* Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable)
@ 2012-02-24 11:51 Jan Heinen
2012-02-24 12:00 ` luigi scarso
` (3 more replies)
0 siblings, 4 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Jan Heinen @ 2012-02-24 11:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: ntg-context
My book is ready and I want to print it next week.
1. The printer told me to set up my PDF with the following
values:
PDF/X-1a:2003,
ISO Coated v2 (ECI)
2. And I did:
\setupbackend
[format=PDF/X-1a:2003,
intent={ISO Coated v2 (ECI)}]
3. Then I send a test-PDF to my printer and got the
following answer:
4. The printers answer in german:
Die Ausgabebedingung ist mit FOGRA 39 hinterlegt. Dadurch
erscheint eine falsche Farbvoransicht. FOGRA 39 sind "nur"
Charakterisierungsdaten zur Erzeugung von ICC-Profilen für
die entsprechenden Ausgabebedingungen. Wenn die Bilddaten in
den "ISO Coated v2 (ECI)" Farbraum separiert wurden, sollte
dieser am Besten hier als Name hinterlegt werden. Die
Kennung der Ausgabebedingung wäre "Fogra 39".
I failed trying to translate this answer into english. I
hope there is someone here who understands the german answer.
Regards
Jannis
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable)
2012-02-24 11:51 Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable) Jan Heinen
@ 2012-02-24 12:00 ` luigi scarso
2012-02-24 12:18 ` Henning Hraban Ramm
` (2 subsequent siblings)
3 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: luigi scarso @ 2012-02-24 12:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 12:51 PM, Jan Heinen <JaHeinen@gmx.de> wrote:
> My book is ready and I want to print it next week.
>
> 1. The printer told me to set up my PDF with the following values:
> PDF/X-1a:2003,
> ISO Coated v2 (ECI)
>
> 2. And I did:
>
> \setupbackend
> [format=PDF/X-1a:2003,
> intent={ISO Coated v2 (ECI)}]
>
> 3. Then I send a test-PDF to my printer and got the following answer:
>
> 4. The printers answer in german:
> Die Ausgabebedingung ist mit FOGRA 39 hinterlegt. Dadurch erscheint eine
> falsche Farbvoransicht. FOGRA 39 sind "nur" Charakterisierungsdaten zur
> Erzeugung von ICC-Profilen für die entsprechenden Ausgabebedingungen. Wenn
> die Bilddaten in den "ISO Coated v2 (ECI)" Farbraum separiert wurden,
> sollte dieser am Besten hier als Name hinterlegt werden. Die Kennung der
> Ausgabebedingung wäre "Fogra 39".
>
> I failed trying to translate this answer into english. I hope there is
> someone here who understands the german answer.
I presume that you have downloaded the right profile into
tex/texmf-context/colors/icc/profiles
If no, have a look at
tex/texmf-context/colors/icc/context
and
http://wiki.contextgarden.net/PDFX
--
luigi
___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable)
2012-02-24 11:51 Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable) Jan Heinen
2012-02-24 12:00 ` luigi scarso
@ 2012-02-24 12:18 ` Henning Hraban Ramm
2012-02-24 13:05 ` Peter Rolf
2012-02-24 16:20 ` Peter Rolf
3 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Henning Hraban Ramm @ 2012-02-24 12:18 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users
Am 24. Februar 2012 12:51 schrieb Jan Heinen <JaHeinen@gmx.de>:
> My book is ready and I want to print it next week.
>
> 1. The printer told me to set up my PDF with the following values:
> PDF/X-1a:2003,
> ISO Coated v2 (ECI)
>
> 2. And I did:
>
> \setupbackend
> [format=PDF/X-1a:2003,
> intent={ISO Coated v2 (ECI)}]
Since ConTeXt doesn’t touch your pictures color spaces or profiles,
you need to make sure all of them are converted to the same CMYK color
space.
It would be enough if each of them had a correct profile, regardless
of color space, if you printshop would accept PDF/X-3, but PDF/X-1
doesn’t allow mixed profiles or deviating color spaces.
> 3. Then I send a test-PDF to my printer and got the following answer:
>
> 4. The printers answer in german:
> Die Ausgabebedingung ist mit FOGRA 39 hinterlegt. Dadurch erscheint eine
> falsche Farbvoransicht. FOGRA 39 sind "nur" Charakterisierungsdaten zur
> Erzeugung von ICC-Profilen für die entsprechenden Ausgabebedingungen. Wenn
> die Bilddaten in den "ISO Coated v2 (ECI)" Farbraum separiert wurden,
> sollte dieser am Besten hier als Name hinterlegt werden. Die Kennung der
> Ausgabebedingung wäre "Fogra 39".
He says (i.e. my understanding of what he wants to say):
The output profile [of the PDF] is set as "FOGRA 39" [that is a
variant of ISO Coated]. That's the reson for a wrong color preview.
FOGRA 39 is "only" characterization data for according output
conditions. If you separated your image data to ISO Coated v2 ECI [a
different variant of ISO Coated], then you must set that as output
profile. But our output conditions are FOGRA 39.
I.e., as I said above, don’t use or declare different profiles.
Greetlings, Hraban
___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable)
2012-02-24 11:51 Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable) Jan Heinen
2012-02-24 12:00 ` luigi scarso
2012-02-24 12:18 ` Henning Hraban Ramm
@ 2012-02-24 13:05 ` Peter Rolf
2012-02-24 16:20 ` Peter Rolf
3 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: Peter Rolf @ 2012-02-24 13:05 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users, Jan Heinen
Am 24.02.2012 12:51, schrieb Jan Heinen:
> My book is ready and I want to print it next week.
>
> 1. The printer told me to set up my PDF with the following values:
> PDF/X-1a:2003,
> ISO Coated v2 (ECI)
>
> 2. And I did:
>
> \setupbackend
> [format=PDF/X-1a:2003,
> intent={ISO Coated v2 (ECI)}]
>
> 3. Then I send a test-PDF to my printer and got the following answer:
>
> 4. The printers answer in german:
> Die Ausgabebedingung ist mit FOGRA 39 hinterlegt. Dadurch erscheint eine
> falsche Farbvoransicht. FOGRA 39 sind "nur" Charakterisierungsdaten zur
> Erzeugung von ICC-Profilen für die entsprechenden Ausgabebedingungen.
> Wenn die Bilddaten in den "ISO Coated v2 (ECI)" Farbraum separiert
> wurden, sollte dieser am Besten hier als Name hinterlegt werden. Die
> Kennung der Ausgabebedingung wäre "Fogra 39".
>
> I failed trying to translate this answer into english. I hope there is
> someone here who understands the german answer.
>
You can try to edit the 'id' entry of 'ISO Coated v2 (ECI)' in
?/texmf-context/colors/icc/context/colorprofiles.xml
(just replace 'FOGRA39' with 'Fogra 39')
...
<profile>
<filename>ISOcoated_v2_eci.icc</filename>
<colorspace>CMYK</colorspace>
<class>prtr</class>
<id>Fogra 39</id>
<info>ISO Coated v2 (ECI)</info>
<checksum>bda07efcacf5377e91edacb0454ea7e5</checksum>
<version>2400000</version>
<url>http://www.color.org</url>
<outputcondition>Offset printing, according to ISO
12647-2:2004/Amd 1, OFCOM, paper type 1 or 2 = coated art, 115 g/m2,
tone value increase curves A (CMY) and B (K)</outputcondition>
</profile>
...
If I remember it right, this 'id' entry is no unique identifier, as some
profiles use the same value here. But I have to refresh my knowledge
about icc profiles a bit, before I can give a final answer.
Peter
> Regards
> Jannis
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry
> to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable)
2012-02-24 11:51 Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable) Jan Heinen
` (2 preceding siblings ...)
2012-02-24 13:05 ` Peter Rolf
@ 2012-02-24 16:20 ` Peter Rolf
2012-02-24 16:25 ` luigi scarso
3 siblings, 1 reply; 6+ messages in thread
From: Peter Rolf @ 2012-02-24 16:20 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users, Jan Heinen
Am 24.02.2012 12:51, schrieb Jan Heinen:
> My book is ready and I want to print it next week.
>
> 1. The printer told me to set up my PDF with the following values:
> PDF/X-1a:2003,
> ISO Coated v2 (ECI)
>
> 2. And I did:
>
> \setupbackend
> [format=PDF/X-1a:2003,
> intent={ISO Coated v2 (ECI)}]
>
> 3. Then I send a test-PDF to my printer and got the following answer:
>
> 4. The printers answer in german:
> Die Ausgabebedingung ist mit FOGRA 39 hinterlegt. Dadurch erscheint eine
> falsche Farbvoransicht. FOGRA 39 sind "nur" Charakterisierungsdaten zur
> Erzeugung von ICC-Profilen für die entsprechenden Ausgabebedingungen.
> Wenn die Bilddaten in den "ISO Coated v2 (ECI)" Farbraum separiert
> wurden, sollte dieser am Besten hier als Name hinterlegt werden. Die
> Kennung der Ausgabebedingung wäre "Fogra 39".
>
> I failed trying to translate this answer into english. I hope there is
> someone here who understands the german answer.
>
4. The printers answer in (d)english:
The output condition is set to 'FOGRA39', which results in wrong colors
in the output preview.
'FOGRA39' is 'only' the label for the characterization data, which are
used for the creation of icc profiles with according output conditions.
For the image data separation to the 'ISO Coated v2 (ECI)' color space
it's best to use the identifier 'Fogra 39'.
The related 'id' field is used to set the so called
'OutputConditionIdentifier' entry in the output intent. In the
definition of 'OutputConditionIdentifier' (PDF Reference, version 1.7,
p.971) it says:
...
A typical value for this entry would be the name of a production
condition maintained in an industry-standard registry such as
the ICC Characterisation Data Registry (see the Bibliography). If
the designated condition matches that in effect at production
time, the production software is responsible for providing the
corresponding ICC profile as defined in the registry.
...
Here is a list of the registered CMYK characterization data sets for
standard printing processes.
http://www.color.org/chardata/drsection1.xalter
**Only capital letters, no spaces in the fogra entries.**
Mh, have I missed something here?
My assumption: the separation software makes the wrong decision based on
the 'OutputConditionIdentifier' entry.
A reason for this could be, that the icc profile for the output intent
is **NOT EMBEDDED**, so the software is forced to search its own icc
profile library (which fails).
Possible solution A:
embed the profile (\setupbackend[..., option=always] ) and hope
that the software uses the included profile (should be the standard)
Possible solution B:
change the 'id' entry to a proprietary standard and hope that the
software uses the right profile
Just out of curiosity: which separator software does the printing house use?
Best wishes, Peter
___________________________________________________________________________________
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maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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___________________________________________________________________________________
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 6+ messages in thread
* Re: Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable)
2012-02-24 16:20 ` Peter Rolf
@ 2012-02-24 16:25 ` luigi scarso
0 siblings, 0 replies; 6+ messages in thread
From: luigi scarso @ 2012-02-24 16:25 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: mailing list for ConTeXt users
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 5:20 PM, Peter Rolf <indiego@gmx.net> wrote:
> Am 24.02.2012 12:51, schrieb Jan Heinen:
>> My book is ready and I want to print it next week.
>>
>> 1. The printer told me to set up my PDF with the following values:
>> PDF/X-1a:2003,
>> ISO Coated v2 (ECI)
>>
>> 2. And I did:
>>
>> \setupbackend
>> [format=PDF/X-1a:2003,
>> intent={ISO Coated v2 (ECI)}]
>>
>> 3. Then I send a test-PDF to my printer and got the following answer:
>>
>> 4. The printers answer in german:
>> Die Ausgabebedingung ist mit FOGRA 39 hinterlegt. Dadurch erscheint eine
>> falsche Farbvoransicht. FOGRA 39 sind "nur" Charakterisierungsdaten zur
>> Erzeugung von ICC-Profilen für die entsprechenden Ausgabebedingungen.
>> Wenn die Bilddaten in den "ISO Coated v2 (ECI)" Farbraum separiert
>> wurden, sollte dieser am Besten hier als Name hinterlegt werden. Die
>> Kennung der Ausgabebedingung wäre "Fogra 39".
>>
>> I failed trying to translate this answer into english. I hope there is
>> someone here who understands the german answer.
>>
>
> 4. The printers answer in (d)english:
> The output condition is set to 'FOGRA39', which results in wrong colors
> in the output preview.
> 'FOGRA39' is 'only' the label for the characterization data, which are
> used for the creation of icc profiles with according output conditions.
> For the image data separation to the 'ISO Coated v2 (ECI)' color space
> it's best to use the identifier 'Fogra 39'.
>
>
> The related 'id' field is used to set the so called
> 'OutputConditionIdentifier' entry in the output intent. In the
> definition of 'OutputConditionIdentifier' (PDF Reference, version 1.7,
> p.971) it says:
>
> ...
>
> A typical value for this entry would be the name of a production
> condition maintained in an industry-standard registry such as
> the ICC Characterisation Data Registry (see the Bibliography). If
> the designated condition matches that in effect at production
> time, the production software is responsible for providing the
> corresponding ICC profile as defined in the registry.
>
> ...
>
> Here is a list of the registered CMYK characterization data sets for
> standard printing processes.
>
> http://www.color.org/chardata/drsection1.xalter
>
> **Only capital letters, no spaces in the fogra entries.**
> Mh, have I missed something here?
>
>
> My assumption: the separation software makes the wrong decision based on
> the 'OutputConditionIdentifier' entry.
> A reason for this could be, that the icc profile for the output intent
> is **NOT EMBEDDED**, so the software is forced to search its own icc
> profile library (which fails).
quite possible, given that the profile is not included into the standalone
Jan, are you sure that you have the file of the profile into the folder
tex/texmf-context/colors/icc/profiles
?
--
luigi
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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___________________________________________________________________________________
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2012-02-24 11:51 Preparing the print: ICC-Profiles, Fogra, (in german untranslatable) Jan Heinen
2012-02-24 12:00 ` luigi scarso
2012-02-24 12:18 ` Henning Hraban Ramm
2012-02-24 13:05 ` Peter Rolf
2012-02-24 16:20 ` Peter Rolf
2012-02-24 16:25 ` luigi scarso
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