Re: next beta

Re: next beta

[Jeong Dal]

Dear Hans,

I updated ConTeXt beta today and run your sample for long formula.
It works nice and it is the feature what many math people want I think.
Thank you for your concern.

One thing that I’d like say is that a new line in the splitted long formula usually starts with operations in many math books.
But, in the ourput  of your example, every line ends with ‘+’ sign and begin a new line with a ‘number’.

Would you please check it once more?

Thank you again for your work, and have a nice weekend.

Best regards,

Dalyoung
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Re: next beta

[Hans Hagen]

On 6/17/2017 3:48 PM, Jeong Dal wrote:
> Dear Hans,
> 
> I updated ConTeXt beta today and run your sample for long formula.
> It works nice and it is the feature what many math people want I think.
> Thank you for your concern.
> 
> One thing that I’d like say is that a new line in the splitted long formula usually starts with operations in many math books.
> But, in the ourput  of your example, every line ends with ‘+’ sign and begin a new line with a ‘number’.
> 
> Would you please check it once more?
this is how tex works: just look at inline math

i played with it a bit but had to adapt the engine for a bit more 
control (stepwise the matyh machinery is opened up i.e. hard coded steps 
become configureable)

anyway, the question is not implementing but control: it's not default 
tex behaviour so it has to be turned on (and then after a while we 
forget that it can be turned on i guess)

(no clue what keyword to use for controling it)

Hans

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                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
        tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: next beta

[Jeong Dal]

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Dear Hans,


> 2017. 6. 18. 오후 8:00, Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> 작성:
> 
> this is how tex works: just look at inline math
> 

Yes, you are right. 
To start a new line with a sign may be a preference  of me and some others.
I found a document which illustrates the different displays of a long equations in LaTeX.

https://www.andy-roberts.net/res/writing/latex/longeqns.pdf <https://www.andy-roberts.net/res/writing/latex/longeqns.pdf>

I think that I ask you too much. 
You may leave it to user to choose.

Thank you for the example that I just saw. It looks good to me.

Best regards,

Dalyoung


> i played with it a bit but had to adapt the engine for a bit more control (stepwise the matyh machinery is opened up i.e. hard coded steps become configureable)
> 
> anyway, the question is not implementing but control: it's not default tex behaviour so it has to be turned on (and then after a while we forget that it can be turned on i guess)
> 
> (no clue what keyword to use for controling it)
> 
> Hans
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                          Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>              Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>       tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl <http://www.pragma-ade.nl/> | www.pragma-pod.nl <http://www.pragma-pod.nl/>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------


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Re: next beta

[Henri Menke]

On Sun, 2017-06-18 at 13:00 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote:
> On 6/17/2017 3:48 PM, Jeong Dal wrote:
> > 
> > Dear Hans,
> > 
> > I updated ConTeXt beta today and run your sample for long formula.
> > It works nice and it is the feature what many math people want I think.
> > Thank you for your concern.
> > 
> > One thing that I’d like say is that a new line in the splitted long formula usually starts with
> > operations in many math books.
> > But, in the ourput  of your example, every line ends with ‘+’ sign and begin a new line with a
> > ‘number’.
> > 
> > Would you please check it once more?
> this is how tex works: just look at inline math

Let me quote the TeXbook (page 195):

»Although formulas within a paragraph always break after binary operations and relations, displayed
formulas always break before binary operations and relations.«

On the other hand, right above this paragraph, it says:

»It's quite an art to decide how to break long displayed formulas into several lines; TeX never
attempts to break them, because no set of rules is really adequate.«

> i played with it a bit but had to adapt the engine for a bit more 
> control (stepwise the matyh machinery is opened up i.e. hard coded steps 
> become configureable)
> 
> anyway, the question is not implementing but control: it's not default 
> tex behaviour so it has to be turned on (and then after a while we 
> forget that it can be turned on i guess)
> 
> (no clue what keyword to use for controling it)
> 
> Hans
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                            Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>                Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>         tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
> 
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
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Re: next beta

[Hans Hagen]

On 6/19/2017 12:56 AM, Henri Menke wrote:

> Let me quote the TeXbook (page 195):
> 
> »Although formulas within a paragraph always break after binary operations and relations, displayed
> formulas always break before binary operations and relations.«

given that one uses alignments

> On the other hand, right above this paragraph, it says:
> 
> »It's quite an art to decide how to break long displayed formulas into several lines; TeX never
> attempts to break them, because no set of rules is really adequate.«

right, so we're stuck .. anyhow, some future mkiv beta / luatex 
combination will provide

\setupformulas[split=yes,align=flushleft]     % already there
\setupmathematics[setups=math:spacing:split]  % needs new engine

so that you split differently (one can then prevent an unwanted split 
with a large penalty)

Hans

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                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
        tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: next beta

[Aditya Mahajan]

On Mon, 19 Jun 2017, Hans Hagen wrote:

> \setupformulas[split=yes,align=flushleft]     % already there

While you are tweaking formulas, would it make sense to add a key-value 
interface for \startformula, so that the following also works:

\startformula[split=yes, align=flushleft]
...
\stopformula

We can remain backward compatible by check if the argument to formulas is 
an assignment or not.

Aditya
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Again: breaking of formulas

[Mathias Schickel]

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Dear Hans, Aditya and the list,

I have tested the new auto breaking feature for formulas and have encountered some issues that I have summed up in the attached file. It would be great if this issues could be eliminated.

Best
Mathias

 

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> Am 19.06.2017 um 09:44 schrieb Aditya Mahajan <adityam@umich.edu>:
> 
> On Mon, 19 Jun 2017, Hans Hagen wrote:
> 
>> \setupformulas[split=yes,align=flushleft]     % already there
> 
> While you are tweaking formulas, would it make sense to add a key-value interface for \startformula, so that the following also works:
> 
> \startformula[split=yes, align=flushleft]
> ...
> \stopformula
> 
> We can remain backward compatible by check if the argument to formulas is an assignment or not.
> 
> Aditya
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
> 
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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> ___________________________________________________________________________________


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