How could a typesetting system be today?

How could a typesetting system be today?

[Maurí­cio]

Hi,

Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
seems dead.

Does anyone knows about novel or interesting ideas that could be
used if we would write a new typesetting system from scratch?

Thanks for your thoughts,
Maurício

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Aditya Mahajan]

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On Fri, 30 May 2008, Maurí­cio wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
> be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
> all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
> seems dead.

There is ant http://ant.berlios.de/, but it is supposed to be saner form 
of TeX (in terms of source code, and easy of configuration) which was 
developed from scratch. The user interface is quite similar to TeX. I do 
not know much about the internal differences between Ant and TeX.

> Does anyone knows about novel or interesting ideas that could be
> used if we would write a new typesetting system from scratch?

River detection, which is done by ant, but not by TeX. Also since the 
computers now are more powerful, I think that doing page breaking on a 
global manner (or atleast by looking two three pages down, rather than 
just the current page), will make certain things (like long mathematical 
forumlas, and complex footnotes) appear nicely without a lot of manual 
tweaking.

Aditya

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[luigi scarso]

On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 7:08 AM, Aditya Mahajan <adityam@umich.edu> wrote:
> On Fri, 30 May 2008, Maurí­cio wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
>> be if it was created today?
luatex
http://www.luatex.org

> There is ant http://ant.berlios.de/

> River detection, which is done by ant, but not by TeX.
http://osdir.com/ml/tex.context/2001-01/msg00057.html

-- 
luigi
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Yue Wang]

> There is ant http://ant.berlios.de/, but it is supposed to be saner form of
> TeX (in terms of source code, and easy of configuration) which was developed
> from scratch. The user interface is quite similar to TeX. I do not know much
> about the internal differences between Ant and TeX.
>
ANT have many major improvements. But as to the output pdf file of
ANT, I cannot see much difference:(

> River detection, which is done by ant, but not by TeX. Also since the
> computers now are more powerful, I think that doing page breaking on a
> global manner (or atleast by looking two three pages down, rather than just
> the current page), will make certain things (like long mathematical
> forumlas, and complex footnotes) appear nicely without a lot of manual
> tweaking.
Agreed. River detection and global page break are very important for
an advanced Typesetting system.
I think control arbitrary streams on pages (available many advanced
software, like InDesign) are also useful.
I hope they will be in LuaTeX soon.
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Taco Hoekwater]

Maurí­cio wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
> be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
> all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
> seems dead.
> 
> Does anyone knows about novel or interesting ideas that could be
> used if we would write a new typesetting system from scratch?

Practically speaking, I expect it would be a lot like lyx with
tex built in. Who would design a document language without
front-end these days?


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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Taco Hoekwater]

Aditya Mahajan wrote:
> 
>> Does anyone knows about novel or interesting ideas that could be
>> used if we would write a new typesetting system from scratch?
> 
> River detection, which is done by ant, but not by TeX. 

If there was a clear algorithm I could implement that in luatex.
But I have not seen any whitepaper on the subject and I cannot
read OCaml source well enough to understand what is going on ...
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Yue Wang]

Hi.

> Practically speaking, I expect it would be a lot like lyx with
> tex built in. Who would design a document language without
> front-end these days?
>

Maybe using LuaTeX + wxLua + Poppler is a better approach?

Yue Wang
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Steffen Wolfrum]

Am 30.05.2008 um 09:12 schrieb Yue Wang:

> advanced software, like InDesign



Well, ...


Steffen
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Steffen Wolfrum]

Am 30.05.2008 um 09:12 schrieb Yue Wang:

> advanced software, like InDesign


well ... <cough> ...


Steffen
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Olivier Guéry]

On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 6:18 AM, Maurí­cio <briqueabraque@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
> be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
> all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
> seems dead.
>

I think that the input language would be xml in order to be easily
adapt to html, epub, odt…
The today difference is that we need to be able to put the text on
many different devices : paper, screen, epaper…

Olivier.


-- 
[Message tapé sur un clavier Bépo : http://www.clavier-dvorak.org ]
Olivier nemolivier@gmail.com http://nemolivier.blogspot.com
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Martin Schröder]

2008/5/30 Taco Hoekwater <taco@elvenkind.com>:
> Aditya Mahajan wrote:
>> River detection, which is done by ant, but not by TeX.
>
> If there was a clear algorithm I could implement that in luatex.
> But I have not seen any whitepaper on the subject and I cannot
> read OCaml source well enough to understand what is going on ...

AFAIK it doesn't work.

Best
   Martin
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Yue Wang]

On 5/30/08, Steffen Wolfrum <context@st.estfiles.de> wrote:
>
> Am 30.05.2008 um 09:12 schrieb Yue Wang:
>
> > advanced software, like InDesign
>
>
> well ... <cough> ...

There is no denying that many advanced features in InDesign are
missing in TeX(like) related software. What's more, the
internationalization of InDesign is better.
>
>
> Steffen
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
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>
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> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Idris Samawi Hamid]

Hi Yue,

On Fri, 30 May 2008 06:24:56 -0600, Yue Wang <yuleopen@gmail.com> wrote:

>> > advanced software, like InDesign
>>
>>
>> well ... <cough> ...
>
> There is no denying that many advanced features in InDesign are
> missing in TeX(like) related software. What's more, the
> internationalization of InDesign is better.

Can you give a precise list of the features contained in InDesign that are  
missing in (lua)TeX or which TeX does not support well?

Best wishes
Idris

-- 
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shi`i Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Steffen Wolfrum]

Am 30.05.2008 um 14:24 schrieb Yue Wang:

> On 5/30/08, Steffen Wolfrum <context@st.estfiles.de> wrote:
>>
>> Am 30.05.2008 um 09:12 schrieb Yue Wang:
>>
>>> advanced software, like InDesign
>>
>>
>> well ... <cough> ...
>
> There is no denying that many advanced features in InDesign are
> missing in TeX(like) related software. What's more, the
> internationalization of InDesign is better.


;o)

... you can buy a czech version or a polish version, for working with  
hebrew you may buy a hebrew or a middle eastern version ... and wasn't  
there also an arabic version to buy?

With TeX you only have one piece for all ... and you can't even buy it.


Steffen
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Alan BRASLAU]

On Friday 30 May 2008 16:15:08 Steffen Wolfrum wrote:
> Am 30.05.2008 um 14:24 schrieb Yue Wang:
> > On 5/30/08, Steffen Wolfrum <context@st.estfiles.de> wrote:
> >> Am 30.05.2008 um 09:12 schrieb Yue Wang:
> >>> advanced software, like InDesign
> >>
> >> well ... <cough> ...
> >
> > There is no denying that many advanced features in InDesign are
> > missing in TeX(like) related software. What's more, the
> > internationalization of InDesign is better.
>
> ;o)
>
> ... you can buy a czech version or a polish version, for working with
> hebrew you may buy a hebrew or a middle eastern version ... and wasn't
> there also an arabic version to buy?
>
> With TeX you only have one piece for all ... and you can't even buy it.
>
>
> Steffen
> ___________________________________________________________________________
>________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an
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> ___________________________________________________________________________
>________

You are also free to purchase future new versions of InDesign, Illustrator, 
and the like, not to mention that of the operating system that it runs under!

-- 
Alan Braslau
CEA DSM-IRAMIS-SPEC
CNRS URA 2464
Orme des Merisiers
91191 Gif-sur-Yvette cedex FRANCE
tel: +33 1 69 08 73 15
fax: +33 1 69 08 87 86
mailto:alan.braslau@cea.fr

http://www-dna2006.cea.fr/

 .''`.
: :'  :
`. `'`
  `-
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

Am 2008-05-30 um 14:31 schrieb Idris Samawi Hamid:
>> There is no denying that many advanced features in InDesign are
>> missing in TeX(like) related software. What's more, the
>> internationalization of InDesign is better.
>
> Can you give a precise list of the features contained in InDesign  
> that are
> missing in (lua)TeX or which TeX does not support well?


- much faster (i.e. I don't need to wait for several TeX runs e.g. if  
I need to check if some tweak fixed my page breaking)
- optical (vs. metrical) kerning
- a GUI ;-) and thus layout by "let's try how it looks"
- layout definition (I struggle with ConTeXt's \setuplayout every time)
- better page breaking constraints (you can define in your style  
sheets "keep n lines together" and "keep this together with the next  
paragraph)
- PDF/X output
- color profile conversions
- image processing features like crop paths, feathered edges, drop  
shadow (in ConTeXt I need to prepare such in Photoshop in the right  
size - but I guess it would be possible to write a module that uses  
ImageMagick to achieve something similar)

Problems in TeX *and* InDesign:
- Unicode handling (composed and decomposed UTF-8 with or without BOM,  
UTF-16, different line endings)

Working with InDesign as a developer I know that TeX's documentation  
is far better. Adobe's developer docs (e.g. on API, XML format,  
InDesign tagged text) are incomplete and errorneous.

I don't think you can call the one or other "better" or "more  
advanced", it's just a different approach, and I choose the right tool  
for every project. (I.e. I only use TeX if I need the same content in  
different versions, if I can automate something or for books.) But the  
layout applications like InDesign (there's still also ugly old  
QuarkXPress, coming-of-age Scribus and some others) have learned a lot  
of the former domains of TeX, like registers and toc generation.

There are still some areas where you need a programmable system, even  
trivia like chapter dependant running titles (in ConTeXt: headertexts).


Greetlings from Lake Constance!
Hraban
---
http://www.fiee.net/texnique/
http://wiki.contextgarden.net
https://www.cacert.org (I'm an assurer)

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[luigi scarso]

> There are still some areas where you need a programmable system, even
> trivia like chapter dependant running titles (in ConTeXt: headertexts).
Isn't indesign programmable too ?
I know people who use it in an automatic workflow for db publishing
-- 
luigi
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

Am 2008-05-31 um 04:20 schrieb luigi scarso:

>> There are still some areas where you need a programmable system, even
>> trivia like chapter dependant running titles (in ConTeXt:  
>> headertexts).
> Isn't indesign programmable too ?
> I know people who use it in an automatic workflow for db publishing

You can use JavaScript or COM (on Windows) or AppleScript (also Python/ 
Ruby appscript) on OSX. Been there, done that.
And I use XML for partly automatic typesetting (mostly for event  
calendars of magazines) - but InDesign's XML processing is very slow  
and very picky about the encoding (at least CS2 on OSX). Even more  
picky with "InDesign tagged text" files.

But what I meant was: let the running title depend on the chapter  
title or the like - that's easy with TeX, but I know no automatable  
way in InDesign.

Last night I remembered two more things that TeX can't do, but every  
layout app can:
- text flow around other elements (images)
- really working multiple-column layout


Greetlings from Lake Constance!
Hraban
---
http://www.fiee.net/texnique/
http://wiki.contextgarden.net
https://www.cacert.org (I'm an assurer)

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[luigi scarso]

> Last night I remembered two more things that TeX can't do, but every
> layout app can:
> - text flow around other elements (images)
\parshape ?

> - really working multiple-column layout
in context columnset with  two pass strategy

-- 
luigi
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Yue Wang]

On 5/31/08, luigi scarso <luigi.scarso@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Last night I remembered two more things that TeX can't do, but every
> > layout app can:
> > - text flow around other elements (images)
> \parshape ?
>

I forword an email to the professor.
it discuss some of the points together with some examples.

\parshape is not enough for arbitary page layout.

> > - really working multiple-column layout
> in context columnset with  two pass strategy
>

columnset cannot solve most of the problems:)

if you want advanced page layout justification, TeX is not sufficient.


> --
> luigi
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>
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[luigi scarso]

> - much faster (i.e. I don't need to wait for several TeX runs e.g. if
> I need to check if some tweak fixed my page breaking)
On average
true for manual composition, maybe false for automatic workflow

> - optical (vs. metrical) kerning
hz ?
> - a GUI ;-) and thus layout by "let's try how it looks"
true
> - layout definition (I struggle with ConTeXt's \setuplayout every time)
maybe

> - better page breaking constraints (you can define in your style
> sheets "keep n lines together" and "keep this together with the next
> paragraph)
maybe (hans/taco help needed here )

> - PDF/X output
> - color profile conversions
maybe.
They can be after, in prepress ,
so can be sensate to keep separate
this from tex.

> - image processing features like crop paths, feathered edges, drop
> shadow (in ConTeXt I need to prepare such in Photoshop in the right
> size - but I guess it would be possible to write a module that uses
> ImageMagick to achieve something similar)
maybe

-- 
luigi
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[luigi scarso]

On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 2:57 PM, Yue Wang <yuleopen@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 5/31/08, luigi scarso <luigi.scarso@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Last night I remembered two more things that TeX can't do, but every
>> > layout app can:
>> > - text flow around other elements (images)
>> \parshape ?
>>
>
> I forword an email to the professor.
> it discuss some of the points together with some examples.
>
> \parshape is not enough for arbitary page layout.
\parshape can help for text flow around other elements, hence for
layout of a page.
What do you mean with
"\parshape is not enough for arbitary page layout" ?
There are other macros/ tools  for page layout
as otr for example.

>
>> > - really working multiple-column layout
>> in context columnset with  two pass strategy
>>
>
> columnset cannot solve most of the problems:)
Do you have some examples ?

>
> if you want advanced page layout justification, TeX is not sufficient.
>
What do you mean with advanced ?
Do you have som examples ?



-- 
luigi
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archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Hans Hagen]

luigi scarso wrote:

>> - optical (vs. metrical) kerning
> hz ?

all those kerning options can lead to rather bad text ... i get the 
impression that wrongly applied hz (extreme values) and intercharacter 
spacing and such in general lead to bad text ... i read quite some books 
and am sometimes puzzled by the completely different and inconstent 
'look and feel' of typeset paragraphs (that could be done better by tex) 
... too many degrees of freedom may not be a good idea

>> - a GUI ;-) and thus layout by "let's try how it looks"
> true

just develop styles using small samples, not whole books -)

>> - better page breaking constraints (you can define in your style
>> sheets "keep n lines together" and "keep this together with the next
>> paragraph)
> maybe (hans/taco help needed here )

i have an experimental mechanism for weighted skips and penalties for 
mkiv; keep in mind that traditional tex only looks forward (unless you 
do trickery which in itself has side effects)

>> - PDF/X output

pdftex is mostl pdf/x (depends on what trickery the macro package does)

>> - color profile conversions

tex treats graphics as abstractions which is why it could survive so long

keep in mind that normally one only needs to 'convert' a graphic once, 
so that can be done externally; in dtp one often works with copies (we 
see projects with the same 25 meg graphic copied all over the placs) and 
i assume that in say indesign graphics are also converted once (too much 
a slow downer otherwise)

in context one can do some trickery with turning gray scale images to 
multitone but that a well kept secret -)

Hans

-----------------------------------------------------------------
                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
      tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl
-----------------------------------------------------------------
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[luigi scarso]

> - a GUI ;-) and thus layout by "let's try how it looks"
Almost true.
Here it seems that there is a way to embed latex in scribus
http://wiki.scribus.net/index.php/Working_with_latex_frames

Also
http://lists.scribus.info/pipermail/scribus/2007-January/024109.html

-- 
luigi
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

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___________________________________________________________________________________

the error of xetex

[Yanli Li]

TeXExec | processing document 'hello'
TeXExec | no ctx file found
TeXExec | tex processing method: context
TeXExec | TeX run 1
TeXExec | writing option file hello.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 598
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./hello.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : hello.top loaded
(./hello.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
)
systems         : begin file hello at line 1
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file hello at line 3
 )
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Output written on hello.pdf (1 page).
Transcript written on hello.log.
TeXUtil | parsing file hello.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 21
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | TeX run 2
TeXExec | writing option file hello.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 598
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./hello.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : hello.top loaded
(./hello.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
(./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
(./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
systems         : begin file hello at line 1
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file hello at line 3
 )
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Output written on hello.pdf (1 page).
Transcript written on hello.log.
TeXUtil | parsing file hello.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 21
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | runtime: 1.852353


my hello.tex file:

\starttext
  Hello World!
\stoptext

___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Wolfgang Schuster]

Hi,

What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.

Greetings
Wolfgang

On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 2:02 AM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
> TeXExec | processing document 'hello'
> TeXExec | no ctx file found
> TeXExec | tex processing method: context
> TeXExec | TeX run 1
> TeXExec | writing option file hello.top
> TeXExec | using randomseed 598
> TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
> TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
> This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
>  \write18 enabled.
> entering extended mode
> (./hello.tex
>
> ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english
>
> language        : language en is active
> system          : cont-new loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
> systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
> system          : cont-old loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
> loading         : Context Old Macros
> )
> system          : cont-fil loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
> loading         : Context File Synonyms
> )
> system          : cont-sys loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
> bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
> language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3
> de->ec:ec->3->2:
> 3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3
> pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
> c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3
> en->ec:ec-
>  >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3
> da->ec:ec->1
> 7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3
> deo->ec:ec->21-
>  >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3
> ro->ec:ec->28->2:
> 3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
> specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
> system          : hello.top loaded
> (./hello.top
> specials        : loading definition file dpx
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
> specials        : loading definition file fdf
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
> specials        : fdf loaded
> )
> specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
> specials        : loading definition file xet
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
> specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
> )
> systems         : begin file hello at line 1
> fonts           : resetting map file list
> fonts           : using map file: original-base
> fonts           : using map file: lm-math
> fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
> fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
> fonts           : using map file: ec-base
> fonts           : using map file: qx-base
> fonts           : using map file: t5-base
> fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
> fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
> fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
> fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
> loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
> systems         : end file hello at line 3
>  )
> (see the transcript file for additional information)
> Output written on hello.pdf (1 page).
> Transcript written on hello.log.
> TeXUtil | parsing file hello.tui
> TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
> TeXUtil | expansions: 308
> TeXUtil | reductions: 0
> TeXUtil | divisions : 0
> TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
> TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
> TeXUtil | commands: 21
> TeXUtil | programs: 0
> TeXUtil | tuo file saved
> TeXExec | TeX run 2
> TeXExec | writing option file hello.top
> TeXExec | using randomseed 598
> TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
> TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
> This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
>  \write18 enabled.
> entering extended mode
> (./hello.tex
>
> ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english
>
> language        : language en is active
> system          : cont-new loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
> systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
> system          : cont-old loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
> loading         : Context Old Macros
> )
> system          : cont-fil loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
> loading         : Context File Synonyms
> )
> system          : cont-sys loaded
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
> bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
> language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3
> de->ec:ec->3->2:
> 3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3
> pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
> c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3
> en->ec:ec-
>  >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3
> da->ec:ec->1
> 7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3
> deo->ec:ec->21-
>  >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3
> ro->ec:ec->28->2:
> 3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
> specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
> system          : hello.top loaded
> (./hello.top
> specials        : loading definition file dpx
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
> specials        : loading definition file fdf
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
> specials        : fdf loaded
> )
> specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
> specials        : loading definition file xet
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
> specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
> ) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
> (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
> (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
> systems         : begin file hello at line 1
> fonts           : resetting map file list
> fonts           : using map file: original-base
> fonts           : using map file: lm-math
> fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
> fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
> fonts           : using map file: ec-base
> fonts           : using map file: qx-base
> fonts           : using map file: t5-base
> fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
> fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
> fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
> fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
> loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
> (/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
> systems         : end file hello at line 3
>  )
> (see the transcript file for additional information)
> Output written on hello.pdf (1 page).
> Transcript written on hello.log.
> TeXUtil | parsing file hello.tui
> TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
> TeXUtil | expansions: 308
> TeXUtil | reductions: 0
> TeXUtil | divisions : 0
> TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
> TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
> TeXUtil | commands: 21
> TeXUtil | programs: 0
> TeXUtil | tuo file saved
> TeXExec | runtime: 1.852353
>
>
> my hello.tex file:
>
> \starttext
>  Hello World!
> \stoptext
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Yanli Li]

Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
> Hi,
>
> What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.
>
> Greetings
> Wolfgang
>
>   
>
>   
I got some warnnings when compiling it today, but i still got a pdf 
output. Moreover, i cannot get a pdf output when i add some PPCHTEX 
statements to it.
I intend to how to remove the warnnings?

when i enter the order : *texexec --xtx hello,
*bash shell display:*
*TeXExec | processing document 'hello'
TeXExec | no ctx file found
TeXExec | tex processing method: context
TeXExec | TeX run 1
TeXExec | writing option file hello.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 1015
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./hello.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : hello.top loaded
(./hello.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
)
systems         : begin file hello at line 1
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file hello at line 3
 )
stdin -> hello.pdf
[1
*** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5   
LMMathSymbols5-Bold       "enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont"  <lm-mathsy.enc  
<lmbsy5.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map", 
line=7.
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular 
"enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.
]*
3141 bytes written
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Output written on hello.pdf (1 page).
Transcript written on hello.log.
TeXUtil | parsing file hello.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 21
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | TeX run 2
TeXExec | writing option file hello.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 1015
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./hello.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : hello.top loaded
(./hello.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
(./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
(./hello.tuo) (./hello.tuo)
systems         : begin file hello at line 1
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file hello at line 3
 )
stdin -> hello.pdf
[1
*** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5   
LMMathSymbols5-Bold       "enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont"  <lm-mathsy.enc  
<lmbsy5.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map", 
line=7.
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular 
"enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.
]*
3141 bytes written
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Output written on hello.pdf (1 page).
Transcript written on hello.log.
TeXUtil | parsing file hello.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 21
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | runtime: 1.978178

my hello.tex file:

\starttext
 Hello World!
\stoptext



___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Wolfgang Schuster]

On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.
>>
> I got some warnnings when compiling it today, but i still got a pdf
> output. Moreover, i cannot get a pdf output when i add some PPCHTEX
> statements to it.
> I intend to how to remove the warnnings?

Try the advice from Mojca in the other thread
"several warnings after updating ConTeXt and LM fonts" today and make
a example with the PPCTEX problem.

Wolfgang
___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Yanli Li]

Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
>   
>> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>     
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.
>>>
>>>       
>> I got some warnnings when compiling it today, but i still got a pdf
>> output. Moreover, i cannot get a pdf output when i add some PPCHTEX
>> statements to it.
>> I intend to how to remove the warnnings?
>>     
>
> Try the advice from Mojca in the other thread
> "several warnings after updating ConTeXt and LM fonts" today and make
> a example with the PPCTEX problem.
>
> Wolfgang
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
>   
The problem still exists when i follow Mojca's advice to adjust the context.
*stdin -> hello.pdf
[1
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5 LMMathSymbols5-Bold 
"enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont" <lm-mathsy.enc <lmbsy5.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map", 
line=7.
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular 
"enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.

*the information of the context version:
TeXExec | current distribution: web2c
TeXExec | context source date: unknown
TeXExec | format path: /opt/context/tex/texmf-linux-64/web2c 
/opt/context/tex/texmf-linux-64/web2c
TeXExec | start of analysis
TeXExec | end of analysis
TeXExec |
TeXExec | TeXExec | version 6.2.0 - 1997-2006 - PRAGMA ADE/POD
TeXExec | TeXUtil | version 9.1.0 - 1997-2005 - PRAGMA ADE/POD
TeXExec | CtxTools | version 1.3.5 - 2004/2008 - PRAGMA ADE

my context minimals contain:
XeTeX 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
pdfTeX 3.141592-1.40.7-2.2 (Web2C 7.5.6)
LuaTeX, Version snapshot-0.25.3-2008041812
i think my context minimals version is 2008.5.31

why does it produce the warnings? And how to remove the problem?

Thanks!



___________________________________________________________________________________
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!

maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Yanli Li]

Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
>   
>> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>     
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.
>>>
>>>       
>> I got some warnnings when compiling it today, but i still got a pdf
>> output. Moreover, i cannot get a pdf output when i add some PPCHTEX
>> statements to it.
>> I intend to how to remove the warnnings?
>>     
>
> Try the advice from Mojca in the other thread
> "several warnings after updating ConTeXt and LM fonts" today and make
> a example with the PPCTEX problem.
>
> Wolfgang
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>
>   
An example with the PPCTEX problem when i execute: *texexec --xtx 
chemial. *However, when i execute :texexec --pdf chemial i can get a pdf 
output. Why?
TeXExec | processing document 'chemical'
TeXExec | no ctx file found
TeXExec | tex processing method: context
TeXExec | TeX run 1
TeXExec | writing option file chemical.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 978
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./chemical.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : chemical.top loaded
(./chemical.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
)
systems         : begin file chemical at line 1
chapter         : 1 Chemical
system          : module pictex loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/m-pictex.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/thrd-pic.tex))
system          : module chemic loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/m-chemic.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/ppchtex.tex
ppchtex         : using PiCTeX and MetaPost
)) [MP chemical-mpgraph.4000] [MP chemical-mpgraph.3999]
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file chemical at line 12
[flush and process chemical-mpgraph.mp afterwards] )
*stdin -> chemical.pdf
[1
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5   
LMMathSymbols5-Bold       "enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont"  <lm-mathsy.enc  
<lmbsy5.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map", 
line=7.
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular 
"enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.
** WARNING ** Could not locate a virtual/physical font for TFM "rm-lmr9".
** WARNING ** >> There are no valid font mapping entry for this font.
** WARNING ** >> Font file name "rm-lmr9" was assumed but failed to 
locate that font.
** ERROR ** Cannot proceed without .vf or "physical" font for PDF output...*

Output file removed.
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Error 256 (driver return code) generating output;
file chemical.pdf may not be valid.
Transcript written on chemical.log.
TeXExec | processing graphic 'chemical-mpgraph.mp'
This is MetaPost, Version 1.004 (Web2C 7.5.5)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/web2c/natural.tcx)
(chemical-mpgraph.mp [4000] [3999]
metafun 2008-6-3 16:05
 )
2 output files written: chemical-mpgraph.3999 .. chemical-mpgraph.4000
Transcript written on chemical-mpgraph.log.
TeXExec | runtime: 0.021704
TeXUtil | parsing file chemical.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 22
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | TeX run 2
TeXExec | writing option file chemical.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 978
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./chemical.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : chemical.top loaded
(./chemical.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo)
(./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo)
(./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo)
systems         : begin file chemical at line 1
chapter         : 1 Chemical
system          : module pictex loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/m-pictex.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/thrd-pic.tex))
system          : module chemic loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/m-chemic.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/ppchtex.tex
ppchtex         : using PiCTeX and MetaPost
)) [MP to PDF] (./chemical-mpgraph.4000 (./chemical.tuo)) [MP to PDF]
(./chemical-mpgraph.3999)
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file chemical at line 12
[flush and process chemical-mpgraph.mp afterwards] )
stdin -> chemical.pdf
[1
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5   
LMMathSymbols5-Bold       "enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont"  <lm-mathsy.enc  
<lmbsy5.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map", 
line=7.
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular 
"enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.
** WARNING ** Could not locate a virtual/physical font for TFM "rm-lmr9".
** WARNING ** >> There are no valid font mapping entry for this font.
** WARNING ** >> Font file name "rm-lmr9" was assumed but failed to 
locate that font.
** ERROR ** Cannot proceed without .vf or "physical" font for PDF output...

*Output file removed.*
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Error 256 (driver return code) generating output;
file chemical.pdf may not be valid.
Transcript written on chemical.log.
TeXExec | processing graphic 'chemical-mpgraph.mp'
This is MetaPost, Version 1.004 (Web2C 7.5.5)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/web2c/natural.tcx)
(chemical-mpgraph.mp [4000] [3999]
metafun 2008-6-3 16:05
 )
2 output files written: chemical-mpgraph.3999 .. chemical-mpgraph.4000
Transcript written on chemical-mpgraph.log.
TeXExec | runtime: 0.182156
TeXUtil | parsing file chemical.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 22
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | TeX run 3
TeXExec | writing option file chemical.top
TeXExec | using randomseed 978
TeXExec | tex engine: xetex
TeXExec | tex format: cont-en
This is XeTeX, Version 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
 \write18 enabled.
entering extended mode
(./chemical.tex

ConTeXt  ver: 2008.05.31 12:20 MKII  fmt: 2008.6.3  int: english/english

language        : language en is active
system          : cont-new loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.tex
systems         : beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkii)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-mtx.tex))
system          : cont-old loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-old.tex
loading         : Context Old Macros
)
system          : cont-fil loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/cont-fil.tex
loading         : Context File Synonyms
)
system          : cont-sys loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/user/cont-sys.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-tmf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-siz.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-otf.tex)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/type-xtx.tex))
bodyfont        : 12pt rm is loaded
language        : patterns nl->ec:ec->1->2:3 fr->ec:ec->2->2:3 
de->ec:ec->3->2:
3 it->ec:ec->4->2:3 pt->ec:ec->5->2:3 hr->ec:ec->6->2:3 
pl->ec:ec->7->2:3 cz->e
c:ec->8->2:3 sk->ec:ec->9->2:3 sl->ec:ec->10->2:3 ru->ec:ec->12->2:3 
en->ec:ec-
 >13->2:3 uk->ec:ec->14->2:3 us->ec:ec->15->2:3 agr->ec:ec->16->2:3 
da->ec:ec->1
7->2:3 sv->ec:ec->18->2:3 af->ec:ec->19->2:3 no->ec:ec->20->2:3 
deo->ec:ec->21-
 >2:3 es->ec:ec->25->2:3 ca->ec:ec->26->2:3 la->ec:ec->27->2:3 
ro->ec:ec->28->2:
3 tr->ec:ec->29->2:3 fi->ec:ec->31->2:3 hu->ec:ec->32->2:3 loaded
specials        : tex,postscript,rokicki loaded
system          : chemical.top loaded
(./chemical.top
specials        : loading definition file dpx
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-dpx.tex
specials        : loading definition file fdf
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-fdf.mkii))
specials        : fdf loaded
)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
specials        : loading definition file xet
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/spec-xet.tex)
specials        : fdf,dpx loaded
) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo)
(./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo)
(./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo) (./chemical.tuo)
systems         : begin file chemical at line 1
chapter         : 1 Chemical
system          : module pictex loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/m-pictex.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/thrd-pic.tex))
system          : module chemic loaded
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/m-chemic.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/ppchtex.tex
ppchtex         : using PiCTeX and MetaPost
)) [MP to PDF] (./chemical-mpgraph.4000 (./chemical.tuo)) [MP to PDF]
(./chemical-mpgraph.3999)
fonts           : resetting map file list
fonts           : using map file: original-base
fonts           : using map file: lm-math
fonts           : using map file: lm-rm
fonts           : using map file: texnansi-base
fonts           : using map file: ec-base
fonts           : using map file: qx-base
fonts           : using map file: t5-base
fonts           : using map file: 8r-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-base
fonts           : using map file: original-ams-euler
fonts           : using map file: original-public-lm
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.tex
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-def.mkii))
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.tex
loading         : Context Sorting Macros (languages)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/tex/context/base/sort-lan.mkii)) [1.1]
systems         : end file chemical at line 12
[flush and process chemical-mpgraph.mp afterwards] )
stdin -> chemical.pdf
[1
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5   
LMMathSymbols5-Bold       "enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont"  <lm-mathsy.enc  
<lmbsy5.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map", 
line=7.
** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular 
"enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.
** WARNING ** Could not locate a virtual/physical font for TFM "rm-lmr9".
** WARNING ** >> There are no valid font mapping entry for this font.
** WARNING ** >> Font file name "rm-lmr9" was assumed but failed to 
locate that font.
** ERROR ** Cannot proceed without .vf or "physical" font for PDF output...

Output file removed.
(see the transcript file for additional information)
Error 256 (driver return code) generating output;
file chemical.pdf may not be valid.
Transcript written on chemical.log.
TeXExec | processing graphic 'chemical-mpgraph.mp'
This is MetaPost, Version 1.004 (Web2C 7.5.5)
(/opt/context/tex/texmf-local/web2c/natural.tcx)
(chemical-mpgraph.mp [4000] [3999]
metafun 2008-6-3 16:05
 )
2 output files written: chemical-mpgraph.3999 .. chemical-mpgraph.4000
Transcript written on chemical-mpgraph.log.
TeXExec | runtime: 0.14778
TeXUtil | parsing file chemical.tui
TeXUtil | shortcuts : 169
TeXUtil | expansions: 308
TeXUtil | reductions: 0
TeXUtil | divisions : 0
TeXUtil | loaded files: 1
TeXUtil | temporary files: 0
TeXUtil | commands: 22
TeXUtil | programs: 0
TeXUtil | tuo file saved
TeXExec | runtime: 3.689073


the chemical.tex file:
\starttext
\chapter{Chemical}

\usemodules[pictex,chemic]
\startchemical\chemical[SIX,B,B]\stopchemical

\startcolor[blue] \startchemical
\color[red]{\chemical[SIX,B,R14,RD25,RB36,RZ36][OH,COOH] }
\stopchemical \stopcolor

\stoptext



___________________________________________________________________________________
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Wolfgang Schuster]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3396 bytes --]

Hi,

Put the attached two map files in your TeX directory, the path for them is
"$TEXMF/fonts/map/dvipdfm/lm", I think there are no map files in this
directory and XeTeX loads the map files for dvips instead.

Wolfgang

On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I got some warnnings when compiling it today, but i still got a pdf
>>> output. Moreover, i cannot get a pdf output when i add some PPCHTEX
>>> statements to it.
>>> I intend to how to remove the warnnings?
>>>
>>
>> Try the advice from Mojca in the other thread
>> "several warnings after updating ConTeXt and LM fonts" today and make
>> a example with the PPCTEX problem.
>>
>> Wolfgang
>> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>>
>> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
>> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
>> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
>> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
>> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>>
>>
> The problem still exists when i follow Mojca's advice to adjust the context.
> *stdin -> hello.pdf
> [1
> ** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
> ** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: lmbsy5 LMMathSymbols5-Bold
> "enclmmathsy ReEncodeFont" <lm-mathsy.enc <lmbsy5.pfb
> ** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-math.map",
> line=7.
> ** WARNING ** This .map file looks like a dvips format fontmap file.
> ** WARNING ** -- Current input buffer is: rm-lmb10 LMRomanDemi10-Regular
> "enclmrm ReEncodeFont" <lm-rm.enc <lmb10.pfb
> ** WARNING ** -- Reading fontmap file stopped at: file="lm-rm.map", line=7.
>
> *the information of the context version:
> TeXExec | current distribution: web2c
> TeXExec | context source date: unknown
> TeXExec | format path: /opt/context/tex/texmf-linux-64/web2c
> /opt/context/tex/texmf-linux-64/web2c
> TeXExec | start of analysis
> TeXExec | end of analysis
> TeXExec |
> TeXExec | TeXExec | version 6.2.0 - 1997-2006 - PRAGMA ADE/POD
> TeXExec | TeXUtil | version 9.1.0 - 1997-2005 - PRAGMA ADE/POD
> TeXExec | CtxTools | version 1.3.5 - 2004/2008 - PRAGMA ADE
>
> my context minimals contain:
> XeTeX 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
> pdfTeX 3.141592-1.40.7-2.2 (Web2C 7.5.6)
> LuaTeX, Version snapshot-0.25.3-2008041812
> i think my context minimals version is 2008.5.31
>
> why does it produce the warnings? And how to remove the problem?
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>

[-- Attachment #2: lm-dvipdfm.zip --]
[-- Type: application/zip, Size: 1198 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #3: Type: text/plain, Size: 487 bytes --]

___________________________________________________________________________________
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wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Mojca Miklavec]

On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Yanli Li wrote:
>
> my context minimals contain:
> XeTeX 3.1415926-2.2-0.998.1 (Web2C 7.5.6)
> pdfTeX 3.141592-1.40.7-2.2 (Web2C 7.5.6)
> LuaTeX, Version snapshot-0.25.3-2008041812
> i think my context minimals version is 2008.5.31
>
> why does it produce the warnings? And how to remove the problem?

Because nobody* submitted the 64-bit linux binaries to the repository
yet. Neither for FreeBSD and Sun, but there have been less requests
for the latter. linux, mac & windows should be OK.

If you want, you can compile them yourself, but sooner or later they
need to fly to the repository anyway.

Mojca

* to be read as: Taco or Peter
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Yanli Li]

Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Put the attached two map files in your TeX directory, the path for them is
> "$TEXMF/fonts/map/dvipdfm/lm", I think there are no map files in this
> directory and XeTeX loads the map files for dvips instead.
>
> Wolfgang
>
> On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 1:58 PM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
>   
>> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>     
>>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 9:58 AM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>       
>>>> Wolfgang Schuster wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> What problem do you have with XeTeX, I can see nothing in your log file.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>           
>>>> I got some warnnings when compiling it today, but i still got a pdf
>>>> output. Moreover, i cannot get a pdf output when i add some PPCHTEX
>>>> statements to it.
>>>> I intend to how to remove the warnnings?
>>>>
>>>>         
>>> Try the advice from Mojca in the other thread
>>> "several warnings after updating ConTeXt and LM fonts" today and make
>>> a example with the PPCTEX problem.
>>>
>>> Wolfgang
>>> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>>> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki!
>>>
>>> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
>>> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
>>> archive  : https://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
>>> wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
>>> ___________________________________________________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>>       
Thank you very much! I solve the problem with your advice.
___________________________________________________________________________________
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wiki     : http://contextgarden.net
___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Wolfgang Schuster]

On Tue, Jun 3, 2008 at 2:16 PM, Yanli Li <penguinmath@gmail.com> wrote:

[log file]

> the chemical.tex file:
> \starttext
> \chapter{Chemical}
>
> \usemodules[pictex,chemic]

What is the result if you try it without PiCTeX.

\usemodule[chemic]

> \startchemical\chemical[SIX,B,B]\stopchemical
>
> \startcolor[blue] \startchemical
> \color[red]{\chemical[SIX,B,R14,RD25,RB36,RZ36][OH,COOH] }
> \stopchemical \stopcolor
>
> \stoptext

Or try it after you have placed the map files from my other mail
in the directory with your current example.

Wolfgang
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: the error of xetex

[Peter Münster]

On Tue, Jun 03 2008, Mojca Miklavec wrote:

> Because nobody* submitted the 64-bit linux binaries to the repository
> yet. Neither for FreeBSD and Sun, but there have been less requests
> for the latter. linux, mac & windows should be OK.

Done for linux-64 (xetex-0.999.0).
Cheers, Peter

-- 
http://pmrb.free.fr/contact/

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Maurí­cio]

Sorry to insist, but I would be really interested in approaches
that are not just great things we could add to TeX.

For instance: would it be possible to have some kind of “layout
engine” to which text processing would be just one among other
plug-ins? I wonder what kind of information that engine should
share with plug-ins. Do you think such system is possible? Or
something else?

Maurício


Maurício a écrit :
 > Hi,
 >
 > Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
 > be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
 > all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
 > seems dead.
 >
 > (...)

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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Idris Samawi Hamid]

Hi Maurício,

On Wed, 11 Jun 2008 18:12:21 -0600, Maurí­cio <briqueabraque@yahoo.com>  
wrote:

> Sorry to insist, but I would be really interested in approaches
> that are not just great things we could add to TeX.
>
> For instance: would it be possible to have some kind of “layout
> engine” to which text processing would be just one among other
> plug-ins? I wonder what kind of information that engine should
> share with plug-ins. Do you think such system is possible? Or
> something else?

I would love to hear more of your thoughts on this. Don't hold back!

Best wishes
Idris

-- 
Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief
International Journal of Shi`i Studies
Department of Philosophy
Colorado State University
Fort Collins, CO 80523
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___________________________________________________________________________________

Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Charles P. Schaum]

Do you mean like Scrivener on the Mac?

What, in any case, constitutes a universal layout approach? Does one
exist?

For example, I can do things with plain TeX that mighty InDesign must
balk at. Yet some see TeX as yesteryear's solution because of subsequent
tech advances.

I hardly believe that DEK would be dogmatic about TeX being the only
thing out there. Yet he, and thousands of others in the scientific
communities where TeX flourishes, sees the value of maintaining a
knowledge base that is predictable when it runs on a program that can
pass the trip test.

Lose that for the sake of innovation, and you can lose real knowledge.
And what shall we say for troff, which still possesses an arcane sort of
longevity?

Imagine this: if you can use TeX running on some older PC and you have
some remotely managed BSD setup with packet radio and EME bouncing or
whatever, you can be creating documents for all the world to see even if
you are out in the bush with a generator and mosquito netting.

So TeX's stability has the interesting potential side effect of giving a
voice to the voiceless. Our cast-off hardware becomes a window for
freedom of speech and expression, as well as the free-beer philanthropy
element of getting it into people's hands.

If there is to be a universality to layout, part of that should also
extend not just across current technologies but also have plugins that
can support older technologies. That way we do not generate
technological segregation. There are places where people still go
outside to relieve themselves, and there are the Japanese washlets at
the other extreme. But the human component remains, nonetheless.

At minimum, what one needs is a cross-disciplinary approach. My work
usually involves issues of finance and development, scheduling, good old
editing, elements of design, and knowledge of the subject matter. All
these factors directly or indirectly affect layout.

Here's where I see the Mac as helpful. On the one hand, you have Aqua,
while there's also X and good old terminal. Some folks think abstractly
and can whack out macros like Paul Bunyan chops wood. Some think
visually and need visual or modular dev tools. Some people are good at
modeling situations that are dynamic and interactive, while others have
the knack for getting to tried and true base issues that remain when all
the noise and lights are gone.

If you read Ian Barbour or Jacques Ellul, you see that identity and
techne are linked and that the sciences do things differently than the
humanities at a deeper level than just style manuals and the inverse
relation of "obfuscated jargon" to "psycho-sociological rhetoric."

I just don't see a unified typesetting engine in the works until
something can easily embrace different national traditions for
typesetting, type styles, design preferences, etc. In Germany, man
nehmet Dr. Oetker, while in America it's doctor schmocktor, I just wanna
feel good amidst an orgiastic consumer society. Think that doesn't get
reflected in design choices? 'Cause it does.

DEK may be a formidable computer scientist. Yet, as one of his cousins
that is a friend of mine and another friend that was two years behind
him in high school said, Knuth always loved things like words and music.
His literary acumen reflects his tutelage in a school strongly
influenced by the classical Gymnasium. He is a man of culture and taste,
and he brought all his respect and research regarding longstanding,
tried and true typographical traditions to his writing of TeX.

Could there be new stuff? Sure. But an exploration of type, typography,
layout, and design also points us to some of our basic thoughts on
preferences, identity, habituation, etc.

Charles

On Wed, 2008-06-11 at 21:12 -0300, Maurí­cio wrote:
> Sorry to insist, but I would be really interested in approaches
> that are not just great things we could add to TeX.
> 
> For instance: would it be possible to have some kind of “layout
> engine” to which text processing would be just one among other
> plug-ins? I wonder what kind of information that engine should
> share with plug-ins. Do you think such system is possible? Or
> something else?
> 
> Maurício
> 
> 
> Maurício a écrit :
>  > Hi,
>  >
>  > Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
>  > be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
>  > all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
>  > seems dead.
>  >
>  > (...)
> 
> ___________________________________________________________________________________
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> 
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Re: How could a typesetting system be today? (slightly off-topic, flame and nostalgic)

[Maurí­cio]

 > Do you mean like Scrivener on the Mac?

I don’t know. I tried Context, then TeX, than went back to
Context. Now also Metapost. Sorry for beeing biased, but I really
like the programer approach to computers.

 > What, in any case, constitutes a universal layout approach? Does
 > one exist? (...)

I don’t think we need something universal. But there is a lot of
common guidelines for most things. For instance, text, music,
chess boards and pictures all have to fit or fill their place in a
page, and all can have a common main font to be used.

 > Yet he (...) sees the value of maintaining a knowledge base that
 > is predictable when it runs on a program that can pass the trip
 > test.

Actually, I’m trying to show my dad he can trust a computer to
typeset his class notes, if we use the right tools (i.e., Context
plus Metapost instead of what was used for his books in the 90’s,
when just a small change would ruin everything). But I’ve just
used ‘ϕ’ in a math formula for one of his papers and Context
silently ignores it. I’m sure there's a good reason for that. But
TeX is predictable when you write a default TeX style document. If
you leave it, you have to understand a lot of hidden issues, and a
dummy user like me will never know if all of them have been taken
care of.

 > Lose that for the sake of innovation, and you can lose real
 > knowledge.  And what shall we say for troff, which still
 > possesses an arcane sort of longevity?

Troff? I really miss the days of my old TK3000 text editor back in
the 80’s. It's great to use 80% of your time thinking about what
you want to write and 20% about typesetting. Today it's 4%
writing, 2% typesetting and 94% looking over thousands of pages of
wiki documentation. I still think Context is really great, but
I’ll never try to do something that’s not done in a default
installation again. Or try to understand why sometimes [n=x] works
but [n = x] doesn’t.


 > (...) you can be creating documents for all the world to see
 > even if you are out in the bush with a generator and mosquito
 > netting.

I wrote my résume a few months ago, and sent it to a few
companies, just to know a lot of time later that most of them
could not open it, since it was a PDF revision 1.8 instead of 1.3
(or something like that).

 > So TeX's stability has the interesting potential side effect of
 > giving a voice to the voiceless. Our cast-off hardware becomes a
 > window for freedom of speech and expression, (...)

Sure. I would like to have something simpler than TeX, not more
complex or hardware eater.

 > There are places where people still go outside to relieve
 > themselves, (...)

Like myself :)

 > Some folks think abstractly and can whack out macros like Paul
 > Bunyan chops wood. Some think visually (...)

I can only think abstractly. But TeX macros are a lot less
abstract than they could be. I believe DEK says they were never
supposed to be used the way they are.

 > DEK (...) brought all his respect and research regarding
 > longstanding, tried and true typographical traditions to his
 > writing of TeX.

Sure. You can’t miss that even if you understand nothing about
typesetting (like myself). After using TeX for a while, it’s
almost painfull to look at text printed by usual office tools.

 >> Maurício a écrit :
 >>  > Hi,
 >>  >
 >>  > Just because I'm curious: how could a typesetting system like TeX
 >>  > be if it was created today? I've tried google and wikipedia, and
 >>  > all I found different from TeX is a system called 'Lout', but it
 >>  > seems dead.
 >>  >
 >>  > (...)

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today? (slightly off-topic, flame and nostalgic)

[Hans Hagen]

Maurí­cio wrote:

> used ‘ϕ’ in a math formula for one of his papers and Context

it showing up depends on what you use (mkii or mkiv), if the character 
is defined, if the font has it (in text mode) etc etc

> could not open it, since it was a PDF revision 1.8 instead of 1.3

indeed a future version -)

Hans

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Maurí­cio]

Thanks, Idris, for your interest. I don’t understand enough
about typesetting and computer math to make an informed sugestion,
but I’ll try my best.

What about a Metapost-like main engine to define the general
layout of pages? That engine would know about borders, floating
spaces for pictures or text, and handle “global” information
like main fonts or page numbers etc.; and even draw on the page.
Plug-ins would render specific information. The main engine
could also do Metapost-like operations on what comes from that
rendering.

That engine would call plug-ins to render anything, using a
standard human-writable tag language. The engine will provide
plug-ins a shape they should fill, as well as tips on how to fill
it (“amount of ink”, how to deal with unconnected shapes,
available fonts etc.); and share information with plug-ins so they
can know, for instance, which symbols can be used for footnotes,
and inform back which ones they have used. Plug-ins would respond
rendered results, as well as indicators about how good is the
result and what could be done to get it better (less or more to
render, adjusts in their area shape etc.). Main engine and
plug-ins would negociate good parameters, shapes and information
set until they are both happy (enough).

The reason for a standard tag language is that the main engine
should be able to do some operations on data, like breaking it in
pieces like words, paragraphs or staffs on music scores, sometimes
without fully understanding what exactly those are.

Possible outcomes: with a proper script language (Lua?),
things like tables, multi-column text, and even a lot of crazy
ideas could be really easy to write. Plug-ins results would be
predictable, since they know nothing about the world except what
the main engine has informed them.

Best,
Maurício



 > Hi Maurício,
 >
 >> Sorry to insist, but I would be really interested in approaches
 >> that are not just great things we could add to TeX.
 >>
 >> For instance: would it be possible to have some kind of “layout
 >> engine” to which text processing would be just one among other
 >> plug-ins? I wonder what kind of information that engine should
 >> share with plug-ins. Do you think such system is possible? Or
 >> something else?
 >
 > I would love to hear more of your thoughts on this. Don't hold back!
 >
 > Best wishes
 > Idris
 >

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today? (slightly off-topic, flame and nostalgic)

[Aditya Mahajan]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: TEXT/PLAIN, Size: 451 bytes --]

On Thu, 12 Jun 2008, Hans Hagen wrote:

> Maurí­cio wrote:
>
>> used ‘ϕ’ in a math formula for one of his papers and Context
>
> it showing up depends on what you use (mkii or mkiv), if the character
> is defined, if the font has it (in text mode) etc etc

For mkii you simply need to add \enableregime[utf8] in the beginning. It 
should work out of the box in mkiv (assuming you are using the default 
latin modern fonts).

Aditya

[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/plain, Size: 487 bytes --]

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today? (slightly off-topic, flame and nostalgic)

[Maurí­cio]

Aditya Mahajan a écrit :
> On Thu, 12 Jun 2008, Hans Hagen wrote:
> 
>> Maurí­cio wrote:
>>
>>> used ‘ϕ’ in a math formula for one of his papers and Context
>>
>> it showing up depends on what you use (mkii or mkiv), if the character
>> is defined, if the font has it (in text mode) etc etc
> 
> For mkii you simply need to add \enableregime[utf8] in the beginning. It 
> should work out of the box in mkiv (assuming you are using the default 
> latin modern fonts).
> 
> Aditya
> 

I always use \enableregime[utf]. I use mkii (actually, I use what Ubuntu 
provides). Is there any font setting I can make so that I can use 
Unicode  everywhere?

Maurício

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Henning Hraban Ramm]

Am 2008-06-12 um 20:26 schrieb Maurí cio:
> The reason for a standard tag language is that the main engine
> should be able to do some operations on data, like breaking it in
> pieces like words, paragraphs or staffs on music scores, sometimes
> without fully understanding what exactly those are.
>
> Possible outcomes: with a proper script language (Lua?),
> things like tables, multi-column text, and even a lot of crazy
> ideas could be really easy to write. Plug-ins results would be
> predictable, since they know nothing about the world except what
> the main engine has informed them.


As far as I can judge, music typesetting has completely different  
rules than text typesetting.

Ok, you would "just" use another plugin.
But then the plugins need a way to interact: captions in graphics  
(like in MetaPost today), lyrics in music etc.

I myself wouldn't probably able to handle a MetaPost based system (or  
something similar) - even if I "speak" a bit of PostScript, I just  
don't think of graphics as formulae: To create e.g. an eye-shape, I  
can place two circles in Illustrator (or any other GUI program) and  
make an intersection. But I couldn't do the same programmatically,  
even if I approximately know what to do in this case.
(You could answer to my mail on command lines, I should please try to  
become mathematically literate.)

However, you need different parsers for different types of content -  
and at least the LilyPond folks would strongly suggest that some Lisp  
dialect is the right language for anything that needs parsing. I guess  
you know the quote that everyone who writes a parser will end re- 
creating a buggy subset of Lisp. (I don't speak Lisp. I don't speak  
TeX-the-language or Lua as well. But the latter seems easy.)

I guess that's a inconvenience with TeX/MetaPost/LilyPond: they use  
similar, but different tagging, and those don't mix very well, esp.  
LilyPond with its Scheme snippets (I don't appreciate the use of  
single ' for strings and # for constants...). (Similar to HTML/PHP/ 
Smarty/JavaScript.)

Of course you could use the same kind of tagging for all the different  
types of content - I guess you will end with something like  
OpenDocument (OOo.XML), that uses SVG for the graphics.
Oh, and don't forget MathML (and the other XML dialects like PhysML  
and ChemML). Hm, perhaps we should embed MusicXML instead of LilyPond...
You see: There is your unified system. XML rulez - for better or for  
worse. It's really no fun to write XML by hand.

Perhaps you should try to help enhancing OpenOffice's typesetting? #
Or Scribus? I heard Scribus has TeX boxes of late: A GUI DTP  
application where some boxes get rendered by LaTeX (meant for  
formulae, of course).
AFAIK Scribus' file format is also XML-based. And maybe they even  
support plugins for more different boxes...


Greetlings from Lake Constance!
Hraban
---
http://www.fiee.net/texnique/
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https://www.cacert.org (I'm an assurer)

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Maurí­cio]

 >> The reason for a standard tag language is that the main engine
 >> should be able to do some operations on data, like breaking it
 >> in pieces like words, paragraphs or staffs on music scores,
 >> sometimes without fully understanding what exactly those are.
 >>
 >> Possible outcomes: with a proper script language (Lua?), things
 >> like tables, multi-column text, and even a lot of crazy ideas
 >> could be really easy to write. Plug-ins results would be
 >> predictable, since they know nothing about the world except
 >> what the main engine has informed them.
 >
 >
 > As far as I can judge, music typesetting has completely
 > different rules than text typesetting.

Sure.

 >
 > Ok, you would "just" use another plugin.  But then the plugins
 > need a way to interact: captions in graphics (like in MetaPost
 > today), lyrics in music etc.

That's the idea. I do believe it's possible.

 >
 > I myself wouldn't probably able to handle a MetaPost based
 > system (or something similar) - even if I "speak" a bit of
 > PostScript, I just don't think of graphics as formulae:

Myself, I never touch my computer mouse :)

I did read an answer from Donald Knuth on why he thinks Metafont
never became a popular tool for font creation. His answer: you
can't ask an artist to become enough of a mathematician in order
to be able to design his font based on 60 variables.

 > However, you need different parsers for different types of
 > content

A system like what I want should have a common language for
all. I'm not smart enough to say which one.

 > (I don't speak Lisp. I don't speak TeX-the-language or Lua as
 > well. But the latter seems easy.)

Yes, it is easy and powerfull. And it was created here in Brazil!
(Proud smile)

 > There is your unified system. XML rulez - for better or for
 > worse. It's really no fun to write XML by hand.

But, as you said, TeX and Lilypond have a similar syntax. I belive
they could share some kind of common language.

 > Perhaps you should try to help enhancing OpenOffice's typesetting? #
 > Or Scribus?

I really would like something we could program, and then change
design variables at will.

Thanks for your comments. I have no knowledge to go beyond
what I went in my first message.

Best,
Maurício

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Charles P. Schaum]

>  > There is your unified system. XML rulez - for better or for
>  > worse. It's really no fun to write XML by hand.
> 
> But, as you said, TeX and Lilypond have a similar syntax. I belive
> they could share some kind of common language.
> 

What you are thinking about is probably a "master document" scheme that
would locally contextualize and process content. You would likely need
some kind of "magic number" system for this to work.

That would probably rule out older hardware because loading and
unloading entire backends (or trying to run them all) is expensive on
processing and memory.

Also you have the potential for fork hell or dependency hell. IIRC there
are MusicTeX, MusixTeX, Lillypond, etc. and some takes this and others
that. There's an Omega package for typesetting pages from the Biblia
Hebraica Stuttgartensia, Makor, and then there are fonts that do most of
that themselves. You have EDMAC and Ledmac, but ConTeXt could probably
handle the lemmatization even more intuitively. (I ought to try that.)
So, which way is right, since coexistence may be a problem. One wants
plain, the other LaTeX. And you can't necessarily intermix the two. I'm
no XML guru, but that's the likely solution.

Since everything has a history, then you have to build a community where
picking and choosing this over that can be a problem; see, for example,
http://blogs.sun.com/jimgris/entry/building_opensolaris_communities

Then we get to GUI or not.

It's probably the case that XML would be the likely candidate. In that
case, Scribus or OOo would be a good place to look. But then you have
all the complex dev issues with OOo. It can take a day to compile on
anything that is more than two or three years old.

In the end, a typesetting metalanguage would require a community to use
it, deep wallets to fund it, or both. And you would have to ask people,
some of whom still miss their old Lisp machines, Multics, and so on, to
make a switch when they know that publishers already have their niche
development tools in place.

And DEK himself wanted to encourage not simply the finding of or
agreement on the right answer to the question (why some hate the
TeXbook) but the heuristics for finding "right" questions and their
answers (why some love the TeXbook).

But whose "right" wins in the design of the metalanguage? Because that
would collide with good old Appendix D, Dirty Tricks, and everyone's
dirty trick complicates interactions of plugins.

It's like the old days when you saved memory on a machine by putting
what looks to be some data in an odd-size piece of memory, when it's
really a set of instructions at an (unusual) odd address instead of an
even. So how do you disambiguate that? You can't just use an assembler;
you have to disassemble the hand-coded 'data' with a debugger to see the
real instructions.

OK, resources are cheaper now, but this means either making dirty tricks
illegal for any historic instruction set like brand X assembler or TeX,
or coming up with a huge parser that can sail the seas of corner cases.

The former threatens backward compatibility, thus meeting resistance in
the TeX/LaTeX community and probably others. OpenDoc does have
government support, so that's an edge. But then there's Microsoft that
herds its users into the pastures of non-standards-compliance.
Additionally, huge parsers are expensive to implement in several ways.

And wasn't SGML supposed to be a generalized markup language? I do like
the idea, but I think that balancing details over against abstractions
(the Suenden that LaTeXers commit at times come to mind) is always going
to be a sort of np-complete issue.

Charles

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Re: How could a typesetting system be today?

[Olivier Guéry]

Hello,

I'm a clarinetist, I used lilypond, realy great tool.
I'm using linux since 10 years, vim is my editor. I'm not a mouse-adict user.
But as Donal Knuth seems to say : I can't act like mathematician, it's
not what I am.

Il like lilypond, and Contex. I like the may they manage to produce
beautiful pdf. But I must be honest : I'll never be able to learn all
the languages they use : It's not my job (i'm physiotherapist !), I'm
not using these tools all days.

I'm ok to learn but it's an evidence that I'll never be able to use
more than 20-30% of what these tools are… it's sad !

So, for me, something like an unified markup language would be the
best. XML or whatever… but just one :o).

Sorry for my bad english.
Olivier.

-- 
[Message tapé sur un clavier Bépo : http://www.clavier-dvorak.org ]
Olivier nemolivier@gmail.com http://nemolivier.blogspot.com
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