3000 random mapfile entries for testing (letters
equally distributed). time pdftex on an almost empty TeX file "A \bye"
tells:

without patch
real    0m1.463s
user    0m1.370s
sys     0m0.020s

with patch checking inequality of 1st letters
real    0m0.990s
user    0m0.880s
sys     0m0.030s

So there might be some corner for improvement. Using strcmp() the
reverse way seems not to speed up things; how to write a more
sophisticated inequality-checker?

Greetings Hartmut


On Tue, 11 Feb 2003, Patrick Gundlach wrote:

> Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> writes:
>
> Hello out there,
>
> >>Right. LaTeX does not use the run-time loading of mapfiles.
> >
> > here i've split up the files (otherwise they become anoyingly large)
> > (actually, this is why latex pdftex people have proposed to patch
> > pdftex, because it's so slow on the large map files, something i never
> > noticed since i use small ones -)
>
> If I remember correctly there was a sub-optimal sorting algorithm
> used. With 3000+ lines in my mapfile this is getting very slow :( And
> even in tetex 2.0 this is (as I have heard) not fixed.
>
>
> Patrick

mapfiles and pdftex

[Patrick Gundlach]

Hartmut Henkel <hartmut_henkel@gmx.de> writes:

Hello Hartmut,

> Don't know what is slow for your PC. 

at least two seconds just for the map file.

> I'm just looking into pdftex mapfile.c, about 2and there is in line 142 a
> for-loop for checking duplicate mapfile entries (tfm). This runs
> some 3000*0.5*3000 times for parsing your mapfile lines, always
> checking for some strcmp() == 0. You can speed this up if you put a
> line "if (*(e->tfm_name) != *buf) continue;" 

But this also looks like O(n^2) to me. With 3000*3000 is some 9 million!

> So there might be some corner for improvement. Using strcmp() the
> reverse way seems not to speed up things; how to write a more
> sophisticated inequality-checker?

Heiko stated that he used a hash table for this. This will speed up
things dramatically.

But this is getting slightly off topic, isn't it?


Pat

Re: mapfiles and pdftex

[Hans Hagen]

At 08:53 AM 2/12/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>Hartmut Henkel <hartmut_henkel@gmx.de> writes:
>
>Hello Hartmut,
>
> > Don't know what is slow for your PC.
>
>at least two seconds just for the map file.
>
> > I'm just looking into pdftex mapfile.c, about 2and there is in line 142 a
> > for-loop for checking duplicate mapfile entries (tfm). This runs
> > some 3000*0.5*3000 times for parsing your mapfile lines, always
> > checking for some strcmp() == 0. You can speed this up if you put a
> > line "if (*(e->tfm_name) != *buf) continue;"
>
>But this also looks like O(n^2) to me. With 3000*3000 is some 9 million!
>
> > So there might be some corner for improvement. Using strcmp() the
> > reverse way seems not to speed up things; how to write a more
> > sophisticated inequality-checker?
>
>Heiko stated that he used a hash table for this. This will speed up
>things dramatically.

but if i remember right he only looked at the first 8 chars (assuming 
berry) which is not that useful for texnansi-* files -)

the best way (imo) is to let later entries overload previous ones, so not 
much checking is needed at all;

>But this is getting slightly off topic, isn't it?

future versions of pdftex will solve this problem;

another thing is reading map files after the first page is shiped out; that 
would permit us to postpone map file loading and speed things up a bit; 
currently, if you want to use a specific font on page 328 you must make 
sure that the associated map file is loaded before page 1 is finished!

Hans


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
                       Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
  tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
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Re: mapfiles and pdftex

[Jens-Uwe Morawski]

On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:09:31 +0100
Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:

> At 08:53 AM 2/12/2003 +0100, you wrote:
> >Hartmut Henkel <hartmut_henkel@gmx.de> writes:

> > > So there might be some corner for improvement. Using strcmp() the
> > > reverse way seems not to speed up things; how to write a more
> > > sophisticated inequality-checker?
> >
> >Heiko stated that he used a hash table for this. This will speed up
> >things dramatically.
> 
> but if i remember right he only looked at the first 8 chars (assuming 
> berry) which is not that useful for texnansi-* files -)
> 
> the best way (imo) is to let later entries overload previous ones, so not 
> much checking is needed at all;

I remember this discussion on the pdftex-list and can still not understand
why we should look for overloaded entries. pdftex should take the first match.

pdftex --mapfile=some.map overrides the default of the pdftex.cnf
Additional \pdfmapfile in the tex-code get higher priority than
the settings in pdftex.cnf or --mapfile and will be read first.
Thus, if pdftex has found all required fonts it can stop reading
the map-files, which can speed-up the process dramatically.
In most documents pdftex has only to read 4-6 map files with about
10-20 entries.


Jens

Re: Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Jens-Uwe Morawski]

On Tue, 11 Feb 2003 15:25:15 +0100
Patrick Gundlach <pg@levana.de> wrote:

> Maarten Sneep <sneep@nat.vu.nl> writes:
> 
> Hello Maarten,
> 
> >> Oh you don't need to reinstall your fonts! The TeX font files already
> >> a complete mess in an average TeX distribution. No need to increase
> >> this mess.
> >
> > But how do you then generate the virtual fonts, or is there some trick in the 
> > map files to reencode on the fly?
> 
> For the basic fonts: they are shipped with the TeX system.

The VFs are provided by the Latex PSNFSS system. Thus, if you don't 
select LaTeX support during TeXLive installation the VFs will not be
installed. Maybe this is the case in other distributions as well.

Jens

Re: Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Berend de Boer]

Hartmut Henkel <hartmut_henkel@gmx.de> writes:

> speed this up if you put a line "if (*(e->tfm_name) != *buf) continue;"
> into the begin of the for-loop (you need braces then!). Then the loop
> goes to the next map line already, if the 1st letters do not
> match. I


Cute trick! Who maintains pdftex nowadays? Please sent it to the maintainers.

-- 
Live long and prosper,

Berend de Boer

Re: Using the free PS Fonts with ConTeXt

[Patrick Gundlach]

Jens-Uwe Morawski <morawski@gmx.net> writes:

Hello,

> The VFs are provided by the Latex PSNFSS system. Thus, if you don't 
> select LaTeX support during TeXLive installation the VFs will not be
> installed. Maybe this is the case in other distributions as well.

Uh, that is a good point. Thanks for the hint. 

Patrick

Re: mapfiles and pdftex

[Hans Hagen]

At 03:07 PM 2/12/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:09:31 +0100
>Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:
>
> > At 08:53 AM 2/12/2003 +0100, you wrote:
> > >Hartmut Henkel <hartmut_henkel@gmx.de> writes:
>
> > > > So there might be some corner for improvement. Using strcmp() the
> > > > reverse way seems not to speed up things; how to write a more
> > > > sophisticated inequality-checker?
> > >
> > >Heiko stated that he used a hash table for this. This will speed up
> > >things dramatically.
> >
> > but if i remember right he only looked at the first 8 chars (assuming
> > berry) which is not that useful for texnansi-* files -)
> >
> > the best way (imo) is to let later entries overload previous ones, so not
> > much checking is needed at all;
>
>I remember this discussion on the pdftex-list and can still not understand
>why we should look for overloaded entries. pdftex should take the first match.

no, the last one, since users may want to overload the defaults (quite 
important if you use pseudo caps/slant/extend)

Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
                       Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
  tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
                        information: http://www.pragma-ade.com/roadmap.pdf
                     documentation: http://www.pragma-ade.com/showcase.pdf
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: mapfiles and pdftex

[Jens-Uwe Morawski]

On Thu, 13 Feb 2003 12:06:31 +0100
Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:

> At 03:07 PM 2/12/2003 +0100, you wrote:
> >On Wed, 12 Feb 2003 09:09:31 +0100
> >Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:
> >
> > > At 08:53 AM 2/12/2003 +0100, you wrote:
> > > >Hartmut Henkel <hartmut_henkel@gmx.de> writes:
> >
> > > > > So there might be some corner for improvement. Using strcmp() the
> > > > > reverse way seems not to speed up things; how to write a more
> > > > > sophisticated inequality-checker?
> > > >
> > > >Heiko stated that he used a hash table for this. This will speed up
> > > >things dramatically.
> > >
> > > but if i remember right he only looked at the first 8 chars (assuming
> > > berry) which is not that useful for texnansi-* files -)
> > >
> > > the best way (imo) is to let later entries overload previous ones, so not
> > > much checking is needed at all;
> >
> >I remember this discussion on the pdftex-list and can still not understand
> >why we should look for overloaded entries. pdftex should take the first match.
> 
> no, the last one, since users may want to overload the defaults (quite 
> important if you use pseudo caps/slant/extend)

i see its importance and i have nothing against overloading defaults.
I mean that the overloading should not work in the way that an
later entry replaces a prior entry, instead the map-files that contain
the user-settings should be read before pdftex reads the defaults.
Then pdftex can take the first match and can stop reading map-files
if it has all required entries found.

Jens

Re: mapfiles and pdftex

[Hans Hagen]

At 04:56 PM 2/13/2003 +0100, you wrote:

>i see its importance and i have nothing against overloading defaults.
>I mean that the overloading should not work in the way that an
>later entry replaces a prior entry, instead the map-files that contain

well, in my opinion overloading means that later entries overload prior 
ones; also, because \pdfmapfile adds to the end of the "files to load list" 
thsi is the only way to overload.

same as in tex, you would be surprised if your \def\blabla{something} would 
not work because \blabla is already defined.

Hans
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE | pragma@wxs.nl
                       Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
  tel: +31 (0)38 477 53 69 | fax: +31 (0)38 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
                        information: http://www.pragma-ade.com/roadmap.pdf
                     documentation: http://www.pragma-ade.com/showcase.pdf
-------------------------------------------------------------------------