german hyphenation patterns

german hyphenation patterns

[Patrick Gundlach]

Hi out there,

I'am not sure if this is a ConTeXt problem (I doubt it slightly) but
I am a bit confused:

How can I activate german hyphenation patterns? I have used
\mainlanguage[de] in my document and it was OK some time ago.
Meanwhile I have updated ConTeXt and my TeX (current texlive). 

Where should I start to check? 

The output of my context run is:


[...]

language       : language en is active

[...]

bodyfont       : 12pt rm is loaded
language       : patterns 2:2-en-2 loaded
specials       : fdf,tpd loaded


Patrick
-- 
You are your own rainbow!

Re: german hyphenation patterns

[Hans Hagen]

At 00:32 22/11/2003, you wrote:
>Hi out there,
>
>I'am not sure if this is a ConTeXt problem (I doubt it slightly) but
>I am a bit confused:
>
>How can I activate german hyphenation patterns? I have used
>\mainlanguage[de] in my document and it was OK some time ago.
>Meanwhile I have updated ConTeXt and my TeX (current texlive).
>
>Where should I start to check?
>
>The output of my context run is:
>
>
>[...]
>
>language       : language en is active
>
>[...]
>
>bodyfont       : 12pt rm is loaded
>language       : patterns 2:2-en-2 loaded
>specials       : fdf,tpd loaded

--language={en,de}

or just

--all

i wonder why those patterns are not loaded, (do you use cont-en ?)

Hans  

Re: german hyphenation patterns

[Patrick Gundlach]

Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> writes:

> --language={en,de}


I tried this one but no different results. I guess I should come up
with a minimal example. 

> i wonder why those patterns are not loaded, (do you use cont-en ?)

good question. This is the head of the output:

ConTeXt  ver: 2003.9.26  fmt: 2003.10.1  int: english  mes: english

int: english means cont-en???

I'll post a minimal example and do some more experiments on sunday. 


Patrick

Re: german hyphenation patterns

[Thomas A.Schmitz]

Hmm, bizarre--I get the same output you do ("language       : language 
en is active <protectionstate 0>"), nevertheless, hyphenation patterns 
seem to be correct, as far as I can see. But your comment made me 
realize that ConTeXt seems to be using the new German orthography 
exclusively. Is there a way to make it use "dehypht.tex" instead of 
"dehyphn.tex"?

Best

Thomas

Re: german hyphenation patterns

[Hans Hagen]

At 14:33 23/11/2003, you wrote:
>Hmm, bizarre--I get the same output you do ("language       : language en 
>is active <protectionstate 0>"), nevertheless, hyphenation patterns seem 
>to be correct, as far as I can see. But your comment made me realize that 
>ConTeXt seems to be using the new German orthography exclusively. Is there 
>a way to make it use "dehypht.tex" instead of "dehyphn.tex"?

how do you generate the format? is there a difference between

   texexec --make (uses fmtutil)

and

  texexec --make --alone

or maybe

  texexec --make --alone --all  (all patterns)

Hans

Re: german hyphenation patterns

[Patrick Gundlach]

Patrick Gundlach <pg@levana.de> writes:

> How can I activate german hyphenation patterns? I have used
> \mainlanguage[de] in my document and it was OK some time ago.
> Meanwhile I have updated ConTeXt and my TeX (current texlive). 

Somehow the format file did not load any hyphenation patterns besides
english. I cannot reproduce the problem any more. I wonder how this
could have happened...

from the cont-en.log:

[...]

language       : patterns en for en loaded (n=2)
(/opt/texlive/8/texmf/tex/generic/hyphen/hyphen.tex)
language       : no hyphenations en for en (n=2)
language       : no patterns uk for uk (n=3)
language       : no hyphenations uk for uk (n=3)
language       : no patterns de for de (n=4)
language       : no hyphenations de for de (n=4)
language       : no patterns fr for fr (n=5)


[...]

regenerating the format solves the problem.

Patrick

German hyphenation patterns

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

All,

German orthography is a mess right now, we now have two sets of  
rules, old and new. New hyphenation is ugly and rules are constantly  
changing. I see that ConTeXt has lang-deo.pat, so I was hoping that  
this would produce "old" patterns, but it doesn't seem to work:

\enableregime[utf]
\mainlanguage[deo]

\starttext

\showhyphens{gestorben}

\showhyphens{Bierdeckel}

\showhyphens{äußerst}

\stoptext

gives me:

Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 8--8
[] \*10ptrmtf* ge-stor-ben

Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 10--10
[] \*10ptrmtf* Bier-de-ckel

Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 12--12
[] \*10ptrmtf* ‰u-ˇerst

which is identical to \mainlanguage[de]. Patterns should be Bierdek- 
kel and ‰us-serst. Am I missing something, how can I enable "old"  
patterns?

Thanks

Thomas

Re: German hyphenation patterns

[Tobias Burnus]

Hi,

Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
> German orthography is a mess right now, we now have two sets of rules, 
> old and new. New hyphenation is ugly and rules are constantly 
> changing. I see that ConTeXt has lang-deo.pat, so I was hoping that 
> this would produce "old" patterns, but it doesn't seem to work
Should work(TM).

> \showhyphens{Bierdeckel}
I may completely missunderstand the .pat files, but I think they only 
give rules where to hyphenate; thus with the current .pat system one can 
never get ck -> k-k.

LaTeX's german.sty and also ConTeXt provide
"ck -> k-k
"ll -> ll-l
"ff ->ff-f
(as in Bierde"ckel, Ro"lladen or Schi"ffahrt).

> \showhyphens{äußerst}
> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 12--12
> [] \*10ptrmtf* ‰u-ˇerst
Hmm, my Duden of 1996 writes in black "au|ßerst" (= new & established 
spelling), which is in line what I remember.
But I see \showhyphens{äußerstenfalls} be wrongly hyphenated; according 
to Duden it should be:
äu|ßersten|falls (new spelling: äu|ßers|ten|falls). TeX hyphenates here 
(with deo = established spelling) between the s and the t.

Tobias

Re: German hyphenation patterns

[Thomas A.Schmitz]

On Dec 2, 2005, at 4:42 PM, Tobias Burnus wrote:

> LaTeX's german.sty and also ConTeXt provide
> "ck -> k-k
> "ll -> ll-l
> "ff ->ff-f
> (as in Bierde"ckel, Ro"lladen or Schi"ffahrt).
Thank you, that was it!

> Hmm, my Duden of 1996 writes in black "au|ßerst" (= new &  
> established spelling), which is in line what I remember.
> But I see \showhyphens{äußerstenfalls} be wrongly hyphenated;  
> according to Duden it should be:
> äu|ßersten|falls (new spelling: äu|ßers|ten|falls). TeX hyphenates  
> here (with deo = established spelling) between the s and the t.

Yes, you're right again; I thought I remembered a rule that there  
should be no hyphenation in front of ß. But hyphenation between s-t  
is still there, and it shouldn't be in [deo]. Sorry we German- 
language-users have to bother everybody else with the mess we created.

Thanks, and best

Thomas

Re: German hyphenation patterns

[Hans Hagen]

Thomas A.Schmitz wrote:

>
> On Dec 2, 2005, at 4:42 PM, Tobias Burnus wrote:
>
>> LaTeX's german.sty and also ConTeXt provide
>> "ck -> k-k
>> "ll -> ll-l
>> "ff ->ff-f
>> (as in Bierde"ckel, Ro"lladen or Schi"ffahrt).
>
> Thank you, that was it!
>
>> Hmm, my Duden of 1996 writes in black "au|�erst" (= new &  
>> established spelling), which is in line what I remember.
>> But I see \showhyphens{�u�erstenfalls} be wrongly hyphenated;  
>> according to Duden it should be:
>> �u|�ersten|falls (new spelling: �u|�ers|ten|falls). TeX hyphenates  
>> here (with deo = established spelling) between the s and the t.
>
>
> Yes, you're right again; I thought I remembered a rule that there  
> should be no hyphenation in front of �. But hyphenation between s-t  
> is still there, and it shouldn't be in [deo]. Sorry we German- 
> language-users have to bother everybody else with the mess we created.

since context ships with adapted patterns (i.e. generic ones that can be 
used in more than one encoding) we can add things, just figure it out 
and let me know

Hans

Re: German hyphenation patterns

[Hans Hagen]

Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:

> All,
>
> German orthography is a mess right now, we now have two sets of  
> rules, old and new. New hyphenation is ugly and rules are constantly  
> changing. I see that ConTeXt has lang-deo.pat, so I was hoping that  
> this would produce "old" patterns, but it doesn't seem to work:
>
> \enableregime[utf]
> \mainlanguage[deo]
>
> \starttext
>
> \showhyphens{gestorben}
>
> \showhyphens{Bierdeckel}
>
> \showhyphens{�u�erst}
>
> \stoptext
>
> gives me:
>
> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 8--8
> [] \*10ptrmtf* ge-stor-ben
>
> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 10--10
> [] \*10ptrmtf* Bier-de-ckel
>
> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 12--12
> [] \*10ptrmtf* �u-�erst
>
> which is identical to \mainlanguage[de]. Patterns should be Bierdek- 
> kel and �us-serst. Am I missing something, how can I enable "old"  
> patterns?

(I assume that you loaded the patterns, i.e. texexec --make --all)

hard to see; for ck to become k-k you need this active " mess:

\usetypescript[modern][ec]
\setupbodyfont[modern,11pt]

\mainlanguage[deo]

\hyphenation{Bier-de-ckel}

\starttext

\number\normallanguage

\hyphenatedword{gestorben}

\hyphenatedword{Bierdeckel}

\hyphenatedword{Bierde"ckel}

\stoptext

Re: German hyphenation patterns

[Thomas A. Schmitz]

Cool, works now! Thanks Hans!


On Dec 5, 2005, at 12:28 PM, Hans Hagen wrote:

> Thomas A. Schmitz wrote:
>
>> All,
>>
>> German orthography is a mess right now, we now have two sets of   
>> rules, old and new. New hyphenation is ugly and rules are  
>> constantly  changing. I see that ConTeXt has lang-deo.pat, so I  
>> was hoping that  this would produce "old" patterns, but it doesn't  
>> seem to work:
>>
>> \enableregime[utf]
>> \mainlanguage[deo]
>>
>> \starttext
>>
>> \showhyphens{gestorben}
>>
>> \showhyphens{Bierdeckel}
>>
>> \showhyphens{�u�erst}
>>
>> \stoptext
>>
>> gives me:
>>
>> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 8--8
>> [] \*10ptrmtf* ge-stor-ben
>>
>> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 10--10
>> [] \*10ptrmtf* Bier-de-ckel
>>
>> Underfull \hbox (badness 10000) in paragraph at lines 12--12
>> [] \*10ptrmtf* �u-�erst
>>
>> which is identical to \mainlanguage[de]. Patterns should be  
>> Bierdek- kel and �us-serst. Am I missing something, how can I  
>> enable "old"  patterns?
>
> (I assume that you loaded the patterns, i.e. texexec --make --all)
>
> hard to see; for ck to become k-k you need this active " mess:
>
> \usetypescript[modern][ec]
> \setupbodyfont[modern,11pt]
>
> \mainlanguage[deo]
>
> \hyphenation{Bier-de-ckel}
>
> \starttext
>
> \number\normallanguage
>
> \hyphenatedword{gestorben}
>
> \hyphenatedword{Bierdeckel}
>
> \hyphenatedword{Bierde"ckel}
>
> \stoptext
>
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