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* The ConTeXt book
@ 2010-04-03 13:51 Michael Saunders
  2010-04-03 14:29 ` Peter Münster
                   ` (2 more replies)
  0 siblings, 3 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Michael Saunders @ 2010-04-03 13:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: ntg-context

Wolfgang:

Thanks---I'll go over what I can of those this weekend and get back to
you and Taco about them in a few days.

Peter:

> > That's the feeling I'm getting.  I'm finding it hard to do a lot of
> > basic things in Context.  Maybe Context can do them and maybe it
> > can't, but there is no way to find out.
>
> Could you please provide a typical example?

Here are ten:

1. columns and marginal notes conflict:
\setupcolumns[n=2,rule=off,distance=20pt]
\setupinmargin[style=\ss,align=outer]
\startcolumns
text text \inmargin{text} text
\stopcolumns
The marginal notes always print to the left of the column.  This works
perfectly for the left column, but fails for the right column---they
overprint the text of the left column.

2. leftward protrusion fails
\definefontfeature[...][default][...,protrusion=quality,expansion=quality]
\setupalign[hanging,hz]
\showgrid  % or \showframe
There is no leftward protrusion at all.  Everything on the left edge
is flush with the margin, even 'T' and 'J'.  Similarly:

3. protrusion fails in footnotes:
Even on the right edge.  Hz isn't happening in them either.

4. interactive headers/footers
I'd like to make my header and footer texts hyperlinks to the head
that they point to.  I'm trying this:

\setupinteraction[state=start,color=darkgreen,contrastcolor=darkred]
\setupinteractionscreen[option=fit,view=fit]

\newcommand{\gmpt}{\getmarking[pt]}
\newcommand{\swpt}{{\goto{\getmarking[part]}[\gmpt]}}
\setupfootertexts[margin][\rlap\swpt\hfill][\hfill\llap{\getmarking[chapter]}]

(By the way, I'm resorting to this misdirection with the \newcommands
only because Context gives me an error whenever it finds nested
brackets.  E.g.,
\newcommand{\swpt}{{\goto{\getmarking[part]}[\getmarking[pt]]}}
would fail.)

Then, at the beginning of a part, I have to add the extra marking to
carry the reference in the 'pt' marker (right?), e.g.:

\part[pt:one]{One}\marking[pt]{pt:one}

But this does not work.  (By the way, all of this \defineXYZ,
\setupXYZ, \XYZ stuff is confusing.  It seems like there is some kind
of purpose to this pattern of naming, but I can't find what it is.)

So, I experimented:
{\about[pt:one]}
(a particular reference) works
{\about[\gmpt]}
(referring through the marking) fails---so I can find no automatic way
of doing it.

(By the way, why are my footnote markers all green---shouldn't they be
red?  could I make them black?  Why does clicking on them sometimes
send me to a random page?)

5. footnotes break between pages
How do I stop this?

6. hyphenation between pages.
How do I stop this?

7. opening state
I'd like my document to open in Adobe reader showing one page at a
time (as if "click to open one page at at time" had been pressed).

8. description
I spent the evening trying to get \definedescription to set a
description on a line of its own followed by an explanatory paragraph.
 I tried most of the keys/values.  I never got anything that looked
good, let alone close to what I wanted.  Finally, I spent a few
seconds writing a humble LaTeX-esque line:
\newcommand{\defhead}{\switchtobodyfont[gillSB,12pt]\ss}
\newcommand{\desclist}[2]{\crlf{\noindent\defhead #1\emspace#2}\crlf}
that did the job.

9. \raisebox?
What is the proper way to raise or lower a bit of text?  I just spent
a lot of trial and error to find this:
\inframed[frame=off,offset=.5pt,height=17.3pt]{--}
to raise my en-dashes a little when \setff{ac} (for all caps) didn't
work with one font.

10.  problematic characters in grid typesetting.
Unless I set grid=verytolerant, my 'Q' knocks the next line down a
notch.  Is there a better way to deal with this?


> > switch and finding it practically impossible.   I imagine many people
> > try, spend a week trying to get it to work and then give up and go
> > back to LaTeX.
>
> Why do you?

Because I think it might be possible to produce better output with
Context than with LaTeX (is this true?).  My experience has been quite
different from yours.  I got up an running with LaTeX in a week (in
1995), found the documentation clear and almost any effect I wanted
easy to achieve with well-documented packages that never seriously
conflicted.  This, on the other hand, is a nightmare.
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: The ConTeXt book
  2010-04-03 13:51 The ConTeXt book Michael Saunders
@ 2010-04-03 14:29 ` Peter Münster
  2010-04-03 14:37 ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2010-04-03 19:35 ` Marcin Borkowski
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Peter Münster @ 2010-04-03 14:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Sat, Apr 03 2010, Michael Saunders wrote:

> > > That's the feeling I'm getting.  I'm finding it hard to do a lot of
> > > basic things in Context.  Maybe Context can do them and maybe it
> > > can't, but there is no way to find out.
> >
> > Could you please provide a typical example?
> 
> Here are ten:

Hello Michael,

Thanks, I see clearer now (my understanding of "basic" was different...).


> 1. columns and marginal notes conflict:

For some of the issues, it would be perhaps a good idea to make proper
bug-reports (with minimal example of course).

Cheers, Peter

P.S.: Please consider fixing or changing your email client: it breaks the
threads.

-- 
Contact information: http://pmrb.free.fr/contact/


___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: The ConTeXt book
  2010-04-03 13:51 The ConTeXt book Michael Saunders
  2010-04-03 14:29 ` Peter Münster
@ 2010-04-03 14:37 ` Wolfgang Schuster
  2010-04-03 19:35 ` Marcin Borkowski
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Wolfgang Schuster @ 2010-04-03 14:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

Am 03.04.10 15:51, schrieb Michael Saunders:
> 2. leftward protrusion fails
> \definefontfeature[...][default][...,protrusion=quality,expansion=quality]
> \setupalign[hanging,hz]
> \showgrid  % or \showframe
> There is no leftward protrusion at all.  Everything on the left edge
> is flush with the margin, even 'T' and 'J'.  Similarly:
>    
Don't know what you mean, works here.

\definefontfeature[default][default][protrusion=quality]

\usetypescript[modern]
\setupbodyfont[modern]

\showframe

\starttext

\startbuffer
«text»\par
„text“\par
T\par
J\par
\stopbuffer

\getbuffer\setupalign[hanging]\getbuffer

\stoptext
> 3. protrusion fails in footnotes:
> Even on the right edge.  Hz isn't happening in them either.
>    
You have to enable it separate for notes.

\setupnote[footnote][align={normal,hanging}]
> 5. footnotes break between pages
> How do I stop this?
>    
No example, no help!
> 9. \raisebox?
> What is the proper way to raise or lower a bit of text?  I just spent
> a lot of trial and error to find this:
> \inframed[frame=off,offset=.5pt,height=17.3pt]{--}
> to raise my en-dashes a little when \setff{ac} (for all caps) didn't
> work with one font.
>    
\raisebox{1ex}{–}

What should ConTeXt do when your font doesn't provide the allcaps feature.
> 10.  problematic characters in grid typesetting.
> Unless I set grid=verytolerant, my 'Q' knocks the next line down a
> notch.  Is there a better way to deal with this?
>    
You can change the height/depth ratio of a line.

\setupinterlinespace[height=0.6,depth=0.4]

Wolfgang

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: The ConTeXt book
  2010-04-03 13:51 The ConTeXt book Michael Saunders
  2010-04-03 14:29 ` Peter Münster
  2010-04-03 14:37 ` Wolfgang Schuster
@ 2010-04-03 19:35 ` Marcin Borkowski
  2010-04-03 23:32   ` Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page Russell Urquhart
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Marcin Borkowski @ 2010-04-03 19:35 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

Dnia Sat, Apr 03, 2010 at 08:51:03AM -0500, Michael Saunders napisał(a):
> Because I think it might be possible to produce better output with
> Context than with LaTeX (is this true?).  My experience has been quite
> different from yours.  I got up an running with LaTeX in a week (in
> 1995), found the documentation clear and almost any effect I wanted
> easy to achieve with well-documented packages that never seriously
> conflicted.  This, on the other hand, is a nightmare.

Yep. But when you actually run into one of these problems in LaTeX, you
are often more or less left alone - unlike ConTeXt and this list.

A few examples: tikz (for some obscure reason) breaks some functionality
of empheq; align in intertext in align (yes, I needed something like
this!) in AMS-LaTeX doesn't work; hacking the (otherwise excellent)
amsrefs package (or any AMS-LaTeX package, for that matter) is a real
pain, but sometimes you just need it (for example, amsthm may be a
standard, but it just sucks in quite a few respects!).

============

My general thought on this discussion: someone said "why don't people
switch from LaTeX to ConTeXt if ConTeXt is better?".  The answer is
obvious to me.  First: 99% maths journals accept LaTeX, \epsilon of them
(if any) accept ConTeXt.  Second: people still use their LaTeX 2.09
preambles from the nineties, and spending even 30 minutes on learning a
new package (or just not using $$ ... $$ but \[ ... \] or anything)
seems impossible for them.  Third: sadly, nearly anyone just does not
care whether the results are beautiful or ugly; people (I'm talking
about mathematicians now) use (La|AMS|Con)TeX(t) not because it is
better than (word|OO), but because that is what journals want.

Personally, I use both LaTeX and ConTeXt: LaTeX when I need something
done quickly or when I want to share some code with others (who usually
use LaTeX), and ConTeXt when I have some time and want to learn
something new (or when I have a ready template which *just works(TM)*.)

Cheers

-- 
Marcin Borkowski (http://mbork.pl)
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page
  2010-04-03 19:35 ` Marcin Borkowski
@ 2010-04-03 23:32   ` Russell Urquhart
  2010-04-03 23:43     ` Aditya Mahajan
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Russell Urquhart @ 2010-04-03 23:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users



Hi,

in light of the Context book discussions, i had a question. Is there a version of the Excursion book, that is in a portrait format, without the controls on the side of the page.

Sorry if this is a nit, or an already answered question. This was the first book pointed to by the wiki!

Thanks for any and all help!


Russ
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page
  2010-04-03 23:32   ` Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page Russell Urquhart
@ 2010-04-03 23:43     ` Aditya Mahajan
  2010-04-04  0:04       ` Russell Urquhart
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Aditya Mahajan @ 2010-04-03 23:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Sat, 3 Apr 2010, Russell Urquhart wrote:

> Hi,
>
> in light of the Context book discussions, i had a question. Is there a 
> version of the Excursion book, that is in a portrait format, without the 
> controls on the side of the page.
>
> Sorry if this is a nit, or an already answered question. This was the first book pointed to by the wiki!

http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf

Aditya
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page
  2010-04-03 23:43     ` Aditya Mahajan
@ 2010-04-04  0:04       ` Russell Urquhart
  2010-04-04  0:24         ` Aditya Mahajan
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread
From: Russell Urquhart @ 2010-04-04  0:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

Cool thank you!

Suggestion. Do you think this should be on the front page of the wiki (maybe not replacing what is there, but as an additional link, detailing the format of this pdf?)

just a thought,

Thanks again!


Russ


On Sat, Apr 03, 2010 at 07:43:52PM -0400, Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> On Sat, 3 Apr 2010, Russell Urquhart wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> in light of the Context book discussions, i had a question. Is there a  
>> version of the Excursion book, that is in a portrait format, without 
>> the controls on the side of the page.
>>
>> Sorry if this is a nit, or an already answered question. This was the first book pointed to by the wiki!
>
> http://www.pragma-ade.com/general/manuals/mp-cb-en.pdf
>
> Aditya
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

* Re: Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page
  2010-04-04  0:04       ` Russell Urquhart
@ 2010-04-04  0:24         ` Aditya Mahajan
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread
From: Aditya Mahajan @ 2010-04-04  0:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: mailing list for ConTeXt users

On Sat, 3 Apr 2010, Russell Urquhart wrote:

> Cool thank you!
>
> Suggestion. Do you think this should be on the front page of the wiki 
> (maybe not replacing what is there, but as an additional link, detailing 
> the format of this pdf?)

Done.
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2010-04-04  0:24 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 8+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2010-04-03 13:51 The ConTeXt book Michael Saunders
2010-04-03 14:29 ` Peter Münster
2010-04-03 14:37 ` Wolfgang Schuster
2010-04-03 19:35 ` Marcin Borkowski
2010-04-03 23:32   ` Excursion PDf w/o controls on the page Russell Urquhart
2010-04-03 23:43     ` Aditya Mahajan
2010-04-04  0:04       ` Russell Urquhart
2010-04-04  0:24         ` Aditya Mahajan

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