From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.text.pandoc/23413 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Devin Prater Newsgroups: gmane.text.pandoc Subject: Re: Accessibility of Generated Docx Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2019 18:15:04 -0500 Message-ID: <5BE53D02-D6CC-41F6-BF87-1D3F35162CC6@gmail.com> References: <677959fb-29b8-4eaa-837f-c53e5ea5ab51@googlegroups.com> Reply-To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_841777CD-089A-44D3-93A7-F24F0D6C7BA2" Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="257643"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org Original-X-From: pandoc-discuss+bncBDWLFR556YFRB65C5PVQKGQE3TBQB6Y-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org Fri Sep 13 01:15:11 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: gtp-pandoc-discuss@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from mail-io1-f59.google.com ([209.85.166.59]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1i8YIw-0014qr-BO for gtp-pandoc-discuss@m.gmane.org; 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[2607:f8b0:4864:20::b36]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id a26si971930ioq.2.2019.09.12.16.15.07 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 12 Sep 2019 16:15:07 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of r.d.t.prater-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b36 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::b36; Original-Received: by mail-yb1-xb36.google.com with SMTP id o82so9314292ybg.10 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2019 16:15:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a25:cb17:: with SMTP id b23mr760785ybg.18.1568330106738; Thu, 12 Sep 2019 16:15:06 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.44.14] ([24.197.47.105]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w8sm4489739ywc.20.2019.09.12.16.15.05 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 12 Sep 2019 16:15:06 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <677959fb-29b8-4eaa-837f-c53e5ea5ab51-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-Original-Sender: R.D.T.PRATER-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=lPpnyWgb; spf=pass (google.com: domain of r.d.t.prater-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::b36 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=r.d.t.prater-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org; contact pandoc-discuss+owners-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1007024079513 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.text.pandoc:23413 Archived-At: --Apple-Mail=_841777CD-089A-44D3-93A7-F24F0D6C7BA2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" As a blind user, I find that mostly everything reads well for screen reader= users, even headings, and definition lists=E2=80=94at least on Pages for M= ac=E2=80=94 are read well. If you make a table like this, I believe screen = readers well read it a bit better: | number | day | |=E2=80=94=E2=80=94|=E2=80=94=E2=80=94| | 1 | Sunday | | 2 | Monday | | 3 | Wednesday | Note that I use Org-mode, so Markdown=E2=80=99s table creation make need to= look different. The main thing is, give table columns a title, any way you= can, and screen readers will try to read the title before the row=E2=80=99= s content, like =E2=80=9CNumber, 1, row 2 column 1. Day, Sunday, Row 2 colu= mn 2.=E2=80=9D This helps a lot with following tables, because screen reade= rs always read content in a linear fashion. Also note that I=E2=80=99m a simpleton, using Org to create well marked up = documents, and exporting to HTML either using Markdown or Org=E2=80=99s own= exporter. The =E2=80=9Ccompatibility mode=E2=80=9D thing in Word is probably because = it sees that Word didn=E2=80=99t make the file, so it does compatibility mo= de to, probably, make its interpretation of the file more relaxed, to accom= modate any errors in Pandoc=E2=80=99s form of DOCX. > On Sep 12, 2019, at 4:21 PM, Conrad Cunningham wr= ote: >=20 > I use pandoc to convert Pandoc-flavored Markdown documents to HTML (prima= rily), Word docx, PDF (via LaTeX), etc. I am currently using pandoc 2.7.3. = Microsoft Word for Mac 16.16.14, and MacTeX 2019 on MacOS 10.14.6 (Mojave). >=20 > According to the tests I have run using the WebAIM WAVE tool, the accessi= bility of the generated HTML is reasonable. (I need to give some attention = to places in the Markdown input where I use tables and alt text.) >=20 > For the generated docx, I am using Word for Mac's builtin accessibility c= hecker. I found that the generated docx is in compatibility mode. Word for = Mac's accessibility checker cannot process that kind of file. If I load the= file into Word and then save as a normal docx, the checker will run. >=20 > Is there a less inconvenient way to get the generated output into the nor= mal docx mode? I would like to get the final output by running a shell scri= pt on the Markdown input. >=20 > The issues I have found so far in my limited tests are warnings about ins= ufficient color contrasts and sequences of blank characters. Some of these = (e.g., colors in section headers and hyperlinks) seem to be fixable by usin= g a custom reference document with modified styles. The warnings associated= with code blocks, highlighting, etc., seem more problematic. >=20 >=20 > --=20 > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups= "pandoc-discuss" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an= email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org . > To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgi= d/pandoc-discuss/677959fb-29b8-4eaa-837f-c53e5ea5ab51%40googlegroups.com . --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pandoc-discuss" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/= pandoc-discuss/5BE53D02-D6CC-41F6-BF87-1D3F35162CC6%40gmail.com. --Apple-Mail=_841777CD-089A-44D3-93A7-F24F0D6C7BA2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" As a blind user, I find th= at mostly everything reads well for screen reader users, even headings, and= definition lists=E2=80=94at least on Pages for Mac=E2=80=94 are read well.= If you make a table like this, I believe screen readers well read it a bit= better:

| number | day= |
|=E2=80=94=E2=80=94|=E2=80=94=E2=80=94|
| 1 | Sunday |
| 2 | Monday |
| 3 | Wednesday |

Note that I use Org-mode, so Markdown=E2=80=99s table creation make= need to look different. The main thing is, give table columns a title, any= way you can, and screen readers will try to read the title before the row= =E2=80=99s content, like =E2=80=9CNumber, 1, row 2 column 1. Day, Sunday, R= ow 2 column 2.=E2=80=9D This helps a lot with following tables, because scr= een readers always read content in a linear fashion.
<= br class=3D"">

Al= so note that I=E2=80=99m a simpleton, using Org to create well marked up do= cuments, and exporting to HTML either using Markdown or Org=E2=80=99s own e= xporter.

The =E2= =80=9Ccompatibility mode=E2=80=9D thing in Word is probably because it sees= that Word didn=E2=80=99t make the file, so it does compatibility mode to, = probably, make its interpretation of the file more relaxed, to accommodate = any errors in Pandoc=E2=80=99s form of DOCX.

On Sep 12, 2019,= at 4:21 PM, Conrad Cunningham <hcc.olemiss-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:

I use pandoc= to convert Pandoc-flavored Markdown documents to HTML (primarily), Word do= cx, PDF (via LaTeX), etc. I am currently using pandoc 2.7.3. Microsoft Word= for Mac 16.16.14, and MacTeX 2019 on MacOS 10.14.6 (Mojave).

According to the tes= ts I have run using the WebAIM WAVE tool, the accessibility of the generate= d HTML is reasonable. (I need to give some attention to places in the Markd= own input where I use tables and alt text.)

For the generated docx, I am using Word for Mac= 's builtin accessibility checker. I found that the generated docx is in com= patibility mode. Word for Mac's accessibility checker cannot process that k= ind of file. If I load the file into Word and then save as a normal docx, t= he checker will run.

Is there a less inconvenient way to get the generated o= utput into the normal docx mode? I would like to get the final output by ru= nning a shell script on the Markdown input.

The issues I have found so far in my limited te= sts are warnings about insufficient color contrasts and sequences of blank = characters. Some of these (e.g., colors in section headers and hyperlinks) = seem to be fixable by using a custom reference document with modified style= s. The warnings associated with code blocks, highlighting, etc., seem more = problematic.


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