ntg-context - mailing list for ConTeXt users
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
* Russian/Cyrillic woes - Windows XP
@ 2009-02-04 12:51 Mari Voipio
  2009-02-04 14:32 ` Wolfgang Schuster
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mari Voipio @ 2009-02-04 12:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


Hello all!

I'm stuck: I have to get at least my ConTeXt to typeset Russian. No ifs 
or buts, it has to compile a file where the text is in Russian. Getting 
my ConTeXt to do it can involve installing a font or updating or 
something, as long as I get it to work in my XP.

Preferably I should need a fairly out-of-box to remotely set up a 
working system on a reasonably computer-literate customers XP.



All the computers than can be used for the job run Windows XP and the 
stand-alone distribution. My own XP has a fairly old distribution 
without Lua, the test computer has the newest possible standalone 
version with updated ConTeXt (I ran the script that seemed to do the trick).


Happened this far:

- I figured out that I can get SciTe to show cyrillics if I put a 
set.character=204 in the user.properties

- I deducted that I can get the updated ConTeXt to run MkIV 
"out-of-the-box" if I dig up the console and command texexec --lua filename

- on the up-to-date ConTeXt I've tried all the tricks I found for 
Russian on the garden (http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Russian) and on the 
mailing list (a thread from December last year). No luck.
(Note. Testing has mostly involved cutting and pasting the full example 
code into a blank .tex and compiling that into pdf in the way that's 
appropriate for the instructions.)



One of my problems seems to be that the input is not UTF, i.e. I have 
configured SciTe badly. Or Windows XP just doesn't like UTF, in which 
case I'm in trouble. It seems to me that if this problem is solved, MkIV 
would work. I'm not terribly used to working with encodings in general, 
so UTF is unknown terrain to me and this doesn't make things easier.

The other problem is that if I'm running MkII, it seems that I need to 
install some fonts, but typescripts seem to be of the "email me and you 
can get a typescript" way. Or then I just can't understand what the text 
says; since postscript started working by default a few years ago, I've 
avoided the font department altogether. :/

The third, and very minor problem, is to get the stand-alone to run 
MkIV/luatex by default. I'm sure there's a switch I can use to tell it 
to always use luatex instead of pdftex, I'm just too stupid to figure it 
out myself. And of course I'll only need this if MkIV is the best 
solution to my problem...



If that will solve the problem and if it can be done with minor changes 
(like adding something to path or something), I'm willing to switch to a 
different editor for Russian (or, rather, Cyrillic) - especially if that 
will happily coexist with SciTe.



Any hints on what to do next?


Mari

(Tip of the day: never promise anything to a customer before you've 
checked that it is doable in reality, not just in specs.)
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic woes - Windows XP
  2009-02-04 12:51 Russian/Cyrillic woes - Windows XP Mari Voipio
@ 2009-02-04 14:32 ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2009-02-04 15:18   ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mari Voipio
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Wolfgang Schuster @ 2009-02-04 14:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


Am 04.02.2009 um 13:51 schrieb Mari Voipio:

> I'm stuck: I have to get at least my ConTeXt to typeset Russian. No  
> ifs or buts, it has to compile a file where the text is in Russian.  
> Getting my ConTeXt to do it can involve installing a font or  
> updating or something, as long as I get it to work in my XP.

[...]

> Any hints on what to do next?

I tried just a moment ago to typeset russian in a machine where I have
only Hans standalone for Windows (mswincontext) and had no problem to
get a correct output.

1. I started scite (cscite.bat)
2. Opened a new tab
3. Select "UTF-8" in menu File/Encoding
4. Inserted the Russian example [1] for MkIV example from wiki in my tab
5. Added "% engine=luatex" at the begin of the file
6. Saved the file on my disk
7. Choose the "Process TeX file" from the Tools menu.
8. Got a pdf file with russian text.

[1] http://wiki.contextgarden.net/Russian#Using_cyrillic_with_ConTeXt_MkIV

The only thing I think in the standalone was to update to the last  
current
and used a newer LuaTeX version (0.30.3).

Wolfgang

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now!
  2009-02-04 14:32 ` Wolfgang Schuster
@ 2009-02-04 15:18   ` Mari Voipio
  2009-02-04 15:29     ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2009-02-04 19:40     ` Mojca Miklavec
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mari Voipio @ 2009-02-04 15:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
> I tried just a moment ago to typeset russian in a machine where I have
> only Hans standalone for Windows (mswincontext) and had no problem to
> get a correct output.

With your instructions, neither do I! I'm very, very thankful for this 
list...


> 1. I started scite (cscite.bat)
> 2. Opened a new tab
> 3. Select "UTF-8" in menu File/Encoding

This solved problem number 1: how to do UTF in SciTe.


> 4. Inserted the Russian example [1] for MkIV example from wiki in my tab
> 5. Added "% engine=luatex" at the begin of the file

This solved problem number 2: how to force SciTe to always use MkIV.


> 6. Saved the file on my disk
> 7. Choose the "Process TeX file" from the Tools menu.
> 8. Got a pdf file with russian text.


So did I. The best thing here is that this is simple enough that once 
I'm sure my filestructure and everything else works, I think my user 
will manage to get a compiling system going on.


Hmm... Smells badly like I need to upgrade my own computer. I guess it's 
about time to migrate anyway. Luatex, here I come!



Thanks a million,

Mari
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now!
  2009-02-04 15:18   ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mari Voipio
@ 2009-02-04 15:29     ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2009-02-04 19:40     ` Mojca Miklavec
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Wolfgang Schuster @ 2009-02-04 15:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


Am 04.02.2009 um 16:18 schrieb Mari Voipio:

>> 5. Added "% engine=luatex" at the begin of the file
>
> This solved problem number 2: how to force SciTe to always use MkIV.

To use XeTeX add "% engine=xetex" at the top of your file, for most
languages it's unimportant which engine you use as long as you don't
use on of the MkIV only features.

Wolfgang

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now!
  2009-02-04 15:18   ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mari Voipio
  2009-02-04 15:29     ` Wolfgang Schuster
@ 2009-02-04 19:40     ` Mojca Miklavec
  2009-02-05 10:34       ` Mari Voipio
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mojca Miklavec @ 2009-02-04 19:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 4:18 PM, Mari Voipio wrote:
> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>
>> 3. Select "UTF-8" in menu File/Encoding
>
> This solved problem number 1: how to do UTF in SciTe.

The problem is that you need to do that every time. There is some file
with user settings that you can access through menu. Do not ask me
where it is since I cannot try it now, but it's very handy since you
only do it once and then UTF-8 will always work out-of-the-box.

Mojca
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now!
  2009-02-04 19:40     ` Mojca Miklavec
@ 2009-02-05 10:34       ` Mari Voipio
  2009-02-05 10:42         ` luigi scarso
  2009-02-05 11:50         ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mojca Miklavec
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mari Voipio @ 2009-02-05 10:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 4:18 PM, Mari Voipio wrote:
>> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>> 3. Select "UTF-8" in menu File/Encoding
>> This solved problem number 1: how to do UTF in SciTe.
> 
> The problem is that you need to do that every time. There is some file
> with user settings that you can access through menu. Do not ask me
> where it is since I cannot try it now, but it's very handy since you
> only do it once and then UTF-8 will always work out-of-the-box.

Agreed. However, once I knew I should be looking for this, I found one 
solution to this problem at 
http://www.nabble.com/default-encoding-to-utf-8-cookie-td5946114.html

The thing to do is to open the SciTe global properties (Options | Open 
Global Properties) and to find the spot that says

# Internationalisation
# Japanese input code page 932 and ShiftJIS character set 128
#code.page=932
#character.set=128
# Unicode
#code.page=65001
code.page=0
#character.set=204
# Required for Unicode to work on GTK+:
#LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8
#output.code.page=65001

Then uncomment the line code.page=65001 and comment the line code.page=0 
(for us Windows dummies: move the hash mark # down by one line).
After this change everything opened in Scite in Windows is handled as 
UTF-8 (GTK+ users will take note of the second comment). Remember to 
save the properties file before closing it.


Caveat: This is advisable if you use Scite only with UTF-8 encoded 
files. If you use SciTe for files with other encoding, it is not a good 
idea. Why, you ask?
Because in the Encoding menu under File there's no way of switching a 
tab back to for example Windows Iso-Latin1 or whatever else your files are.

I know SciTe menus are adjustable so if somebody knows of a way to 
adding 'switch tab to code.page 0' or 'windows default encoding' or 
something similar to the Encoding menu, that'd be very much appreciated. 
Until then, I probably have to give up using SciTe as my html editor or 
some other people will be veerryyy annoyed...



Mari
(...who's next job is to convert a pile of files into UTF-8...)
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now!
  2009-02-05 10:34       ` Mari Voipio
@ 2009-02-05 10:42         ` luigi scarso
  2009-02-05 12:21           ` Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff Mari Voipio
  2009-02-05 11:50         ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mojca Miklavec
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: luigi scarso @ 2009-02-05 10:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 200 bytes --]

>
>
>
>
> Mari
> (...who's next job is to convert a pile of files into UTF-8...)
>

Maybe you can consider (under linux,I dont'know about windows)
recode
iconv

sometimes they are useful .

-- 
luigi

[-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 466 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/plain, Size: 487 bytes --]

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now!
  2009-02-05 10:34       ` Mari Voipio
  2009-02-05 10:42         ` luigi scarso
@ 2009-02-05 11:50         ` Mojca Miklavec
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mojca Miklavec @ 2009-02-05 11:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Mari Voipio wrote:
> Mojca Miklavec wrote:
> Caveat: This is advisable if you use Scite only with UTF-8 encoded files. If
> you use SciTe for files with other encoding, it is not a good idea. Why, you
> ask?
> Because in the Encoding menu under File there's no way of switching a tab
> back to for example Windows Iso-Latin1 or whatever else your files are.
>
> I know SciTe menus are adjustable so if somebody knows of a way to adding
> 'switch tab to code.page 0' or 'windows default encoding' or something
> similar to the Encoding menu, that'd be very much appreciated. Until then, I
> probably have to give up using SciTe as my html editor or some other people
> will be veerryyy annoyed...

Unless web pages are in ASCII, I never even dare to use anything but UTF-8.

In the long run you will probably want to or have to switch ... the
sooner you do that the better.
I don't know what you use your web pages for, but if you allow user
input (for example asking visitors for name), you discriminate users
for not being able to enter their name properly.

Lots of people that use ISO Latin 1 don't bother to specify encoding
since the web pages seem to "just work". If you try to open those
files (or see the web page) on some machine where Latin 2 in the
default, you'll run into problems anyway.

Mojca
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff
  2009-02-05 10:42         ` luigi scarso
@ 2009-02-05 12:21           ` Mari Voipio
  2009-02-05 12:34             ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2009-02-06 14:41             ` Mojca Miklavec
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mari Voipio @ 2009-02-05 12:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

luigi scarso wrote:
> Maybe you can consider (under linux,I dont'know about windows)
> recode
> iconv
> 
> sometimes they are useful .

I have Cygwin installed to give me some command line tools and we 
already figured out iconv is probably a useful tool. Recode, on the 
other hand, doesn't seem to exist ("man recode" give 'No manual entry 
for recode' while 'man iconv' is very informative).


One of my problems is that sometimes the files go out for editing to 
people who are only used to Windows. However, it turns out that even 
Word 2000 reads and saves UTF, if the open/save format is set to 
'encoded text' and utf-8 is selected from the encoding type list.


I just don't terribly fancy doing this for 5 x 15 files or something 
like that, so iconv is definitely high on the list of tools I'm going to 
try out.



Thank you, everybody, for your help - now I know a lot better what to do 
and I even think my Russian contact will manage to install a working 
system on his XP. I'll wikify the stuff somehow once I'm sure I remember 
all the steps correctly (probably I'll just hog yet another XP for 
installation test...).


Mari
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff
  2009-02-05 12:21           ` Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff Mari Voipio
@ 2009-02-05 12:34             ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2009-02-06 14:41             ` Mojca Miklavec
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Wolfgang Schuster @ 2009-02-05 12:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 1:21 PM, Mari Voipio <mari.voipio@iki.fi> wrote:

> I have Cygwin installed to give me some command line tools and we already
> figured out iconv is probably a useful tool. Recode, on the other hand,
> doesn't seem to exist ("man recode" give 'No manual entry for recode' while
> 'man iconv' is very informative).

Here is another tool for windows.

http://www.kalytta.com/tools.php -> Character Set Converter

Wolfgang
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff
  2009-02-05 12:21           ` Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff Mari Voipio
  2009-02-05 12:34             ` Wolfgang Schuster
@ 2009-02-06 14:41             ` Mojca Miklavec
  2009-02-06 15:18               ` Yue Wang
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mojca Miklavec @ 2009-02-06 14:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 1:21 PM, Mari Voipio wrote:
> luigi scarso wrote:
>>
>> Maybe you can consider (under linux,I dont'know about windows)
>> recode
>> iconv
>>
>> sometimes they are useful .
>
> I have Cygwin installed to give me some command line tools and we already
> figured out iconv is probably a useful tool. Recode, on the other hand,
> doesn't seem to exist ("man recode" give 'No manual entry for recode' while
> 'man iconv' is very informative).

You don't need cygwin (though if you already have it installed, I
would double check cygwin pacagkes, maybe you just need to install a
new package).

This is a nice collection of useful tools (= swiss-knife for poor
windows users) that work natively or at leat they did when I last used
Windows:
    http://downloads.sourceforge.net/unxutils/UnxUtils.zip

Mojca
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

* Re: Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff
  2009-02-06 14:41             ` Mojca Miklavec
@ 2009-02-06 15:18               ` Yue Wang
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Yue Wang @ 2009-02-06 15:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

For iconv and other gnu world tools, please refer to gnuwin32.
gnuwin32.sourceforge.net


On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 10:41 PM, Mojca Miklavec
<mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 1:21 PM, Mari Voipio wrote:
>> luigi scarso wrote:
>>>
>>> Maybe you can consider (under linux,I dont'know about windows)
>>> recode
>>> iconv
>>>
>>> sometimes they are useful .
>>
>> I have Cygwin installed to give me some command line tools and we already
>> figured out iconv is probably a useful tool. Recode, on the other hand,
>> doesn't seem to exist ("man recode" give 'No manual entry for recode' while
>> 'man iconv' is very informative).
>
> You don't need cygwin (though if you already have it installed, I
> would double check cygwin pacagkes, maybe you just need to install a
> new package).
>
> This is a nice collection of useful tools (= swiss-knife for poor
> windows users) that work natively or at leat they did when I last used
> Windows:
>    http://downloads.sourceforge.net/unxutils/UnxUtils.zip
>
> Mojca
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2009-02-06 15:18 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2009-02-04 12:51 Russian/Cyrillic woes - Windows XP Mari Voipio
2009-02-04 14:32 ` Wolfgang Schuster
2009-02-04 15:18   ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mari Voipio
2009-02-04 15:29     ` Wolfgang Schuster
2009-02-04 19:40     ` Mojca Miklavec
2009-02-05 10:34       ` Mari Voipio
2009-02-05 10:42         ` luigi scarso
2009-02-05 12:21           ` Russian/Cyrillic - UTF-8 stuff Mari Voipio
2009-02-05 12:34             ` Wolfgang Schuster
2009-02-06 14:41             ` Mojca Miklavec
2009-02-06 15:18               ` Yue Wang
2009-02-05 11:50         ` Russian/Cyrillic - no woes, happy now! Mojca Miklavec

This is a public inbox, see mirroring instructions
for how to clone and mirror all data and code used for this inbox;
as well as URLs for NNTP newsgroup(s).