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[2607:f8b0:4864:20::42a]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id d185si551230oih.1.2019.07.01.02.24.15 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 01 Jul 2019 02:24:15 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of bpjonsson-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::42a as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::42a; Original-Received: by mail-pf1-x42a.google.com with SMTP id r1so6259781pfq.12 for ; Mon, 01 Jul 2019 02:24:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a63:6ec6:: with SMTP id j189mr8236777pgc.168.1561973054294; Mon, 01 Jul 2019 02:24:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: bpjonsson-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com header.s=20161025 header.b=fXRu0y+q; spf=pass (google.com: domain of bpjonsson-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org designates 2607:f8b0:4864:20::42a as permitted sender) smtp.mailfrom=bpjonsson-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org; dmarc=pass (p=NONE sp=QUARANTINE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org; contact pandoc-discuss+owners-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1007024079513 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.text.pandoc:23071 Archived-At: --0000000000000cd12c058c9b3142 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable TL;DR: such a change would entail much work for dubious benefits and most importantly would break backward compatibility. The problem as I see it is that the possibility of specifying classes *in two different ways simultaneously* --- one undotted class outside the braces and any number of dotted classes inside the braces is inconsistent and thus confusing to most users. People already tend to think that the lone class undotted class without braces is not just a normal class, which it is except that the highlighting mechanism picks up the *first* class, whether undotted and without braces or dotted and inside braces, as the language name. It might be argued that things could be changed so that a language name always has to be specified as a/the undotted class outside the braces, but this is hard to do for several reasons: one is that in Pandoc's abstract representation of the document this class is not stored specially; it is just the first in the list of classes, and if it was "bare" it is *incidentally* the only class. The developers are very unwilling to change the internal representation (I'm not stating this as critique but merely as a fact), if I understand correctly because any change to the internal representation would mean that numerous changes would need to be made in many places in the code. To users a change would mean that old documents which rely on the current behavior where the language class is just the first class however specified would not work anymore. These two concerns meet when it comes to filters since filters and the various filter libraries, including but not limited to the official Lua filter mechanism and its associated libraries, rely on the current internal representation. Den s=C3=B6n 30 juni 2019 19:55Chao Xu skrev: > If it is more intuitive, then it is less confusing. > When I wrote it for the first time, Theorem {#id} did not work, and that > was fairly confusing to me... > > Also, this update can be helpful towards adding an attribute to all > markdown elements. > https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/issues/684 > > Best, > Chao Xu > > > On Fri, Jun 28, 2019 at 1:55 AM mb21 wrote: > >> I agree that the proposed variant looks nicer. However, it adds yet >> another way to do the same thing, which may lead to confusion (and may m= ake >> learning pandoc markdown harder). Another question is whether fenced cod= e >> blocks would then have to support that style as well... >> >> >> On Wednesday, June 26, 2019 at 5:55:27 PM UTC+2, Chao Xu wrote: >>> >>> Does it make sense to make them mutually exclusive? >>> >>> The syntax is identical to the `header_attributes` extension. Except fo= r >>> that string in front is the class name instead of the header. >>> However, it still makes sense, because often the class name itself acts >>> as a header for a div. (warning, theorem, remark, etc) >>> >>> I'm suggesting making an enhancement, allowing the one I showed in the >>> email. >>> >>> Best, >>> Chao Xu >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jun 26, 2019 at 9:16 AM BP Jonsson wrote: >>> >>>> The two styles, a *single* class without braces or CSS-like attributes >>>> in braces, are mutually exclusive, i.e. you can use one or the other o= n any >>>> given block but you can't mix them on the same block, so if you want b= oth a >>>> class and an id you must use {#id .class} >>>> >>>> Den tis 25 juni 2019 23:12Chao Xu skrev: >>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> What should be the desired behavior for the following code in Pandoc >>>>> Markdown? >>>>> >>>>> ::: Theorem {#id} >>>>> This is a theorem. >>>>> ::: >>>>> >>>>> Knowing both::: Theorem and ::: {.Theorem #id} exists, I would expect >>>>> it behaves as >>>>> >>>>> ::: {.Theorem #id} >>>>> This is a theorem. >>>>> ::: >>>>> >>>>> But that is not true. The HTML output is. >>>>> >>>>>

::: Theorem {#id} This is a theorem. :::

>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Of course, as the current pandoc markdown states: >>>>> > As with fenced code blocks, one can use either attributes in curly >>>>> braces or a single unbraced word, which will be treated as a class na= me. >>>>> >>>>> But I do believe what I suggest is more reasonable, especially most o= f >>>>> the time there are no additional attributes except the class name. >>>>> >>>>> I've raised the issue here. >>>>> https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/issues/5611 >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> Chao Xu >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, sen= d >>>>> an email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>>> To post to this group, send email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/7ed7a801-1691-4285-9= ad5-56945a90558a%40googlegroups.com >>>>> >>>>> . >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>>> Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/pandoc-discuss/2NWx-P7p7P4/unsubscri= be >>>> . >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>> pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>> To post to this group, send email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/CAFC_yuSJDq9oNEP2Ka4b= s3dhTQRMqD-JfpMsfNjnJpqALnW1Ug%40mail.gmail.com >>>> >>>> . >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >> Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/pandoc-discuss/2NWx-P7p7P4/unsubscribe= . >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >> pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >> To post to this group, send email to pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/8e050d22-4d80-45c9-b5c8= -74dbb263da11%40googlegroups.com >> >> . >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "pandoc-discuss" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org > To post to this group, send email to pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/CAJQg2_35kSAh3ooTEOuT0nm= qW1PJurM1mSsbgFeTkj1njvLsxQ%40mail.gmail.com > > . > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pandoc-discuss" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org To post to this group, send email to pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/= pandoc-discuss/CAFC_yuQuSke3By09b48QXDL3dis2wrtXc7UNL%3Dq42faiqMoMng%40mail= .gmail.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --0000000000000cd12c058c9b3142 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
TL;DR: such a change would entail much = work for dubious benefits and most importantly would break backward compati= bility.

The problem as I= see it is that the possibility of specifying classes *in two different way= s simultaneously* --- one undotted class outside the braces and any number = of dotted classes inside the braces is inconsistent and thus confusing to m= ost users. People already tend to think that the lone class undotted class = without braces is not just a normal class, which it is except that the high= lighting mechanism picks up the *first* class, whether undotted and without= braces or dotted and inside braces, as the language name. It might be argu= ed that things could be changed so that a language name always has to be sp= ecified as a/the undotted class outside the braces, but this is hard to do = for several reasons: one is that in Pandoc's abstract representation of= the document this class is not stored specially; it is just the first in t= he list of classes, and if it was "bare" it is *incidentally* the= only class. The developers are very unwilling to change the internal repre= sentation (I'm not stating this as critique but merely as a fact), if I= understand correctly because any change to the internal representation wou= ld mean that numerous changes would need to be made in many places in the c= ode. To users a change would mean that old documents which rely on the curr= ent behavior where the language class is just the first class however speci= fied would not work anymore. These two concerns meet when it comes to filte= rs since filters and the various filter libraries, including but not limite= d to the official Lua filter mechanism and its associated libraries, rely o= n the current internal representation.

Den s=C3=B6n 30 juni 2019 19:55= Chao Xu <mgcclx-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> sk= rev:
If it is= more intuitive, then it is less confusing.
When I wrote it for t= he first time,=C2=A0Theorem {#id} did not work, = and that was fairly confusing to me...

Also, this update can be helpful toward= s adding an attribute to all markdown elements.=C2=A0

<= /div>
Best,
Chao Xu


On Fri, Jun 28, 2019 at 1:55 AM mb21 <mauro.bieg-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>= wrote:
I agree that the proposed variant looks nicer. However, it adds ye= t another way to do the same thing, which may lead to confusion (and may ma= ke learning pandoc markdown harder). Another question is whether fenced cod= e blocks would then have to support that style as well...


On We= dnesday, June 26, 2019 at 5:55:27 PM UTC+2, Chao Xu wrote:
Does it make sense to mak= e them mutually exclusive?

The syntax is identical = to the `header_attributes` extension. Except for that string in front is th= e class name instead of the header.
However, it still makes sense= , because often the class name itself acts as a header for a div.=C2=A0 (wa= rning, theorem, remark, etc)

I'm suggesting ma= king an enhancement, allowing the one I showed in the email.=C2=A0
=
Best,
Chao Xu

=

On Wed, J= un 26, 2019 at 9:16 AM BP Jonsson <bpjo..= .@gmail.com> wrote:
The two styles, a *single* class without brace= s or CSS-like attributes in braces, are mutually exclusive, i.e. you can us= e one or the other on any given block but you can't mix them on the sam= e block, so if you want both a class and an id you must use {#id .class}
Den tis 25 juni 2019 23:= 12Chao Xu <mgc...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> skrev= :
Hi all,

What should be the desired behavior for the f= ollowing code in Pandoc Markdown?

::: Theorem {#id}
This is a theorem.
:::=C2=A0

Knowing both::: Theorem=C2=A0= and=C2=A0::: = {.Theorem=C2=A0#id} exists, I would expect it b= ehaves as

::: {.Theorem #id}
This is a theorem.
:::=C2=A0

But that is not tru= e. The HTML output is.

<p>::: Theorem {#id} This is a theorem. :::</p>


Of course, as the current pa= ndoc markdown states:
> As with fenced code blocks, one can us= e either attributes in curly braces or a single unbraced word, which will b= e treated as a class name.

But I do believe wh= at I suggest is more reasonable, especially most of the time there are no a= dditional attributes except the class name.

I'= ve raised the issue here.

Best,
Chao Xu

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