Re: Second derivative ''

["Mikael P. Sundqvist" <mickep@gmail.com>]

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On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 6:34 PM Hans Hagen <j.hagen@xs4all.nl> wrote:

> On 3/5/2020 5:41 PM, Mikael P. Sundqvist wrote:
> > On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 5:36 PM Aditya Mahajan <adityam@umich.edu
> > <mailto:adityam@umich.edu>> wrote:
> >
> >     On Thu, 5 Mar 2020, Hans Hagen wrote:
> >
> >      > On 3/4/2020 11:44 PM, Weber, Matthias wrote:
> >      >> Dear List,
> >      >>
> >      >> \starttext
> >      >> \startformula
> >      >> \left(f\right)'' = f''
> >      >> \stopformula
> >      >> \stoptext
> >      >>
> >      >> has the second apostrophe set too low. This is in MKIV on
> >     ConTeXt live as
> >      > well as in my slightly older version.
> >      >> What is the “right” way to typeset a second derivative?
> >      > you have to turn on
> >      >
> >      > \setupmathematics
> >      >   [collapsing=3]
> >      >
> >      > but it has the side effect of also collapsing more:
> >      >
> >      > $x'' >= 10$
> >      >
> >      > (which is why the mechanism is currently turned off by default)
> >      >
> >      > i'll think about an option that only does some specific ones only
> >      >
> >      > (btw, i love tex but these primes are a bit painful due to th
> >     eorriginal
> >      > approach which has lead mixtures of (1) raised in the font and/or
> >     raised
> >      > in the engine, (2) them being superscripts but not really, (3)
> fonts
> >      > therefore doing it inconsistently, (4) some parsing related to
> >     multiple
> >      > scripts, (5) double, tripple, etc primes being real unicode
> >     characters
> >      > but spaced singles in traditional tex (which itself then
> >     introduces some
> >      > size juggling) ... i could proabbly write a few pages about it)
> >
> >     So what's the best way to input them: using \prime, \prime\prime,
> etc.?
> >
> >
>  Aditya___________________________________________________________________________________
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> >
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>  ___________________________________________________________________________________
> >
> >
> > And what is the way if one also want indices:
> >
> > $f''_{xx}$ or $f_{xx}''$ or ... ?
> >
> > I want the indices under the primes
>
> did you try with
>
> \setupmathematics
>    [collapsing=1]
>
> both work but (i'm no mathematician) i'd opt for
>
> $f_{xx}''$
>
> as it says take the second something from f_{whatever} unless of course
> the index applies the second something
>
> But i bet that Aditya can give the real answer.
>
> Hans
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                            Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>                Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>         tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
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>

Oh, I had not. It looks better with collapsing=1, indeed. A few neq
questions comes to me:

Does ConTeXt not use the same prime character as in TeX/LaTeX? Or has
something changed in latin modern? See the attached pdf files
(derivatives.pdf from ConTeXt and primetime-crop.pdf from lualatex). The
prime character looks more slanted in ConTeXt. It also almost looks like it
is cut horizontally at the bottom of the character. Also, the space between
the two x in the subscript looks a bit large to me. Is that easily tuned?

/Mikael

The ConTeXt file:
\starttext
\startTEXpage[offset=1bp]
\setupmathematics[collapsing=1]
$f_{xx}''$
\stopTEXpage
\stoptext

The LaTeX file:
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{lmodern}
\pagestyle{empty}
\begin{document}
$f_{xx}''$
\end{document}

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