Which version of MkIV should we use?

Which version of MkIV should we use?

[Rik Kabel]

Hello all,

I have noticed some differences between the MkIV installed as part of 
LMTX and the MkIV installed via first-setup.

Which should be used going forward when one wants to use MkIV?

(One difference: \contextkind is defined in file context.mkiv installed 
via first-setup. It is not defined in the file of the same name 
installed as part of LMTX. Another, more significant difference, is 
loading modules.)

-- 
Rik

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Re: Which version of MkIV should we use?

[Hans Hagen]

On 10/26/2020 12:09 AM, Rik Kabel wrote:
> Hello all,
> 
> I have noticed some differences between the MkIV installed as part of 
> LMTX and the MkIV installed via first-setup.
> 
> Which should be used going forward when one wants to use MkIV?
> 
> (One difference: \contextkind is defined in file context.mkiv installed 
> via first-setup. It is not defined in the file of the same name 
> installed as part of LMTX. Another, more significant difference, is 
> loading modules.)

mkiv works with luatex, lmtx needs luametatex

currently the functionality is mostly the same but further development 
happens in lmtx

so, if mkiv works for you, just keep using it .. you can try your 
document with lmtx and normally that should work ok

there is a distinction between

- core functionality (seldom changes)
- tricky things (migh tbe done better in lmtx)
- more radical new things hard to do in regular tex (will be in lmtx only)

the luametatex engine is more advanced than luatex (which we cannot 
change any more in fundamental ways as it's also used outside context) 
but with luametatex we can do (maybe) crazy things; the luametatex 
enfine has all kind of improvements in the rendening, adds functionality 
that makes implementations somewhat cleaner, is faster and uses less 
memory, redesigns/organizes some internals (e.g. get rid of the 
sometimes fuzzy accumulated engine mix), adds more interfaces in lua, is 
self contained, etc ... see presentation(s) last ctx meeting.

currently i'm applying some of the more drastic new thing: more advance 
macro argument parsing options, several levels of (macro) protection, 
etc which actually might lead to issues (simple to deal with as most are 
interface related, not functionality)

so ... you can use mkiv and/or snapshot the current lmtx and/or try the 
latest greatest when it showsup

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
        tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Which version of MkIV should we use?

[Rik Kabel]

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On 10/26/2020 04:37, Hans Hagen wrote:
> On 10/26/2020 12:09 AM, Rik Kabel wrote:
>> Hello all,
>>
>> I have noticed some differences between the MkIV installed as part of 
>> LMTX and the MkIV installed via first-setup.
>>
>> Which should be used going forward when one wants to use MkIV?
>>
>> (One difference: \contextkind is defined in file context.mkiv 
>> installed via first-setup. It is not defined in the file of the same 
>> name installed as part of LMTX. Another, more significant difference, 
>> is loading modules.)
>
> mkiv works with luatex, lmtx needs luametatex
>
> currently the functionality is mostly the same but further development 
> happens in lmtx
>
> so, if mkiv works for you, just keep using it .. you can try your 
> document with lmtx and normally that should work ok
>
> there is a distinction between
>
> - core functionality (seldom changes)
> - tricky things (migh tbe done better in lmtx)
> - more radical new things hard to do in regular tex (will be in lmtx 
> only)
>
> the luametatex engine is more advanced than luatex (which we cannot 
> change any more in fundamental ways as it's also used outside context) 
> but with luametatex we can do (maybe) crazy things; the luametatex 
> enfine has all kind of improvements in the rendening, adds 
> functionality that makes implementations somewhat cleaner, is faster 
> and uses less memory, redesigns/organizes some internals (e.g. get rid 
> of the sometimes fuzzy accumulated engine mix), adds more interfaces 
> in lua, is self contained, etc ... see presentation(s) last ctx meeting.
>
> currently i'm applying some of the more drastic new thing: more 
> advance macro argument parsing options, several levels of (macro) 
> protection, etc which actually might lead to issues (simple to deal 
> with as most are interface related, not functionality)
>
> so ... you can use mkiv and/or snapshot the current lmtx and/or try 
> the latest greatest when it showsup
>
> Hans
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>        tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
> -----------------------------------------------------------------

Hans,

Let me rephrase the question.

With the following example:

    \starttext

    \contextkind

    \stoptext

The standalone installation returns a document containing "beta" and 
context --luatex with the LMTX installation complains of an undefined 
control sequence.

The file context.mkiv differs between the two installations.

If the two are expected to differ, I am asking which is the reliable 
version.

You had stated in an earlier email that the --luatex option provided to 
an LMTX installation will produce an MkIV result, but that does not seem 
to still be the case.

-- 
Rik


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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: Which version of MkIV should we use?

[Rik Kabel]

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On 10/26/2020 08:05, Rik Kabel wrote:
> Hans,
>
> Let me rephrase the question.
>
> With the following example:
>
>     \starttext
>
>     \contextkind
>
>     \stoptext
>
> The standalone installation returns a document containing "beta" and 
> context --luatex with the LMTX installation complains of an undefined 
> control sequence.
>
> The file context.mkiv differs between the two installations.
>
> If the two are expected to differ, I am asking which is the reliable 
> version.
>
> You had stated in an earlier email that the --luatex option provided 
> to an LMTX installation will produce an MkIV result, but that does not 
> seem to still be the case.
>

My apologies to Hans and the list. My MkIV installation reverted to the 
2020-01-30 release at some point in late September or early October. I 
have corrected that and now see no differences other than version 
strings in the source directory.

-- 
Rik


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___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________