Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Tomas Hala]

Hi all,

I used together hanging punctuation and define/setup paragraphs (tested on TL2017, current CTX).
Unfortunately, inside the paragraph environment the hanging punctuation settings is ignored.
Moreover, it seems that attributes inner= and command= works only for the first paragraph (column).

The only one way I discovered is to write manually \setupalign[hz,hanging]
command at the beginning of each column which is not very comfortable.

I would like to ask you whether is here some way to set it generally.
Or (better) to inherited it from the outer settings.

Thanks in advance,

Tomáš

------

Minimal example:

\definefontfeature[default][default][protrusion=quality,expansion=quality]

\starttext\mainlanguage[cz]

\defineparagraphs[pokus][n=2]
\setupparagraphs[pokus][1][width=10cc]
%\setupparagraphs[pokus][1][width=10cc,inner={\setupalign[hz,hanging]}] % command=...

\setupalign[hz,hanging] \setupbodyfont[modern,12dd]

text

\startsomepars
text
\nextsomepars
text
\stopsomepars

text

\stoptext


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Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Pablo Rodriguez]

On 03/20/2018 08:17 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> I used together hanging punctuation and define/setup paragraphs
> (tested on TL2017, current CTX).
> Unfortunately, inside the paragraph environment the hanging
> punctuation settings is ignored.> Moreover, it seems that attributes inner= and command= works only for
> the first paragraph (column).
Hi Tomáš,

\setupparagraphs has an align key.

This command works with your sample:

  \setupparagraphs[somepars][2][align={hz, hanging}]

I hope it helps,

Pablo
-- 
http://www.ousia.tk
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Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Tomas Hala]

Hi Pablo,

thank you very much, you are right.
The align={hz, hanging} is not documented on the wiki, so I did not think about it. 

The proper solution for my problem is this:

\setupparagraphs[align={hz, hanging}]

which sets all columns for all kinds of paragraphs defined by \defineparagraphs
(for normal text is necessary to set it separately). 

Thanks once more and wishes,

Tomáš


Tue, Mar 20, 2018 ve 08:30:24PM +0100 Pablo Rodriguez napsal(a):
# On 03/20/2018 08:17 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
# > Hi all,
# > 
# > I used together hanging punctuation and define/setup paragraphs
# > (tested on TL2017, current CTX).
# > Unfortunately, inside the paragraph environment the hanging
# > punctuation settings is ignored.> Moreover, it seems that attributes inner= and command= works only for
# > the first paragraph (column).
# Hi Tomáš,
# 
# \setupparagraphs has an align key.
# 
# This command works with your sample:
# 
#   \setupparagraphs[somepars][2][align={hz, hanging}]
# 
# I hope it helps,
# 
# Pablo
# -- 
# http://www.ousia.tk
# ___________________________________________________________________________________
# If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
# 
# maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
# webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
# archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
# wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
# ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                         Tomáš Hála
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Mendelova univerzita, Provozně ekonomická fakulta, ústav informatiky
Zemědělská 1, CZ-613 00 Brno,  tel. +420 545 13 22 28
--------------------------------------------------------------------
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Pablo Rodriguez]

On 03/20/2018 09:59 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
> Hi Pablo,
> 
> thank you very much, you are right.
> The align={hz, hanging} is not documented on the wiki, so I did not think about it. 

Hi Tomáš,

your local tex/texmf-context/tex/context/interface/mkiv/i-context.pdf is
really your friend here.

> The proper solution for my problem is this:
> 
> \setupparagraphs[align={hz, hanging}]

I only wanted to test whether microtypography was working. I can detect
a text with hanging punctuation, but I’m not able to detect whether the
text has the hz algorithm or not ;-).

> which sets all columns for all kinds of paragraphs defined by \defineparagraphs
> (for normal text is necessary to set it separately). 

Alignment for body text is specified with \setupalignment. Even
footnotes may have a different alignment.

I hope it helps,

Pablo


> Tue, Mar 20, 2018 ve 08:30:24PM +0100 Pablo Rodriguez napsal(a):
> # On 03/20/2018 08:17 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
> # > Hi all,
> # > 
> # > I used together hanging punctuation and define/setup paragraphs
> # > (tested on TL2017, current CTX).
> # > Unfortunately, inside the paragraph environment the hanging
> # > punctuation settings is ignored.> Moreover, it seems that attributes inner= and command= works only for
> # > the first paragraph (column).
> # Hi Tomáš,
> # 
> # \setupparagraphs has an align key.
> # 
> # This command works with your sample:
> # 
> #   \setupparagraphs[somepars][2][align={hz, hanging}]
> # 
> # I hope it helps,
> # 
> # Pablo
> # -- 


-- 
http://www.ousia.tk
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Tomas Hala]

Hi Pablo,

thank you for the help, the i-context manual really became 
as a friend of mine. :-)

Alignments with hz work but I found out that the opening quotation character
does not hang out at the left side. 

Is there any other key (or value) for this?

The best,

Tomáš 

Wed, Mar 21, 2018 ve 07:20:05PM +0100 Pablo Rodriguez napsal(a):
# On 03/20/2018 09:59 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
# > Hi Pablo,
# > 
# > thank you very much, you are right.
# > The align={hz, hanging} is not documented on the wiki, so I did not think about it. 
# 
# Hi Tomáš,
# 
# your local tex/texmf-context/tex/context/interface/mkiv/i-context.pdf is
# really your friend here.
# 
# > The proper solution for my problem is this:
# > 
# > \setupparagraphs[align={hz, hanging}]
# 
# I only wanted to test whether microtypography was working. I can detect
# a text with hanging punctuation, but I’m not able to detect whether the
# text has the hz algorithm or not ;-).
# 
# > which sets all columns for all kinds of paragraphs defined by \defineparagraphs
# > (for normal text is necessary to set it separately). 
# 
# Alignment for body text is specified with \setupalignment. Even
# footnotes may have a different alignment.
# 
# I hope it helps,
# 
# Pablo
# 
# 
# > Tue, Mar 20, 2018 ve 08:30:24PM +0100 Pablo Rodriguez napsal(a):
# > # On 03/20/2018 08:17 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
# > # > Hi all,
# > # > 
# > # > I used together hanging punctuation and define/setup paragraphs
# > # > (tested on TL2017, current CTX).
# > # > Unfortunately, inside the paragraph environment the hanging
# > # > punctuation settings is ignored.> Moreover, it seems that attributes inner= and command= works only for
# > # > the first paragraph (column).
# > # Hi Tomáš,
# > # 
# > # \setupparagraphs has an align key.
# > # 
# > # This command works with your sample:
# > # 
# > #   \setupparagraphs[somepars][2][align={hz, hanging}]
# > # 
# > # I hope it helps,
# > # 
# > # Pablo
# > # -- 
# 
# 
# -- 
# http://www.ousia.tk
# ___________________________________________________________________________________
# If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
# 
# maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
# webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
# archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
# wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
# ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                         Tomáš Hála
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Mendelova univerzita, Provozně ekonomická fakulta, ústav informatiky
Zemědělská 1, CZ-613 00 Brno,  tel. +420 545 13 22 28
--------------------------------------------------------------------
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Wolfgang Schuster]

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> Tomas Hala <mailto:tomas.hala@mendelu.cz>
> 18. April 2018 um 17:45
> Hi Pablo,
>
> thank you for the help, the i-context manual really became
> as a friend of mine. :-)
>
> Alignments with hz work but I found out that the opening quotation 
> character
> does not hang out at the left side.
>
> Is there any other key (or value) for this?

Do you have a example?

Wolfgang

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Pablo Rodriguez]

On 04/18/2018 05:45 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
> Hi Pablo,
> 
> thank you for the help, the i-context manual really became 
> as a friend of mine. :-)

Hi Tomáš,

it is really an extremely useful document.

> Alignments with hz work but I found out that the opening quotation character
> does not hang out at the left side. 
> 
> Is there any other key (or value) for this?

I don’t know which are the proper Czech quotation marks. According to
https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uvozovky, they seem to be hanging right:

    \showframe
    \definefontfeature[default][default]
        [protrusion=quality,expansion=quality]
    \setupalign[hanging, hz]

    \definefontfamily[min][rm][EB Garamond 12]
    \setupbodyfont[min]

    \starttext
    “\input zapf

    «\input zapf

    »\input zapf

    „\input zapf

    ‚\input zapf
    \stoptext

Or let us know what we are missing.

I hope it helps,

Pablo
-- 
http://www.ousia.tk
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Tomas Hala]

Hi Pablo,

unfortunately, this does not work (on my computer with TL2017).

Proper Czech quotation marks are available via \quotation command:
\mainlanguage[cz] 
\quotation{text}

But it is language independent problem, I did more tests:
neither Czech, nor US, nor Dutch, nor German quotation marks are hanging. 
Without influence is also font (font family), tested on modern, libertine, 
EB Garamond 12 from your example, times...

No change appeared switching the order of commands
\definefontfeature  and \setupalign.

Tomáš 

%%% Minimal example: 

\starttext\showframe\mainlanguage[de]

\definefontfeature  [default]  [default]  
	[protrusion=quality,
	expansion=quality
]

\setupalign[hz,hanging] 

\setupbodyfont[libertine]   % times, modern
% \definefontfamily[min][rm][EB Garamond 12] \setupbodyfont[min]

\input knuth\par
\quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}\crlf
\quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}\par 
\input knuth

\stoptext


Wed, Apr 18, 2018 ve 06:26:32PM +0200 Pablo Rodriguez napsal(a):
# On 04/18/2018 05:45 PM, Tomas Hala wrote:
# > Hi Pablo,
# > 
# > thank you for the help, the i-context manual really became 
# > as a friend of mine. :-)
# 
# Hi Tomáš,
# 
# it is really an extremely useful document.
# 
# > Alignments with hz work but I found out that the opening quotation character
# > does not hang out at the left side. 
# > 
# > Is there any other key (or value) for this?
# 
# I don’t know which are the proper Czech quotation marks. According to
# https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uvozovky, they seem to be hanging right:
# 
#     \showframe
#     \definefontfeature[default][default]
#         [protrusion=quality,expansion=quality]
#     \setupalign[hanging, hz]
# 
#     \definefontfamily[min][rm][EB Garamond 12]
#     \setupbodyfont[min]
# 
#     \starttext
#     “\input zapf
# 
#     «\input zapf
# 
#     »\input zapf
# 
#     „\input zapf
# 
#     ‚\input zapf
#     \stoptext
# 
# Or let us know what we are missing.
# 
# I hope it helps,
# 
# Pablo
# -- 
# http://www.ousia.tk
# ___________________________________________________________________________________
# If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
# 
# maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
# webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
# archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
# wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
# ___________________________________________________________________________________

                                         Tomáš Hála
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Mendelova univerzita, Provozně ekonomická fakulta, ústav informatiky
Zemědělská 1, CZ-613 00 Brno,  tel. +420 545 13 22 28
--------------------------------------------------------------------
http://akela.mendelu.cz/~thala
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If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Wolfgang Schuster]

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> Tomas Hala <mailto:tomas.hala@mendelu.cz>
> 21. April 2018 um 09:09
> Hi Pablo,
>
> unfortunately, this does not work (on my computer with TL2017).
>
> Proper Czech quotation marks are available via \quotation command:
> \mainlanguage[cz]
> \quotation{text}
>
> But it is language independent problem, I did more tests:
> neither Czech, nor US, nor Dutch, nor German quotation marks are hanging.
> Without influence is also font (font family), tested on modern, 
> libertine,
> EB Garamond 12 from your example, times...
>
> No change appeared switching the order of commands
> \definefontfeature and \setupalign.

\setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]

Wolfgang

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Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Tomas Hala]

# 
#      unfortunately, this does not work (on my computer with TL2017).
# 
#      Proper Czech quotation marks are available via \quotation command:
#      \mainlanguage[cz]
#      \quotation{text}
# 
#      But it is language independent problem, I did more tests:
#      neither Czech, nor US, nor Dutch, nor German quotation marks are
#      hanging.
#      Without influence is also font (font family), tested on modern,
#      libertine,
#      EB Garamond 12 from your example, times...
# 
#      No change appeared switching the order of commands
#      \definefontfeature and \setupalign.
# 
#    \setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]

I tried it but it generates an error --  "Extra }, or forgotten \endgroup",
after run till the end, the opening character is hanging but closing
character disappeared. (Similarly with \setupquotation[method=font].)

Tomáš 

 
#    Wolfgang

\starttext\showframe\mainlanguage[cz]
\definefontfeature  [default]  [default] [protrusion=quality, expansion=quality]
\setupalign[hz,hanging]

\setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]

\setupbodyfont[times]   % libertine, times, modern
\quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}
\stoptext



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Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Wolfgang Schuster]

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Add this fix to your document:

\unprotect

\def\typo_delimited_fontdriven
   {\dontleavehmode
    \begingroup
    \dostarttaggedchained\t!delimited\currentdelimitedtext\??delimitedtext
    \usedlanguageparameter{\c!left\currentparentdelimitedtext}% was: 
\currentdelimitedtext
    \usedelimitedtextstyleandcolor\c!style\c!color
    \typo_delimited_start_content
    \bgroup
    \aftergroup\typo_delimited_fontdriven_e
    \let\next=}

\protect

There was a bug when “method=font” was used but this was fixed last October.

Wolfgang
> Tomas Hala <mailto:tomas.hala@mendelu.cz>
> 21. April 2018 um 18:01
> #
> # unfortunately, this does not work (on my computer with TL2017).
> #
> # Proper Czech quotation marks are available via \quotation command:
> # \mainlanguage[cz]
> # \quotation{text}
> #
> # But it is language independent problem, I did more tests:
> # neither Czech, nor US, nor Dutch, nor German quotation marks are
> # hanging.
> # Without influence is also font (font family), tested on modern,
> # libertine,
> # EB Garamond 12 from your example, times...
> #
> # No change appeared switching the order of commands
> # \definefontfeature and \setupalign.
> #
> # \setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]
>
> I tried it but it generates an error -- "Extra }, or forgotten \endgroup",
> after run till the end, the opening character is hanging but closing
> character disappeared. (Similarly with \setupquotation[method=font].)
>
> Tomáš
>
>
> # Wolfgang
>
> \starttext\showframe\mainlanguage[cz]
> \definefontfeature [default] [default] [protrusion=quality, 
> expansion=quality]
> \setupalign[hz,hanging]
>
> \setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]
>
> \setupbodyfont[times] % libertine, times, modern
> \quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}
> \stoptext
>
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry 
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / 
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
> archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
> wiki : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________


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___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Question about paragraphs and hanging punctuation

[Tomas Hala]

Hi Wolfgang,

I tried it and the syntactic error disappeared, thanks.
But the left quotation character is still not hanging.
I tried also different positions of this fixing code, 
but with no success. 

Is there any other way how to fix it? 

The best,

Tomáš

   \unprotect

   \def\typo_delimited_fontdriven
     {\dontleavehmode
      \begingroup
      \dostarttaggedchained\t!delimited\currentdelimitedtext\??delimitedtext
      \usedlanguageparameter{\c!left\currentparentdelimitedtext}% was:
   \currentdelimitedtext
      \usedelimitedtextstyleandcolor\c!style\c!color
      \typo_delimited_start_content
      \bgroup
      \aftergroup\typo_delimited_fontdriven_e
      \let\next=}

   \protect

\starttext\mainlanguage[de]\showframe % TL2017

\definefontfeature  [default]  [default]  [protrusion=quality, expansion=quality]
\setupalign[hz,hanging]

%\setupbodyfont[libertine]  % termes, pagella

\input knuth\par
\quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}\crlf
\quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}\par
\input knuth

\stoptext


Sat, Apr 21, 2018 ve 08:01:40PM +0200 Wolfgang Schuster napsal(a):
#    Add this fix to your document:
# 
#    \unprotect
# 
#    \def\typo_delimited_fontdriven
#      {\dontleavehmode
#       \begingroup
#       \dostarttaggedchained\t!delimited\currentdelimitedtext\??delimitedtext
#       \usedlanguageparameter{\c!left\currentparentdelimitedtext}% was:
#    \currentdelimitedtext
#       \usedelimitedtextstyleandcolor\c!style\c!color
#       \typo_delimited_start_content
#       \bgroup
#       \aftergroup\typo_delimited_fontdriven_e
#       \let\next=}
# 
#    \protect
# 
#    There was a bug when “method=font” was used but this was fixed last
#    October.
# 
#    Wolfgang
# 
#                                                                 [1]Tomas Hala
#      21. April 2018 um 18:01
#      #
#      # unfortunately, this does not work (on my computer with TL2017).
#      #
#      # Proper Czech quotation marks are available via \quotation command:
#      # \mainlanguage[cz]
#      # \quotation{text}
#      #
#      # But it is language independent problem, I did more tests:
#      # neither Czech, nor US, nor Dutch, nor German quotation marks are
#      # hanging.
#      # Without influence is also font (font family), tested on modern,
#      # libertine,
#      # EB Garamond 12 from your example, times...
#      #
#      # No change appeared switching the order of commands
#      # \definefontfeature and \setupalign.
#      #
#      # \setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]
# 
#      I tried it but it generates an error -- "Extra }, or forgotten
#      \endgroup",
#      after run till the end, the opening character is hanging but closing
#      character disappeared. (Similarly with \setupquotation[method=font].)
# 
#      Tomáš
# 
#      # Wolfgang
# 
#      \starttext\showframe\mainlanguage[cz]
#      \definefontfeature [default] [default] [protrusion=quality,
#      expansion=quality]
#      \setupalign[hz,hanging]
# 
#      \setupdelimitedtext[quotation][method=font]
# 
#      \setupbodyfont[times] % libertine, times, modern
#      \quotation{pokus s uvozovkami}
#      \stoptext
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                                         Tomáš Hála
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Mendelova univerzita, Provozně ekonomická fakulta, ústav informatiky
Zemědělská 1, CZ-613 00 Brno,  tel. +420 545 13 22 28
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http://akela.mendelu.cz/~thala
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If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

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