citeproc and "related" field

citeproc and "related" field

[Guido Milanese]

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I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" as an interesting 
alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to write and 
then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex. I 
noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" field (e.g. an 
article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "related" fields, 
such as "translationof", "multivolume" and the like. Is this feature 
planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data in BibTeX 
format.

Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly useful and truly smart.

guido (NW Italy)

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Re: citeproc and "related" field

[John MacFarlane]

The question is whether CSL has any variables corresponding to
these things.

http://docs.citationstyles.org/en/stable/specification.html#standard-variables

If so, we could try to be smarter about translating from
bibtex/biblatex to citeproc json.  If not, then it's out of scope
for pandoc-citeproc.

Guido Milanese <guido.milanese-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> writes:

> I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" as an interesting 
> alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to write and 
> then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex. I 
> noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" field (e.g. an 
> article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "related" fields, 
> such as "translationof", "multivolume" and the like. Is this feature 
> planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data in BibTeX 
> format.
>
> Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly useful and truly smart.
>
> guido (NW Italy)
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org
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Re: citeproc and "related" field

['Nick Bart' via pandoc-discuss]

To the best of my knowledge, CSL does not provide any mechanisms for dealing with relations between different items. (For example, that’s why pandoc-citeproc needs to pull all the data from a `crossref`ed item and fold it into the `crossref`ing item when translating from bibtex/biblatex to CSL JSON/YAML.)

CSL-M has “`cs:alternative` to add supplementary reference information to a cited item, such as a translation or reprint” (https://citeproc-js.readthedocs.io/en/latest/csl-m/index.html#cs-alternative-extension), but even if we were to consider adding CSL-M extensions to pandoc-citeproc, we would still have to fold all the information from a number of different biblatex items (translation/reprint; orig. lang. version; earlier print; …) into one CSL JSON/YAML item.

Anyone who sees this a unsatisfactory could of course submit a proposal for enhancing CSL itself (https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/issues).


‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 6:17 AM, John MacFarlane <jgm-TVLZxgkOlNX2fBVCVOL8/A@public.gmane.org> wrote:

> The question is whether CSL has any variables corresponding to
> these things.
>
> http://docs.citationstyles.org/en/stable/specification.html#standard-variables
>
> If so, we could try to be smarter about translating from
> bibtex/biblatex to citeproc json. If not, then it's out of scope
> for pandoc-citeproc.
>
> Guido Milanese guido.milanese-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org writes:
>
> > I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" as an interesting
> > alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to write and
> > then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex. I
> > noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" field (e.g. an
> > article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "related" fields,
> > such as "translationof", "multivolume" and the like. Is this feature
> > planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data in BibTeX
> > format.
> > Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly useful and truly smart.
> > guido (NW Italy)
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org
> > To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/6a9af74f-d011-4733-a984-7c8f460ee41c%40googlegroups.com.
>
> --
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
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> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/m2pnl0icnm.fsf%40johnmacfarlane.net.


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Re: citeproc and "related" field

[Guido Milanese]

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Thank you. Indeed, the CSL variables for translation/reprint and the like
are the same of the old BibTeX files, now deprecated by the Biblatex
format. This new  format is much more practical, but I agree that a
conversion would be a bit heavy. A sort of pre-filter should read the
related entry, extract the needed data (e.g. title), add data with a new
label (e.g.  original-title), and reshape the cited item. Not difficult,
but a bit cumbersome. Do you think that a proposal would be worth
submitting?

Il giorno mar 20 ago 2019 alle ore 09:06 'Nick Bart' via pandoc-discuss <
pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org> ha scritto:

> To the best of my knowledge, CSL does not provide any mechanisms for
> dealing with relations between different items. (For example, that’s why
> pandoc-citeproc needs to pull all the data from a `crossref`ed item and
> fold it into the `crossref`ing item when translating from bibtex/biblatex
> to CSL JSON/YAML.)
>
> CSL-M has “`cs:alternative` to add supplementary reference information to
> a cited item, such as a translation or reprint” (
> https://citeproc-js.readthedocs.io/en/latest/csl-m/index.html#cs-alternative-extension),
> but even if we were to consider adding CSL-M extensions to pandoc-citeproc,
> we would still have to fold all the information from a number of different
> biblatex items (translation/reprint; orig. lang. version; earlier print; …)
> into one CSL JSON/YAML item.
>
> Anyone who sees this a unsatisfactory could of course submit a proposal
> for enhancing CSL itself (
> https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/issues).
>
>
> ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
> On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 6:17 AM, John MacFarlane <jgm-TVLZxgkOlNX2fBVCVOL8/A@public.gmane.org>
> wrote:
>
> > The question is whether CSL has any variables corresponding to
> > these things.
> >
> >
> http://docs.citationstyles.org/en/stable/specification.html#standard-variables
> >
> > If so, we could try to be smarter about translating from
> > bibtex/biblatex to citeproc json. If not, then it's out of scope
> > for pandoc-citeproc.
> >
> > Guido Milanese guido.milanese-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org writes:
> >
> > > I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" as an interesting
> > > alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to write
> and
> > > then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex. I
> > > noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" field (e.g. an
> > > article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "related"
> fields,
> > > such as "translationof", "multivolume" and the like. Is this feature
> > > planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data in
> BibTeX
> > > format.
> > > Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly useful and truly
> smart.
> > > guido (NW Italy)
> > > --
> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
> > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org
> > > To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/6a9af74f-d011-4733-a984-7c8f460ee41c%40googlegroups.com
> .
> >
> > --
> >
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org
> > To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/m2pnl0icnm.fsf%40johnmacfarlane.net
> .
>
>
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> .
>


-- 
Guido Milanese - Professor of Classics - Docteur H.C. Paris ICP
Universita' Cattolica d.S.C., Milano - Brescia
http://docenti.unicatt.it/ita/guido_fabrizio_milanese
<http://www.arsantiqua.org>

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Re: citeproc and "related" field

[Denis Maier]

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Of course, it is worth to submit an issue for this.
But don't expect this to be incorporated to quickly. There are still quite 
a few old debts left ...

Denis

Am Dienstag, 20. August 2019 10:22:57 UTC+2 schrieb Guido Milanese:
>
> Thank you. Indeed, the CSL variables for translation/reprint and the like 
> are the same of the old BibTeX files, now deprecated by the Biblatex 
> format. This new  format is much more practical, but I agree that a 
> conversion would be a bit heavy. A sort of pre-filter should read the 
> related entry, extract the needed data (e.g. title), add data with a new 
> label (e.g.  original-title), and reshape the cited item. Not difficult, 
> but a bit cumbersome. Do you think that a proposal would be worth 
> submitting?
>
> Il giorno mar 20 ago 2019 alle ore 09:06 'Nick Bart' via pandoc-discuss <
> pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org <javascript:>> ha scritto:
>
>> To the best of my knowledge, CSL does not provide any mechanisms for 
>> dealing with relations between different items. (For example, that’s why 
>> pandoc-citeproc needs to pull all the data from a `crossref`ed item and 
>> fold it into the `crossref`ing item when translating from bibtex/biblatex 
>> to CSL JSON/YAML.)
>>
>> CSL-M has “`cs:alternative` to add supplementary reference information to 
>> a cited item, such as a translation or reprint” (
>> https://citeproc-js.readthedocs.io/en/latest/csl-m/index.html#cs-alternative-extension), 
>> but even if we were to consider adding CSL-M extensions to pandoc-citeproc, 
>> we would still have to fold all the information from a number of different 
>> biblatex items (translation/reprint; orig. lang. version; earlier print; …) 
>> into one CSL JSON/YAML item.
>>
>> Anyone who sees this a unsatisfactory could of course submit a proposal 
>> for enhancing CSL itself (
>> https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/issues).
>>
>>
>> ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐
>> On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 6:17 AM, John MacFarlane <j...-TVLZxgkOlNX2fBVCVOL8/A@public.gmane.org 
>> <javascript:>> wrote:
>>
>> > The question is whether CSL has any variables corresponding to
>> > these things.
>> >
>> > 
>> http://docs.citationstyles.org/en/stable/specification.html#standard-variables
>> >
>> > If so, we could try to be smarter about translating from
>> > bibtex/biblatex to citeproc json. If not, then it's out of scope
>> > for pandoc-citeproc.
>> >
>> > Guido Milanese guido....-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org <javascript:> writes:
>> >
>> > > I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" as an 
>> interesting
>> > > alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to write 
>> and
>> > > then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex. I
>> > > noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" field (e.g. an
>> > > article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "related" 
>> fields,
>> > > such as "translationof", "multivolume" and the like. Is this feature
>> > > planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data in 
>> BibTeX
>> > > format.
>> > > Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly useful and truly 
>> smart.
>> > > guido (NW Italy)
>> > > --
>> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
>> > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 
>> send an email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org <javascript:>.
>> > > To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/6a9af74f-d011-4733-a984-7c8f460ee41c%40googlegroups.com
>> .
>> >
>> > --
>> >
>> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
>> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>> an email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org <javascript:>.
>> > To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/m2pnl0icnm.fsf%40johnmacfarlane.net
>> .
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the 
>> Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/pandoc-discuss/gcv2qSIRn0c/unsubscribe.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to 
>> pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org <javascript:>.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/_YdyL8q3jBoJ-JMffharjdfWIMGA7ANVgMtHkCOOd7CneS3SPlY32aCAKl1VkkVLkrNoomKBp42dHQ3crkF5-OAsr330aQphFgdAvZ4j43k%3D%40protonmail.com
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
> Guido Milanese - Professor of Classics - Docteur H.C. Paris ICP
> Universita' Cattolica d.S.C., Milano - Brescia
> http://docenti.unicatt.it/ita/guido_fabrizio_milanese 
> <http://www.arsantiqua.org>
>

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