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* MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
@ 2013-05-30 12:00 Alan BRASLAU
  2013-05-30 13:14 ` Otared Kavian
  2013-05-30 18:35 ` Rogers, Michael K
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Alan BRASLAU @ 2013-05-30 12:00 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: ntg-context

Hello,

A colleague who uses a very recent MacBook with the latest MacOS
has a problem with PDF files that I provide produced with ConTeXt/luatex.

It appears that he cannot search for words (text) in the document,
neither with preview nor in the finder (they must be based on the same code).
However, I had him install Adobe Reader, and using this he can search for text
in the ConTeXt produced document, so I do not believe that the PDF has a problem,
rather this is a bug with the Apple PDF tools.

Does anyone else using MacOS have any experience with this?
Or can you all search for text (words) within ConTeXt produced PDF documents
using preview and the finder?

Thank you

Alan
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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-30 12:00 MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf Alan BRASLAU
@ 2013-05-30 13:14 ` Otared Kavian
  2013-05-30 18:35 ` Rogers, Michael K
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Otared Kavian @ 2013-05-30 13:14 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

Hi Alan,

I do use mkiv n Mac OS X and PDFs do not show the problem you mention: they are searchable and text can be copied from them without any problem.

If you send me an example of PDF file which shows this kind of problem, I can test it on my machine and the n let you know.

Best regards: OK

On 30 mai 2013, at 14:00, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> A colleague who uses a very recent MacBook with the latest MacOS
> has a problem with PDF files that I provide produced with ConTeXt/luatex.
> 
> It appears that he cannot search for words (text) in the document,
> neither with preview nor in the finder (they must be based on the same code).
> However, I had him install Adobe Reader, and using this he can search for text
> in the ConTeXt produced document, so I do not believe that the PDF has a problem,
> rather this is a bug with the Apple PDF tools.
> 
> Does anyone else using MacOS have any experience with this?
> Or can you all search for text (words) within ConTeXt produced PDF documents
> using preview and the finder?
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Alan
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
> 
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-30 12:00 MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf Alan BRASLAU
  2013-05-30 13:14 ` Otared Kavian
@ 2013-05-30 18:35 ` Rogers, Michael K
  2013-05-30 20:40   ` Alan BRASLAU
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Rogers, Michael K @ 2013-05-30 18:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

I do not have this problem with the documents I produce on my Mac.  I have had it with some (but not all) documents on ConTeXt sites, such as Hans' "ConTeXt Lua Documents."  Also I can select text but copy/paste does not work.  Perhaps it has to do with fonts.

Michael

On May 30, 2013, at 5:00 AM, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr>
 wrote:

> Hello,
>
> A colleague who uses a very recent MacBook with the latest MacOS
> has a problem with PDF files that I provide produced with ConTeXt/luatex.
>
> It appears that he cannot search for words (text) in the document,
> neither with preview nor in the finder (they must be based on the same code).
> However, I had him install Adobe Reader, and using this he can search for text
> in the ConTeXt produced document, so I do not believe that the PDF has a problem,
> rather this is a bug with the Apple PDF tools.
>
> Does anyone else using MacOS have any experience with this?
> Or can you all search for text (words) within ConTeXt produced PDF documents
> using preview and the finder?
>
> Thank you
>
> Alan
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________


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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-30 18:35 ` Rogers, Michael K
@ 2013-05-30 20:40   ` Alan BRASLAU
  2013-05-30 22:41     ` Hans Hagen
  2013-05-31  4:17     ` Otared Kavian
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Alan BRASLAU @ 2013-05-30 20:40 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Thu, 30 May 2013 18:35:19 +0000
"Rogers, Michael K" <mroge02@emory.edu> wrote:

> I do not have this problem with the documents I produce on my Mac.  I
> have had it with some (but not all) documents on ConTeXt sites, such
> as Hans' "ConTeXt Lua Documents."  Also I can select text but
> copy/paste does not work.  Perhaps it has to do with fonts.

The problem seems strange: there is no difficulty in viewing or
printing, but searches for words fail. I did not try copying.

Thank you all for the feedback. My document uses dejavu - I will
investigate this suggestion about fonts. It is not too surprising that
the Mac is buggy, but this is somewhat worrisome.

Alan
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-30 20:40   ` Alan BRASLAU
@ 2013-05-30 22:41     ` Hans Hagen
  2013-05-31  4:17     ` Otared Kavian
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Hans Hagen @ 2013-05-30 22:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On 5/30/2013 10:40 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:

> Thank you all for the feedback. My document uses dejavu - I will
> investigate this suggestion about fonts. It is not too surprising that
> the Mac is buggy, but this is somewhat worrisome.

indeed .. it should work (given that the viewer is ok)

Hans

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               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-30 20:40   ` Alan BRASLAU
  2013-05-30 22:41     ` Hans Hagen
@ 2013-05-31  4:17     ` Otared Kavian
  2013-05-31 12:37       ` Alan BRASLAU
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Otared Kavian @ 2013-05-31  4:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


On 30 mai 2013, at 22:40, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:

> […] It is not too surprising that the Mac is buggy, but this is somewhat worrisome.

I don't think the Mac, or the Mac OS X, is buggy… until it is proved that the problem is a real one on all Macs.
The documents produced by mkiv or mkii, the ones I produce and the ones produced by Hans and others are searchable, and text can be copied and pasted elsewhere.

Best regards: OK
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-31  4:17     ` Otared Kavian
@ 2013-05-31 12:37       ` Alan BRASLAU
  2013-05-31 12:53         ` Mojca Miklavec
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Alan BRASLAU @ 2013-05-31 12:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users; +Cc: otared

On Fri, 31 May 2013 06:17:49 +0200
Otared Kavian <otared@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 30 mai 2013, at 22:40, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:
> 
> > […] It is not too surprising that the Mac is buggy, but this is somewhat worrisome.  
> 
> I don't think the Mac, or the Mac OS X, is buggy… until it is proved that the problem is a real one on all Macs.
> The documents produced by mkiv or mkii, the ones I produce and the ones produced by Hans and others are searchable, and text can be copied and pasted elsewhere.

OK, the situation with the Mac is very strange.
Today (an odd day), we can search for *some* text, but not all words are found.
It does not have to do with special characters or formatting. Simple words.
And the result in the "finder" does not always correspond to that of "preview".

No problem copying and then pasting text.

Investigating the question of fonts, I produced alternate versions using different fonts.
All of these new files are indexed correctly, including a reprocessed version using dejavu.
They were all produced using the same context standalone macros and binaries (as previously)
and without any changes to the source files. My conclusion is that it is somehow a problem
with some sort of cache on the Mac (that is how searching is quick), indeed a *bug* somehow
corrupting this cache. So the problem must be real but highly irreproducible,
being highly contingent. The new files were, of course, not indexed and cached.

Conclusion, there is some sort of problem on Macs, but it is *not* with ConTeXt. Good!

Alan

P.S. Hans must be thinking that I have a problem with *odd* days... ;) 
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-31 12:37       ` Alan BRASLAU
@ 2013-05-31 12:53         ` Mojca Miklavec
  2013-05-31 13:32           ` Alan BRASLAU
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mojca Miklavec @ 2013-05-31 12:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
>
> OK, the situation with the Mac is very strange.
> Today (an odd day), we can search for *some* text, but not all words are found.
> It does not have to do with special characters or formatting. Simple words.
> And the result in the "finder" does not always correspond to that of "preview".

What exactly do you mean with search in finder? Searching for all
documents on your computer containing a specific word?

Do you also have problems searching for specific words in preview or
not (you said that results are different)?

I just remembered that sometimes (long ago) I had some kind of
"problems" due to some tiny kerning/boxes inserted into PDF between
characters to compensate for whatever (microtypography or just
"random" corrections to fix the second/third decimal of precision in
positioning). That sometimes confused readers which considered the
text to be two or three words when it was in fact one. But I don't
know if that is related. One can sometimes see that in google search
showing html version of a pdf document with seemingly randomly
distributed spaces.

Mojca
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-31 12:53         ` Mojca Miklavec
@ 2013-05-31 13:32           ` Alan BRASLAU
  2013-05-31 13:35             ` luigi scarso
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Alan BRASLAU @ 2013-05-31 13:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users; +Cc: mojca.miklavec.lists

On Fri, 31 May 2013 14:53:31 +0200
Mojca Miklavec <mojca.miklavec.lists@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
> >
> > OK, the situation with the Mac is very strange.
> > Today (an odd day), we can search for *some* text, but not all words are found.
> > It does not have to do with special characters or formatting. Simple words.
> > And the result in the "finder" does not always correspond to that of "preview".  
> 
> What exactly do you mean with search in finder? Searching for all
> documents on your computer containing a specific word?

I am not a Mac user so I do not know all of the proper "App" jargon.

I mean exactly opening the "finder" (file manager for normal people)
and searching for all documents containing a specific word.
(The word was "scarce" and "scarcity", not too frequent in his files... Ha, Ha!)
 
> Do you also have problems searching for specific words in preview or
> not (you said that results are different)?

Yes, and it depends on the specific word and only in certain files (on certain days).
I thus suspect a corrupted MacOS cache file...
 
> I just remembered that sometimes (long ago) I had some kind of
> "problems" due to some tiny kerning/boxes inserted into PDF between
> characters to compensate for whatever (microtypography or just
> "random" corrections to fix the second/third decimal of precision in
> positioning). That sometimes confused readers which considered the
> text to be two or three words when it was in fact one. But I don't
> know if that is related. One can sometimes see that in google search
> showing html version of a pdf document with seemingly randomly
> distributed spaces.

No, there is no problem using non-MacOS applications such as Adobe Reader.

Indeed, it does not appear to be a PDF problem but a MacOS problem.
As I am not interested in debugging the Mac, and I have now convinced myself
that there is no problem with the ConTeXt produced PDF, I have told my colleague
to be careful and *not* to rely on his search tool. Maybe it is just his Mac
that is corrupt. (Could also be an underlying file system problem.)

Alan
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maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-31 13:32           ` Alan BRASLAU
@ 2013-05-31 13:35             ` luigi scarso
  2013-05-31 16:24               ` Mica Semrick
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: luigi scarso @ 2013-05-31 13:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


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On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 3:32 PM, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:

> (The word was "scarce" and "scarcity", not too frequent in his files...
> Ha, Ha!)
>
> My surname, btw.



-- 
luigi

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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-31 13:35             ` luigi scarso
@ 2013-05-31 16:24               ` Mica Semrick
  2013-05-31 16:38                 ` Wolfgang Schuster
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Mica Semrick @ 2013-05-31 16:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 960 bytes --]

Have you tried clearing your font cache? It is explained at
http://www.extensis.com/support/knowledge-base/clearing-the-mac-os-x-font-cache/

best,
Mica


On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 6:35 AM, luigi scarso <luigi.scarso@gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
>
> On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 3:32 PM, Alan BRASLAU <alan.braslau@cea.fr> wrote:
>
>> (The word was "scarce" and "scarcity", not too frequent in his files...
>> Ha, Ha!)
>>
>> My surname, btw.
>
>
>
> --
> luigi
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
> the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>

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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf
  2013-05-31 16:24               ` Mica Semrick
@ 2013-05-31 16:38                 ` Wolfgang Schuster
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Wolfgang Schuster @ 2013-05-31 16:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users


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Am 31.05.2013 um 18:24 schrieb Mica Semrick <paperdigits@gmail.com>:

> Have you tried clearing your font cache? It is explained at http://www.extensis.com/support/knowledge-base/clearing-the-mac-os-x-font-cache/

You can also start in safe mode [1] which clears the font caches.

[1] http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1455?viewlocale=en_US

Wolfgang

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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2013-05-31 16:38 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2013-05-30 12:00 MAC (preview, finder) and ConTeXt pdf Alan BRASLAU
2013-05-30 13:14 ` Otared Kavian
2013-05-30 18:35 ` Rogers, Michael K
2013-05-30 20:40   ` Alan BRASLAU
2013-05-30 22:41     ` Hans Hagen
2013-05-31  4:17     ` Otared Kavian
2013-05-31 12:37       ` Alan BRASLAU
2013-05-31 12:53         ` Mojca Miklavec
2013-05-31 13:32           ` Alan BRASLAU
2013-05-31 13:35             ` luigi scarso
2013-05-31 16:24               ` Mica Semrick
2013-05-31 16:38                 ` Wolfgang Schuster

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