IPA/TIPA support in Context?

IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Jason Knight]

What support is there for IPA/TIPA in Context at this point? I've had
a look through the mailing list archive and the last comment I saw
about it was from the first half of 2004. Has anyone done more hacking
on this?

Jason
--
Jason Knight
Systems-Analyst-at-large
"They fix 'em, I break 'em. Thus, analysis."

IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Jason Knight]

What support is there for IPA/TIPA in Context at this point? I've had
a look through the mailing list archive and the last comment I saw
about it was from the first half of 2004. Has anyone done more hacking
on this?

Jason
--
Jason Knight
Systems-Analyst-at-large
"They fix 'em, I break 'em. Thus, analysis."

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Taco Hoekwater]

Hi Jason,

Jason Knight wrote:
> What support is there for IPA/TIPA in Context at this point? I've had

I think the answer is zero or nearly zero. If you have a bit of
patience, I can do a port of tipa.sty (quite easy), but it will
take some time before I can start on it.

Cheers,

Taco

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Hans Hagen]

Taco Hoekwater wrote:

>
> Hi Jason,
>
> Jason Knight wrote:
>
>> What support is there for IPA/TIPA in Context at this point? I've had
>
>
> I think the answer is zero or nearly zero. If you have a bit of
> patience, I can do a port of tipa.sty (quite easy), but it will
> take some time before I can start on it.

in the process taco and i can discuss low level support issues as well; 
it's all a matter of demand and time; of course after a port, taco would 
mildly force you to write an article for the MAPS -)

Hans 

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Adam Lindsay]

Hans Hagen wrote:
> Taco Hoekwater wrote:
> 
>>
>> Hi Jason,
>>
>> Jason Knight wrote:
>>
>>> What support is there for IPA/TIPA in Context at this point? I've had
>>
>>
>>
>> I think the answer is zero or nearly zero. If you have a bit of
>> patience, I can do a port of tipa.sty (quite easy), but it will
>> take some time before I can start on it.
> 
> 
> in the process taco and i can discuss low level support issues as well; 
> it's all a matter of demand and time; of course after a port, taco would 
> mildly force you to write an article for the MAPS -)

I had done some basics with the font/encoding parts before. I solicited 
feedback on what next parts/features were important to tackle next, and 
I got nowhere. I'll try to dig this up and send it to you guys in the 
next few days. (Remind me if you don't hear from me!)

adam
-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
  Adam T. Lindsay, Computing Dept.     atl@comp.lancs.ac.uk
  Lancaster University, InfoLab21        +44(0)1524/510.514
  Lancaster, LA1 4WA, UK             Fax:+44(0)1524/510.492
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

>>> I think the answer is zero or nearly zero. If you have a bit of
>>> patience, I can do a port of tipa.sty (quite easy), but it will
>>> take some time before I can start on it.
>> in the process taco and i can discuss low level support issues as  
>> well; it's all a matter of demand and time; of course after a  
>> port, taco would mildly force you to write an article for the MAPS -)
> I had done some basics with the font/encoding parts before. I  
> solicited feedback on what next parts/features were important to  
> tackle next, and I got nowhere. I'll try to dig this up and send it  
> to you guys in the next few days. (Remind me if you don't hear from  
> me!)

Perhaps this is a stupid question, but do we need more than some  
definitions in the Unicode encoding vectors and typescripts for some  
fonts?
Is (T)IPA support about more than using some phonetic chars?
Please enlighten me.


Grüßlis vom Hraban!
---
http://www.fiee.net/texnique/
http://contextgarden.net
http://www.cacert.org (I'm an assurer)

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Taco Hoekwater]

Henning Hraban Ramm wrote:
> 
> Perhaps this is a stupid question, but do we need more than some  
> definitions in the Unicode encoding vectors and typescripts for some  
> fonts?
> Is (T)IPA support about more than using some phonetic chars?
> Please enlighten me.

AFAICT, there are:

   - 2 new font encodings needed (T3 and T3S), with associated
     named characters
   - a set of font definitions
   - unicode tables (for utf input) need extension
   - there are some macros in IPA for special input

That's about it for the basic TIPA font support, I guess.

For proper linguistic work, you need a large set of extra macros,
but those are not in the LaTeX tipa.sty either.

Greetings, Taco

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Jason Knight]

On 12/3/05, Taco Hoekwater <taco@elvenkind.com> wrote:
> Henning Hraban Ramm wrote:
> >
> > Perhaps this is a stupid question, but do we need more than some
> > definitions in the Unicode encoding vectors and typescripts for some
> > fonts?
> > Is (T)IPA support about more than using some phonetic chars?
> > Please enlighten me.
>
> AFAICT, there are:
>
>    - 2 new font encodings needed (T3 and T3S), with associated
>      named characters
>    - a set of font definitions
>    - unicode tables (for utf input) need extension
>    - there are some macros in IPA for special input
>
> That's about it for the basic TIPA font support, I guess.
>
> For proper linguistic work, you need a large set of extra macros,
> but those are not in the LaTeX tipa.sty either.
>
> Greetings, Taco
> _______________________________________________
> ntg-context mailing list
> ntg-context@ntg.nl
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
>

I've done some work with tipa under LaTeX as a beginning linguistics
student, though I didn't get into the guts at the time.

This threaed gets me thinking: how far away from "proper" is the tipa
package under LaTeX? How much work is a "proper" implementation likely
to be?

I'm in some ways a beginner "under the hood", but I'm pretty motivated
to get proper support in place.

Taco, your list above includes some stuff I'm unfamiliar with (T3
encoding, macros for IPA input), so I don't know how extensive the
work is likely to be. Which would be easier: scrap and re-write or
adapt?

--
Jason Knight
Systems-Analyst-at-large
"They fix 'em, I break 'em. Thus, analysis."

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Hans Hagen]

Jason Knight wrote:

> get into the guts at the time.
>
>This threaed gets me thinking: how far away from "proper" is the tipa
>package under LaTeX? How much work is a "proper" implementation likely
>to be?
>
>  
>
this is something you and steve peter (also a linguist) can tell us

>I'm in some ways a beginner "under the hood", but I'm pretty motivated
>to get proper support in place.
>
>  
>
so go ahead, figure out what you need and let us know; there is enough 
interface machinery around in context to implement things

Hans

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Steve Peter]

On Dec 6, 2005, at 3:15 AM, Hans Hagen wrote:

> Jason Knight wrote:
>
>> get into the guts at the time.
>>
>> This threaed gets me thinking: how far away from "proper" is the tipa
>> package under LaTeX? How much work is a "proper" implementation  
>> likely
>> to be?
>>
> this is something you and steve peter (also a linguist) can tell us

I'm actually not certain what's being asked. By being a "proper"  
package under LaTeX, do you mean that the package conforms to all  
norms for LaTeX package programming?

Or do you mean that the interface is "proper"? I don't know that that  
can really be judged. But since TIPA has become the de-facto  
standard, most linguists who use TeX have learned its interface. So I  
would aim to recreate that in ConTeXt, modulo the usual changes  
(\startIPA, etc.)

Or did I miss the point?

Steve

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Taco Hoekwater]

Steve Peter wrote:
> 
> On Dec 6, 2005, at 3:15 AM, Hans Hagen wrote:
> 
>> Jason Knight wrote:
>>
>>> get into the guts at the time.
>>>
>>> This threaed gets me thinking: how far away from "proper" is the tipa
>>> package under LaTeX? How much work is a "proper" implementation  likely
>>> to be?
>>>
>> this is something you and steve peter (also a linguist) can tell us
> 
> I'm actually not certain what's being asked. By being a "proper"  
> package under LaTeX, do you mean that the package conforms to all  norms 
> for LaTeX package programming?

That "proper" remark was made by me. What I meant was: TIPA is fine
for phonetics, but it is *only* phonetics. For full support for
typesetting in the field of linguistics, many more specialized
macros are needed, that are not handled by the TIPA package
(like glosses and trees in various styles).

Cheers,
Taco

Re: IPA/TIPA support in Context?

[Jason Knight]

On 12/2/05, Hans Hagen <pragma@wxs.nl> wrote:
> Taco Hoekwater wrote:
>
> >
> > Hi Jason,
> >
> > Jason Knight wrote:
> >
> >> What support is there for IPA/TIPA in Context at this point? I've had
> >
> >
> > I think the answer is zero or nearly zero. If you have a bit of
> > patience, I can do a port of tipa.sty (quite easy), but it will
> > take some time before I can start on it.
>
> in the process taco and i can discuss low level support issues as well;
> it's all a matter of demand and time; of course after a port, taco would
> mildly force you to write an article for the MAPS -)
>
> Hans
> _______________________________________________
> ntg-context mailing list
> ntg-context@ntg.nl
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
>

I'd be happy to write the article.


--
Jason Knight
Systems-Analyst-at-large
"They fix 'em, I break 'em. Thus, analysis."