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[2a00:1450:4864:20::535]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id c38-20020a05651223a600b004811cb1ed75si869008lfv.13.2022.07.03.12.43.48 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 03 Jul 2022 12:43:48 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of melroch-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::535 as permitted sender) client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::535; Original-Received: by mail-ed1-x535.google.com with SMTP id z41so9270322ede.1 for ; Sun, 03 Jul 2022 12:43:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a50:fb13:0:b0:435:90d1:19ca with SMTP id d19-20020a50fb13000000b0043590d119camr34280094edq.159.1656877427186; Sun, 03 Jul 2022 12:43:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: melroch-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20210112 header.b=mmRtRfWg; spf=pass (google.com: domain of melroch-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org designates 2a00:1450:4864:20::535 as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=melroch-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org; contact pandoc-discuss+owners-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1007024079513 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.text.pandoc:30912 Archived-At: --0000000000007bddcf05e2ebd698 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Den s=C3=B6n 3 juli 2022 18:55Paulo Ney de Souza skrev= : > > On Sun, Jul 3, 2022 at 5:15 AM BPJ wrote: > >> It's an upstream bug in LaTeX::ToUnicode. >> > > On LaTeX::ToUnicode ? I thought you only used BibTeX::Parser. > Which uses LaTeX::ToUnicode in its `cleaned_*` methods. > I just had never run into it AFAIK because all the .bib files I had >> written myself or downloaded from the libraries I use had used `\"{a}` >> rather than `\"a` which doesn't hit the bug. I have located the bug and = am >> working on a patch. Thanks for discovering this! (There are a lot of >> unattended bugs though. Do you want me to send you the patch when it is >> ready?) >> > > I know of some bugs on BibTeX::Parser (and none on LaTeX::ToUnicode). > There are some on the old CPAN RT tracker. I don't know if they are de facto fixed. It would be nice to have all of them listed o the issues of the project > page: > > https://github.com/borisveytsman/BibTeXPerlLibs/issues > Thanks for the link. It is missing on MetaCPAN. One of the old bugs complains about sloppy packaging. > especially if you are producing a patch. > Well it will be listed when I submit a PR! > Paulo Ney > > > >> Den s=C3=B6n 3 juli 2022 07:42Paulo Ney de Souza sk= rev: >> >>> I got interested in another aspect of the posting -- the program " >>> cleanbib.pl" by Benct. >>> >>> I installed it in Ubuntu, and found out it does not process perfectly >>> valid TeX code like characters that end or have a space in the middle, = or >>> that it processes \c{e}, but not the comma-accent any of the other vowe= ls... >>> >>> I prepared the torture test below to show the problems: >>> >>> @Book{hobbit, >>> title =3D {Les \oe uf de la serpente}, >>> address =3D {Bla\v zi\'c}, >>> publisher =3D {\c{a} \c{e} \c{i} \c{o} \c{u}}, >>> } >>> >>> and above all, how does this compare to: >>> >>> https://ctan.org/tex-archive/support/bibtexperllibs/LaTeX-ToUnicode >>> >>> Paulo Ney >>> >>> >>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2022 at 1:03 PM BPJ wrote: >>> >>>> string.gsub() optionally takes the maximum number of substitutions as = a >>>> fourth argument, and you can reinsert capture groups in the replacemen= t, so >>>> this should be fairly robust: >>>> >>>> ``````lua >>>> string.gsub(title, '%:(%s)', '.%1', 1) >>>> `````` >>>> >>>> >>>> Den fre 1 juli 2022 18:44John Carter Wood skrev: >>>> >>>>> Ah, of course, biblical references. Religious history is one of my >>>>> fields, how could I miss that? >>>>> >>>>> Looking forward to trying this out! >>>>> >>>>> denis...-NSENcxR/0n0@public.gmane.org schrieb am Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 um 18:41:02 UTC+2: >>>>> >>>>>> A slightly more reliable version: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ``` >>>>>> >>>>>> local stringify =3D pandoc.utils.stringify >>>>>> >>>>>> function Meta(m) >>>>>> >>>>>> if m.references ~=3D nil then >>>>>> >>>>>> for _, el in ipairs (m.references) do >>>>>> >>>>>> -- print(stringify(el.title)) >>>>>> >>>>>> el.title =3D pandoc.Str(string.gsub(stringify(el.title), ': ',= '. >>>>>> ')) >>>>>> >>>>>> -- print(el.title) >>>>>> >>>>>> end >>>>>> >>>>>> end >>>>>> >>>>>> return m >>>>>> >>>>>> end``` >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> (This won=E2=80=99t replace colons in biblical references, e.g. Gen = 1:1) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> You can test with this file : >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ```markdown >>>>>> >>>>>> --- >>>>>> >>>>>> references: >>>>>> >>>>>> - type: book >>>>>> >>>>>> id: doe >>>>>> >>>>>> author: >>>>>> >>>>>> - family: Doe >>>>>> >>>>>> given: Jane >>>>>> >>>>>> issued: >>>>>> >>>>>> date-parts: >>>>>> >>>>>> - - 2022 >>>>>> >>>>>> title: 'A book: with a subtitle and a reference to Gen 1:1, but >>>>>> that is not a problem' >>>>>> >>>>>> publisher: 'Whatever press' >>>>>> >>>>>> lang: de-De >>>>>> >>>>>> ... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> test [@doe] >>>>>> >>>>>> ``` >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> The filter itself does not cover capitalization. For some reason, >>>>>> pandoc or citeproc applies title-case transformation here. I don=E2= =80=99t think it >>>>>> should though. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *Von:* pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org *Im >>>>>> Auftrag von *John Carter Wood >>>>>> *Gesendet:* Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 18:24 >>>>>> *An:* pandoc-discuss >>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: Changing colons to full-stops in titles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> That's very interesting, thanks! I'll try it out when I get a chance >>>>>> in the coming days. >>>>>> >>>>>> I have thought about this issue of false positives while thinking >>>>>> about the option of some kind of filter. But...I think they would be= very >>>>>> rare. I have a hard time thinking of a title with a colon in it that >>>>>> shouldn't be -- in this case -- be turned into a dot. At least, I do= n't >>>>>> have anything in my 1,200 references where I can see that that would= n't >>>>>> apply. >>>>>> >>>>>> Although, of course, I'm sure there are some out there... >>>>>> >>>>>> Just a question: would this also ensure that the first word after th= e >>>>>> dot is capitalised? Or does that open a new series of problems? :-) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> denis...-NSENcxR/0n0@public.gmane.org schrieb am Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 um 18:17:02 UTC+2= : >>>>>> >>>>>> Here=E2=80=99s a very simple and absolutely unreliable version of a = filter. >>>>>> This will replace every colon in a title with a period. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ```lua >>>>>> >>>>>> local stringify =3D pandoc.utils.stringify >>>>>> >>>>>> function Meta(m) >>>>>> >>>>>> if m.references ~=3D nil then >>>>>> >>>>>> for _, el in ipairs (m.references) do >>>>>> >>>>>> print(stringify(el.title)) >>>>>> >>>>>> el.title =3D pandoc.Str(string.gsub(stringify(el.title), ':', >>>>>> '.')) >>>>>> >>>>>> print(el.title) >>>>>> >>>>>> end >>>>>> >>>>>> end >>>>>> >>>>>> return m >>>>>> >>>>>> end >>>>>> >>>>>> ``` >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Question is how this can be made robust enough to avoid false >>>>>> positives. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *Von:* pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org *Im >>>>>> Auftrag von *John Carter Wood >>>>>> *Gesendet:* Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 17:52 >>>>>> *An:* pandoc-discuss >>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: Changing colons to full-stops in titles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks for the suggestions, a couple of which are kind of stretching >>>>>> my knowledge of these things, but I see where they're going. >>>>>> >>>>>> As to JGM's question: I am using a CSL json bibliography, so my >>>>>> titles are in a single field. ("title":"Science and religion: new >>>>>> perspectives on the dialogue") >>>>>> >>>>>> The issue is that *most* of the journals / publishers I publish in >>>>>> use, as here, the colon. *Some* (mainly German) styles want the peri= od. If >>>>>> I were solely interested in either one, I could choose and just ente= r the >>>>>> relevant punctuation in the title field. However, I want to continue= saving >>>>>> my bibliographic entries with a colon (because that's the most stand= ard one >>>>>> for me), but have the option of automatically converting them to a p= eriod >>>>>> for those cases where I need to. If that makes sense. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thus: going through denis's options: >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. I have switched to json bibliographies from bibtex/biblatex as >>>>>> they seemed to offer more flexibility (I was running into issue with= the >>>>>> strange archival references I have to make in my field, and JSON see= med to >>>>>> work better in that regard). So this seems to not apply. >>>>>> >>>>>> 2. Seems to not apply, as I have a single title field >>>>>> >>>>>> 3. Sounds really interesting, and I use BBT, though it also sounds >>>>>> like I would here have to create a separate bibliography file from m= y >>>>>> Zotero database for those publishers/styles that require the dot. Th= is is >>>>>> not *too* onerous, as it would at least be automated. >>>>>> >>>>>> 4. Having a filter that I could simply apply (as part of a pandoc >>>>>> command, say) or not apply as relevant seems like the most flexible = / >>>>>> efficient solution. I don't know lua, but if this is one possible wa= y, then >>>>>> I could use it as a (hopefully fairly simple?) way into learning it. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Does this help to clarify my situation? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> denis...-NSENcxR/0n0@public.gmane.org schrieb am Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 um 17:34:55 UTC+2= : >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, that=E2=80=99s a known issue... >>>>>> >>>>>> There are a couple of possible solutions : >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. use biblatex databases and patch pandoc so it will concat title >>>>>> and subtitle fields using periods. (line 667 >>>>>> https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/blob/master/src/Text/Pandoc/Citeproc/B= ibTeX.hs >>>>>> ) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 2. I think pandoc=E2=80=99s citeproc will just treat every unknown v= ariable >>>>>> as a string variable (see >>>>>> https://github.com/jgm/citeproc/blob/3f94424db469c804cf2dac2d22dc7a1= 8b614f43e/src/Citeproc/Types.hs#L1054 >>>>>> and >>>>>> https://github.com/jgm/citeproc/blob/3f94424db469c804cf2dac2d22dc7a1= 8b614f43e/src/Citeproc/Types.hs#L901), >>>>>> so you should be able to use =C2=ABsubtitle=C2=BB in styles. (This w= ill give you >>>>>> warnings when using the style with Zotero and it won=E2=80=99t work = reliably across >>>>>> implementations, but anyway ...) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 3. if you=E2=80=99re using Zotero, you can leverage Zotero BBT=E2=80= =99s postscript >>>>>> feature to manipulate the JSON after exporting. >>>>>> >>>>>> E.g., this one : >>>>>> >>>>>> if (Translator.BetterCSL && item.title) { >>>>>> >>>>>> reference.title =3D reference.title.replace(/ : /g, '. ') >>>>>> >>>>>> } >>>>>> >>>>>> Not bullet-proof, but simple. You will want to choose a better >>>>>> separator, maybe a double-bar or so. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 4. Doing the with lua should also be possible... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> The question is: do you have the subtitle in a distinct field or is >>>>>> it just in the title field? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *Von:* pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org *Im >>>>>> Auftrag von *John Carter Wood >>>>>> *Gesendet:* Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 16:39 >>>>>> *An:* pandoc-discuss >>>>>> *Betreff:* Changing colons to full-stops in titles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I have one final (for now...) issue in setting up a CSL file (which = I >>>>>> use with pandoc/citeproc and references in a json file). >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm not sure whether this is a CSL issue or whether it's an issue >>>>>> that can be solved via using a filter (or some other solution) in pa= ndoc, >>>>>> but I thought there might be some people here who might have faced a >>>>>> similar issue. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> The house style for here (German-based publisher) wants a *full-stop= /period >>>>>> *between main title and subtitle in citations / bibliographies; >>>>>> US/UK standard is a *colon* between main title and subtitle. And >>>>>> reference managers like Zotero -- IIUC -- save titles as single fiel= ds (at >>>>>> least they are in my version of Zotero). So it doesn't seem like it = is >>>>>> possible to control what delimiter is used between them via CSL. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I have found various discussions of relevant title/subtitle division >>>>>> issues -- some going back quite a few years -- in forums on Zotero: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> https://forums.zotero.org/discussion/8077/separate-fields-for-title-= and-subtitle/ >>>>>> >>>>>> ...and CSL: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/handling-main-sub-title-split= s-citeproc-js/1563/11 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> However, these were in part discussions among developers about >>>>>> *possible* changes, and I'm not sure of the current status of this >>>>>> issue or whether there is a way to handle it. >>>>>> >>>>>> Would it be possible to automate turning colons in titles into >>>>>> full-stops via using a filter? If so is there such a filter already = around? >>>>>> Can this be done via CSL? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Or is this, as of now, impossible? >>>>>> >>>>>> (Or is there a real simple solution that I have, as usual, >>>>>> overlooked...) >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to pandoc-discus...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/78df697a-50f5-46d0-= b0b8-29a2cbc9509an%40googlegroups.com >>>>>> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to pandoc-discus...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>>>> >>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/a2d540a6-a435-4285-= aed5-018007d155cfn%40googlegroups.com >>>>>> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to pandoc-discus...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>>>> >>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/f0f222ef-e60e-4397-= 83ac-bec1a6ac2d08n%40googlegroups.com >>>>>> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, sen= d >>>>> an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/b3deb0de-8ba0-4159-b= 9f3-1ecfbe68d457n%40googlegroups.com >>>>> >>>>> . >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/CADAJKhAU66TxJKMZdDM-= KVabJpmKUVo5xyuAAN03F2b89jv9Ow%40mail.gmail.com >>>> >>>> . >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/CAFVhNZMyj_GZ%3DAo_1qR= 2rwnAAYAaQ%3DMaf880cGLRv7yD_ianpQ%40mail.gmail.com >>> >>> . >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Group= s >> "pandoc-discuss" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send a= n >> email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/CADAJKhBjTdgbY-xDouhDGf= nE%2BJ%2BV5c3v0FUA2Hn00z59%3D%3DWeLw%40mail.gmail.com >> >> . >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "pandoc-discuss" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/CAFVhNZNNsfQs_Lt8agoasey= rNfdhrVOC9GTusMEdfecJFCBnug%40mail.gmail.com > > . > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pandoc-discuss" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/= pandoc-discuss/CADAJKhCjht%3DmJqUgEbyHQWcp%2BP5gKjYUoEfe4VQAOa6SS1b5Ag%40ma= il.gmail.com. --0000000000007bddcf05e2ebd698 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Den s=C3=B6n 3 juli 2022 18:55Paulo Ney de Souza <<= a href=3D"mailto:pauloney-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org">pauloney-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> skrev:
<= /div>

<= /div>
On Su= n, Jul 3, 2022 at 5:15 AM BPJ <melroch-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
=
It's an upstream bug in LaTeX::ToUnicode.

On=C2=A0 LaTeX::ToUnicode ? I thought you only us= ed BibTeX::Parser.

Which uses LaTeX::ToUnicode in its `cleaned= _*` methods.


<= div dir=3D"auto">
=

I just had never run in= to it AFAIK because all the .bib files I had written myself or downloaded f= rom the libraries I use had used `\"{a}` rather than `\"a` which = doesn't hit the bug. I have located the bug and am working on a patch. = Thanks for discovering this! (There are a lot of unattended bugs though. Do= you want me to send you the patch when it is ready?)

I know of some bugs on BibTeX::Parser (and none on LaTeX::= ToUnicode).
There are some on the old CPAN RT tracker. I don&= #39;t know if they are de facto fixed.


= It would be nice to have all of them listed o the=C2=A0issues of the projec= t page:


Thanks for the link. It is missing on MetaCPAN. One of the old bugs comp= lains about sloppy packaging.



especially if you are producing a patch.

Well it will be= listed when I submit a PR!



<= div>Paulo Ney



Den s= =C3=B6n 3 juli 2022 07:42Paulo Ney de Souza <pauloney@gmail.c= om> skrev:
I got interested in another=C2=A0aspect of the posting -= - the program "cleanbib.pl" by Benct.

=
I installed=C2=A0it in Ubuntu, and found out it does not process= perfectly valid TeX code like characters that end or have a space in the m= iddle, or that it processes \c{e}, but not the comma-accent any of the othe= r vowels...

I prepared the torture test below = to show the problems:

@Book{hobbit,
=C2=A0 titl= e =C2=A0 =C2=A0=3D {Les \oe uf =C2=A0de la serpente},
=C2=A0 address =3D= {Bla\v zi\'c},
=C2=A0 publisher =3D {\c{a} \c{e} \c{i} \c{o} \c{u}}= ,
}=C2=A0

and above all, how does this comp= are to:


Paulo Ney


On Sat, Jul 2, 2022 at 1:03 PM BPJ <= bpj-J3H7GcXPSITLoDKTGw+V6w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
string.gsub() optionally takes the maximum = number of substitutions as a fourth argument, and you can reinsert capture = groups in the replacement, so this should be fairly robust:

``````lua
string.gsub(= title, '%:(%s)', '.%1', 1)
``````


Den fre 1 juli 2022 18:44John Carter Wood &l= t;woodjo-ZOsAvrTRSvuEhhMi0yms2Q@public.gmane.org> skrev:
Ah, of course, biblical referen= ces. Religious history is one of my fields, how could I miss that?

= Looking forward to trying this out!

denis...= @unibe.ch schrieb am Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 um 18:41:02 UTC+2:
=

A slightly more reliable versio= n:

=C2=A0

```

local stringify =3D pandoc.util= s.stringify

function Meta(m)<= /span>

=C2=A0 if m.references ~=3D nil= then

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 for _, el in= ipairs (m.references) do

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 -- print(stringify(el.title))

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = el.title =3D pandoc.Str(string.gsub(stringify(el.title), ': ', '= ;. '))

=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 -- print(el.title)

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 end

=C2=A0 end

=C2=A0 return m

end```

=C2=A0

(This won=E2=80=99t replace colons in biblical references, e.g. Gen 1= :1)

=C2=A0

You can test with this file=C2= =A0:

=C2=A0

```markdown

---

references:

- type: book

=C2=A0 id: doe

=C2=A0 author:

=C2=A0 - family: Doe

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 given: Jane

=C2=A0 issued:<= /u>

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 date-parts:<= u>

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 - - 2022<= /u>

=C2=A0 title: 'A book: with= a subtitle and a reference to Gen 1:1, but that is not a problem'

=C2=A0 publisher: 'Whatever= press'

=C2=A0 lang: de-De

...

=C2=A0

test [@doe]

```

=C2=A0

The filter itself does not cover capitalizatio= n. For some reason, pandoc or citeproc applies tit= le-case transformation here. I don=E2=80=99t think it should though.=

=C2=A0

Von: pandoc-.= ..@googlegroups.com <pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org> Im Auftrag von John Carter Wood
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 18:24
An: pandoc-discuss <pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
Betreff: Re: Changing colons to full-stops in titles

=C2=A0

That's very interes= ting, thanks! I'll try it out when I get a chance in the coming days.

I have thought about this issue of false positives while thinking about the= option of some kind of filter. But...I think they would be very rare. I ha= ve a hard time thinking of a title with a colon in it that shouldn't be= -- in this case -- be turned into a dot. At least, I don't have anything in my 1,200 references where I ca= n see that that wouldn't apply.

Although, of course, I'm sure there are some out there...

Just a question: would this also ensure that the first word after the dot i= s capitalised? Or does that open a new series of problems? :-)


denis...-NSENcxR/0n0@public.gmane.org schrieb am Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 um 18:17= :02 UTC+2:

Here=E2=80=99s a very simple an= d absolutely unreliable version of a filter. This will replace every colon = in a title with a period.

=C2=A0

```lua

local stringify =3D pandoc.util= s.stringify

function Meta(m)<= u>

=C2=A0 if m.references ~=3D nil= then

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 for _, el in= ipairs (m.references) do

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = print(stringify(el.title))

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = el.title =3D pandoc.Str(string.gsub(stringify(el.title), ':', '= .'))

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 print(el.title)

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 end

=C2=A0 end

=C2=A0 return m

end

```

=C2=A0

Question is how this can be mad= e robust enough to avoid false positives.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Von: pando= c-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org <pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org> Im Auftrag von John Carter Wood
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 17:52
An: pandoc-discuss <pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
Betreff: Re: Changing colons to full-stops in titles

=C2=A0

Thanks for the suggesti= ons, a couple of which are kind of stretching my knowledge of these things,= but I see where they're going.

As to JGM's question: I am using a CSL json bibliography, so my titles = are in a single field. ("title":"Science and religion: new p= erspectives on the dialogue")

The issue is that *most* of the journals / publishers I publish in use, as = here, the colon. *Some* (mainly German) styles want the period. If I were s= olely interested in either one, I could choose and just enter the relevant = punctuation in the title field. However, I want to continue saving my bibliographic entries with a colon (= because that's the most standard one for me), but have the option of au= tomatically converting them to a period for those cases where I need to. If= that makes sense.

Thus: going through denis's options:

1. I have switched to json bibliographies from bibte= x/biblatex as they seemed to offer more flexibility (I was running into iss= ue with the strange archival references I have to make in my field, and JSON seemed to work better in that regard). So this = seems to not apply.

2. Seems to not apply, as I have a single title fiel= d

3. Sounds really interesting, and I use BBT, though = it also sounds like I would here have to create a separate bibliography fil= e from my Zotero database for those publishers/styles that require the dot. This is not *too* onerous, as it would at least be a= utomated.

4. Having a filter that I could simply apply (as par= t of a pandoc command, say) or not apply as relevant seems like the most fl= exible / efficient solution. I don't know lua, but if this is one possible way, then I could use it as a (hopefully fairly si= mple?) way into learning it.

=C2=A0

Does this help to clari= fy my situation?

=C2=A0

denis...-NSENcxR/0n0@public.gmane.org schrieb am Freitag, 1. Juli = 2022 um 17:34:55 UTC+2:

Yes, that=E2=80=99s a known iss= ue...

There are a couple of possible = solutions=C2=A0:

=C2=A0

1. use biblatex databases and p= atch pandoc so it will concat title and subtitle fields using periods. (line 667 https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/blob/master/src/Text/Pandoc/Citeproc/BibTeX= .hs)

=C2=A0

2. I think pandoc=E2=80=99s citeproc will just treat= every unknown variable as a string variable (see https://github.com/jgm/citeproc/blob/3f94424db469c804cf2dac2d= 22dc7a18b614f43e/src/Citeproc/Types.hs#L1054 and https://github.com/jgm/citeproc/blob/3f94424db469c804cf2dac2d22dc7a18b614f4= 3e/src/Citeproc/Types.hs#L901), so you should be able to use =C2=ABsubt= itle=C2=BB in styles. (This will give you warnings when using the style wit= h Zotero and it won=E2=80=99t work reliably across implementations, but anyway ...)

=C2=A0

3. if you=E2=80=99re using Zote= ro, you can leverage Zotero BBT=E2=80=99s postscript feature to manipulate = the JSON after exporting.

E.g., this one=C2=A0:=

if (Translator.BetterCSL &&= amp; item.title) {

=C2=A0 reference.title =3D refe= rence.title.replace(/ : /g, '. ')

}

Not bullet-proof, but simple. Y= ou will want to choose a better separator, maybe a double-bar or so.=

=C2=A0

4. Doing the with lua should also be possible...<= /u>

=C2=A0

The question is: do you have the subtitle in a disti= nct field or is it just in the title field?

=C2=A0

Von: pando= c-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org <pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org> Im Auftrag von John Carter Wood
Gesendet: Freitag, 1. Juli 2022 16:39
An: pandoc-discuss <pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
Betreff: Changing colons to full-stops in titles

=C2=A0

I have one final (for now...) issue in setting up a = CSL file (which I use with pandoc/citeproc and references in a json file).

=C2=A0

I'm not sure whether this is a CSL issue or whet= her it's an issue that can be solved via using a filter (or some other = solution) in pandoc, but I thought there might be some people here who might have faced a similar issue.

=C2=A0

The house style for here (German-based publisher) wa= nts a full-stop/period between main title and subtitle in citations / bibl= iographies; US/UK standard is a colon between main title and subtitle. And reference managers like Z= otero -- IIUC -- save titles as single fields (at least they are in my vers= ion of Zotero). So it doesn't seem like it is possible to control what = delimiter is used between them via CSL.


I have found various discussions of relevant title/subtitle division issues= -- some going back quite a few years -- in forums on Zotero:

https://forums.zotero.org/discussion/8077/separate-f= ields-for-title-and-subtitle/

...and CSL:

https://discourse.citationstyles.org/t/handl= ing-main-sub-title-splits-citeproc-js/1563/11

=C2=A0

However, these were in = part discussions among developers about possible changes, and I'm not sure of the current status of this= issue or whether there is a way to handle it.

Would it be possible to automate turning colons in t= itles into full-stops via using a filter? If so is there such a filter alre= ady around? Can this be done via CSL?

=C2=A0

Or is this, as of now, impossible?

(Or is there a real simple solution that I have, as usual, overlooked...) <= u>

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--0000000000007bddcf05e2ebd698--