From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.comp.tex.context/88812 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Sander Maijers Newsgroups: gmane.comp.tex.context Subject: Re: (MKIV beta) APA citations: "et al." incorrectly written Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:47:45 +0200 Message-ID: References: <20140930203219.117d3ef1@iram-ha-003587.extra.cea.fr> Reply-To: mailing list for ConTeXt users NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0431880673==" X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1412102918 14221 80.91.229.3 (30 Sep 2014 18:48:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 18:48:38 +0000 (UTC) Cc: ntg-context@ntg.nl To: Alan BRASLAU Original-X-From: ntg-context-bounces@ntg.nl Tue Sep 30 20:48:34 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: gctc-ntg-context-518@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from balder.ntg.nl ([5.39.185.229]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1XZ2TN-0002mW-6h for gctc-ntg-context-518@m.gmane.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:48:29 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by balder.ntg.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFFFE10201 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:48:28 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at balder.ntg.nl Original-Received: from balder.ntg.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (balder.ntg.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id ZVivcyJmMhe5 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:48:27 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from balder.ntg.nl (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by balder.ntg.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6747910236 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:47:51 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by balder.ntg.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4082810201 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:47:48 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at balder.ntg.nl Original-Received: from balder.ntg.nl ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (balder.ntg.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id r848KL77d1mN for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:47:47 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from filter1-utr.mf.surf.net (filter1-utr.mf.surf.net [195.169.124.152]) by balder.ntg.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0801C101FF for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:47:46 +0200 (CEST) Original-Received: from mail-la0-x22a.google.com (mail-la0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c03::22a]) by filter1-utr.mf.surf.net (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-9.4) with ESMTP id s8UIla8C026435 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:47:36 +0200 Original-Received: by mail-la0-f42.google.com with SMTP id mk6so4528449lab.15 for ; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:47:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=LmAVFT2+zr73eXjsXrB6eV9UUSDpdJsyNGJyXPci8qU=; b=jdbMTYxRIUf3tZSUtyWXPX4mYHql2MzeFOtveUmGa+4zW1XrUroAdqnIu4wd1X2Lo2 kNkEhajoGVGeza06rT7m416v4y7ZMbz11vdhB5JapzRIqjTkgUSTr//afWGQzV845uHQ FUaO6Lgf5VB9L63vBQ72OzDfu9vcuR7F/GXw5qG2/M2qu5QcIhvjguUB9QihB3O/0lG/ 9GNt+fyVVyzLad1Fpf19yr0Y3JIg4+XNxP1KaO3+FSkcO+E3LgOOGPf4u7A3EFu34jPj +JNjn0RF1aWe/QQTqHqQVqg69yP8wFiWifzMlyaHZT879l5TofBhaibMvwtEgA5m8Ine mmjQ== X-Received: by 10.112.35.199 with SMTP id k7mr8577003lbj.76.1412102865350; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:47:45 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.152.198.225 with HTTP; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:47:45 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20140930203219.117d3ef1@iram-ha-003587.extra.cea.fr> X-Bayes-Prob: 0.0001 (Score 0, tokens from: ntg-context@ntg.nl, base:default, @@RPTN) X-CanIt-Geo: ip=2a00:1450:4010:c03::22a; country=IE X-CanItPRO-Stream: uu:ntg-context@ntg.nl (inherits from uu:default, base:default) X-Canit-Stats-ID: 07MVuLA53 - 26959df3e157 - 20140930 (trained as not-spam) X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . roaringpenguin . com) X-BeenThere: ntg-context@ntg.nl X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.16 Precedence: list List-Id: mailing list for ConTeXt users List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: ntg-context-bounces@ntg.nl Original-Sender: "ntg-context" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.comp.tex.context:88812 Archived-At: --===============0431880673== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c37286acf46505044cd1e5 --001a11c37286acf46505044cd1e5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Alan, I'm writing a thesis in ConTeXt so I'm keen to make this work. I can test things, and I hope that the basics of APA are covered already? Also, a temporary solution could be to allow explicit choice of the citation format and to rely on the author to make the proper choice, as long as automatic formatting hasn't been completed. All I want in the short term is to keep track of references to show them in a proper format - it needn't be easy and/or automatic for now. Best,=E2=80=8B Sander Maijers On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 8:32 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote: > Hello, > > These are the sort of details that we are trying to address with the > new bibliography subsystem. The APA rules (reference: Publication > Manual of the APA, 6th edition) give many special cases, some of which > can be a bit tricky. > > The mkii/mkiv bibliography module that you are using does a good job but > is not so sophisticated. The new mkiv rewrite is (unfortunately) still > work in progress and is not quite "production" ready. The new subsystem > was one topic of the recent ConTeXt meeting. > > You can continue to address bibliography questions to the list, or to me > directly as I am presently working on this with Hans "in my spare > time" (Luigi and Thomas are also actively involved). This does not > solve your immediate problem, however. > > Alan > > > On Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:19:36 +0200 > Sander Maijers wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > I use > > > > > This is LuaTeX, Version beta-0.79.1 (TeX Live 2014/dev) (rev 4972) > > > > > > ConTeXt ver: 2014.09.27 14:46 MKIV beta fmt: 2014.9.30 int: > > > english/english > > > > > > > I want citations to respect APA rules, as described here: > > > http://blog.apastyle.org/apastyle/2011/11/the-proper-use-of-et-al-in-apa-= style.htm > > l > > > > *Problem*: when I cite a work with three authors, "et al." appears > > in the first citation. > > > > *Example*: > > > > \setupbibtex[database=3D{references/bibliographic_database},sort=3Dauth= or] > > > \setuppublications[alternative=3Dapa] > > > > > > \starttext > > > \cite[extras=3D{, p.~3}][Zhou2012] > > > \cite[Zhou2012] > > > \stoptext > > > > > > > Incorrectly produces: > > > > > (Zhou et al., 2012, p. 3) (Zhou et al., 2012) > > > > > > > Instead of: > > > > > (Zhou, Lyu, & King, 2012, p. 3) (Zhou, Lyu, & King, 2012) > > > > > > Where the BibTeX entry is > > > > > @inproceedings{Zhou2012, > > > address =3D {New York, New York, USA}, > > > annote =3D {2/5}, > > > author =3D {Zhou, Tom Chao and Lyu, Michael R. and King, Irwin}, > > > booktitle =3D {Proceedings of the 21st international conference > > > companion on World Wide Web - WWW '12 Companion}, > > > doi =3D {10.1145/2187980.2188201}, > > > isbn =3D {9781450312301}, > > > keywords =3D {classification,community question answering,question > > > routing}, month =3D apr, > > > pages =3D {783}, > > > publisher =3D {ACM Press}, > > > title =3D {{A classification-based approach to question routing in > > > community question answering}}, > > > url =3D {http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=3D2187980.2188201}, > > > year =3D {2012} > > > } > > > > > > > I hope someone can help me with this. > > > > Best regards, > > Sander Maijers > > > > -- > Alan Braslau > CEA DSM-IRAMIS-SPEC > CNRS URA 2464 > Orme des Merisiers > 91191 Gif-sur-Yvette cedex FRANCE > tel: +33 1 69 08 73 15 > fax: +33 1 69 08 87 86 > mailto:alan.braslau@cea.fr > --001a11c37286acf46505044cd1e5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Alan,

I'm writing a thesis in ConTeXt so I'= m keen to make this work. I can test things, and I hope that the basics of = APA are covered already? Also, a temporary solution could be to allow expli= cit choice of the citation format and to rely on the author to make the pro= per choice, as long as automatic formatting hasn't been completed. All = I want in the short term is to keep track of references to show them in a p= roper format - it needn't be easy and/or automatic for now.

Bes= t,=E2=80=8B

Sander Maijers
<= /span>

On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 8:32 PM, Alan BRASLA= U <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:
Hello,

These are the sort of details that we are trying to address with the
new bibliography subsystem. The APA rules (reference: Publication
Manual of the APA, 6th edition) give many special cases, some of which
can be a bit tricky.

The mkii/mkiv bibliography module that you are using does a good job but is not so sophisticated. The new mkiv rewrite is (unfortunately) still
work in progress and is not quite "production" ready. The new sub= system
was one topic of the recent ConTeXt meeting.

You can continue to address bibliography questions to the list, or to me directly as I am presently working on this with Hans "in my spare
time" (Luigi and Thomas are also actively involved). This does not
solve your immediate problem, however.

Alan


On Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:19:36 +0200
Sander Maijers <s.n.maijers@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I use
>
> > This is LuaTeX, Version beta-0.79.1 (TeX Live 2014/dev) (rev 4972= )
> >
> > ConTeXt=C2=A0 ver: 2014.09.27 14:46 MKIV beta=C2=A0 fmt: 2014.9= .30=C2=A0 int:
> > english/english
> >
>
> I want citations to respect APA rules, as described here:
> http://blog.apastyle.org/apastyl= e/2011/11/the-proper-use-of-et-al-in-apa-style.htm
> l
>
> *Problem*: when I cite a work with three authors, "et al."= =C2=A0 appears
> in the first citation.
>
> *Example*:
>
> \setupbibtex[database=3D{references/bibliographic_database},sort=3Daut= hor]
> > \setuppublications[alternative=3Dapa]
> >
> > \starttext
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0\cite[extras=3D{, p.~3}][Zhou2012]
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0\cite[Zhou2012]
> > \stoptext
> >
>
> Incorrectly produces:
>
> > (Zhou et al., 2012, p. 3) (Zhou et al., 2012)
> >
>
> Instead of:
>
> > (Zhou, Lyu, & King, 2012, p. 3) (Zhou, Lyu, & King, 2012)=
>
>
> Where the BibTeX entry is
>
> > @inproceedings{Zhou2012,
> > address =3D {New York, New York, USA},
> > annote =3D {2/5},
> > author =3D {Zhou, Tom Chao and Lyu, Michael R. and King, Irwin},<= br> > > booktitle =3D {Proceedings of the 21st international conference > > companion on World Wide Web - WWW '12 Companion},
> > doi =3D {10.1145/2187980.2188201},
> > isbn =3D {9781450312301},
> > keywords =3D {classification,community question answering,questio= n
> > routing}, month =3D apr,
> > pages =3D {783},
> > publisher =3D {ACM Press},
> > title =3D {{A classification-based approach to question routing i= n
> > community question answering}},
> > url =3D {http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=3D2187980.21882= 01},
> > year =3D {2012}
> > }
> >
>
> I hope someone can help me with this.
>
> Best regards,
> Sander Maijers



--
Alan Braslau
CEA DSM-IRAMIS-SPEC
CNRS URA 2464
Orme des Merisiers
91191 Gif-sur-Yvette cedex FRANCE
tel: +33 1 69 08 73 15
fax: +33 1 69 08 87 86
mailto:alan.brasla= u@cea.fr

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