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* Problem with reference.docx
@ 2017-03-15 17:50 Joseph Reagle
       [not found] ` <c0b93bcf-ff76-372b-87cd-4d113cd314eb-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-15 17:50 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1582 bytes --]

I'm not sure what happened, but when I generate a docx (using pandoc 1.19.2.1) Windows Word 2013 chokes on a note related error. (All the notes ended up appearing as footnotes rather than endnotes when opened with Libre Office.)

So I decided it must be time to update my reference.docx. To do that, you can start with the internal/blank one (which only says "Hello"), but I found it's easier to start with one using the styles/types I use (and need to format for APA).

However, I can't even generate a working non-error causing docx file using the default/internal template.

If you try the following on the attached myfile.md, Word 2013 will complain myfile.docx is corrupted. Can anyone reproduce? What am I doing wrong? I have no reference.docx in my .pandoc directory.

```
pandoc -f markdown+mmd_title_block+yaml_metadata_block+implicit_header_references+superscript+subscript+tex_math_dollars+autolink_bare_uris -w html -s --smart --tab-stop 4 -o myfile.docx --mathjax --filter pandoc-citeproc myfile.md
```

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[-- Attachment #2: myfile.docx --]
[-- Type: application/vnd.openxmlformats-officedocument.wordprocessingml.document, Size: 8010 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #3: myfile.md --]
[-- Type: text/plain, Size: 7714 bytes --]

---
title: "Nerd vs. bro: Geek privilege, idiosyncrasy, and triumphalism"
author: Joseph Reagle
date: 20170126
suppress-bibliography: false
...

 To generate a new reference.docx, generate a docx file from this and then customize the styles in MS word:

```
pandoc -f markdown+mmd_title_block+yaml_metadata_block+implicit_header_references+superscript+subscript+tex_math_dollars+autolink_bare_uris -w html -s --smart --tab-stop 4 -o myfile.docx --mathjax --csl=chicago-fullnote-bibliography.csl --filter pandoc-citeproc myfile.md
```

**Acknowledgments**: <!-- Carol Stabile, Sarah Jackson, Nora Schaddelee -->

**Word count**: currently: 5700/7000; limit: 6000/7000

**ABSTRACT**:  (160 words)
Peggy McIntosh characterized privilege as an "invisible knapsack" of unearned advantages. 
Although the invisible knapsack is a useful metaphor, the notion of unearned advantage is not readily appreciated, especially in androcentric geek cultures associated with computers, comics, and gaming.
After providing brief cultural histories of geekdom and privilege, I ask: Why are some geeks resistant to the notion of privilege?
Beyond the observation that privilege often prompts defensiveness and unproductive comparisons, there is a geek-specific reason.
Geek identity is informed by the trope of *geek triumphalism*: early *insecurity* is superseded by a sense of *superiority*.
Geeks' intelligence, unconventional enthusiasms (e.g., technology and fantasy), and idiosyncratic dress were once targets of ridicule, leading geeks to believe they are without privilege.
These same characteristics, later in life, become sources of success and pride, leading them to think they are beyond bias.
Nonetheless, even in the seemingly innocuous realm of idiosyncratic dress, bias and privilege exist.

**Key words**: privilege, geek, feminism, idiosyncrasy, meritocracy

----

# Heading 1

In early 2014, Nate Silver, the analytic whiz behind the site *FiveThirtyEight*, was talking about the site's expansion plans now that it had been purchased by ESPN.
Silver had gained fame by successfully picking baseball players and electoral winners using savvy quantitative analysis; new staff were hired for their ability to emulate his methods.
Although there were some good qualitative journalists at places like *The New York Times*, Silver thought most analysts, columnists, and pundits were "worthless" practitioners of qualitative and "anecdotal" musings [@Dickey2014hfb].

At *FiveThirtyEight*, he hoped his hiring would achieve a "clubhouse chemistry" among journalists that were quantitative, rigorous, and empirical.
Emily Bell [-@Bell2014jsa], a senior journalist writing at *The Guardian*, noted that there were only six women among Silver's 19-person editorial staff: "By the sophisticated math of this pundit---and Silver hates pundits---that is just under over 30%. Minorities---as, after all, women are a majority---are even more poorly served, at *FiveThirtyEight* and elsewhere."
Consequently, Bell believed "journalism startups aren't a revolution if they're filled with all these white men."

## Heading 2

In a series of famous essays among geeks, programmer and venture capitalist Paul Graham [-@Graham2003wna;  -@Graham2004gh; -@Graham2004wh] wrote about the identity and behavior of hackers and nerds. 
In a five thousand word essay on "Why Nerds are Unpopular," Graham explained that young nerds fail to appreciate that being popular takes effort.

> Teenage kids pay a great deal of attention to clothes. They don't consciously dress to be popular. They dress to look good. But to who? To the other kids. Other kids' opinions become their definition of right, not just for clothes, but for almost everything they do, right down to the way they walk. And so every effort they make to do things "right" is also, consciously or not, an effort to be more popular. Nerds don't realize this. They don't realize that it takes work to be popular.  [@Graham2003wna]

## Heading 3

In a subsequent interview, Silver offered two lines of defense.
He noted that 85% of applications came from men; "that worries us" and his organization needed to continue to "make sure that we're looking widely for the best possible candidates."
More interestingly, he found Bell's critique upsetting because his allusion to "clubhouse chemistry" was just a baseball reference and "the idea that we're bro-y people just couldn't be more off"  [@SilverCoscarelli2014nsl].
Silver's expression of "bro-y"  refers to a stereotypically macho culture, and it is related to the neologism "brogrammer," which become popular in 2010--2012 and describes programmers who fit the stereotype of the frat-boy more so than that of the quiet nerd.
Silver explained: "We're a bunch of weird nerds. We're outsiders, basically. And so we have people who are gay, people of different backgrounds. I don't know. I found the piece really, really frustrating. And that's as much as I'll say" [@SilverCoscarelli2014nsl].

# References

---
references:
- id: Bell2014jsa
  type: article-newspaper
  author:
  - family: "Bell"
    given: "Emily"
  container-title: "The Guardian"
  custom2: "merit.mm"
  issued:
    year: 2014
    month: 03
    day: 12
  keyword: "privilege"
  title: "Journalism startups aren't a revolution if they're filled with all these white men"
  URL: "https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/mar/12/journalism-startups-diversity-ezra-klein-nate-silver"
  accessed:
    year: 2016
    month: 09
    day: 15
- id: Dickey2014hfb
  type: article-magazine
  author:
  - family: "Dickey"
    given: "Jack"
  container-title: "Time"
  custom2: "merit.mm"
  issued:
    year: 2014
    month: 03
    day: 06
  keyword: "privilige"
  title: "How the FiveThirtyEight boss picks his employees"
  URL: "http://time.com/12551/nate-silver-fivethirtyeight-hiring/"
  accessed:
    year: 2016
    month: 09
    day: 15
- id: Graham2003wna
  type: post-weblog
  genre: Web log message
  author:
  - family: "Graham"
    given: "Paul"
  custom2: "merit.mm"
  issued:
    year: 2003
    month: 02
    day: 11
  keyword: "geek"
  title: "Why Nerds are Unpopular"
  URL: "http://www.paulgraham.com/nerds.html"
  accessed:
    year: 2015
    month: 03
    day: 11
- id: Graham2004gh
  type: post-weblog
  genre: Web log message
  abstract: "Reflection on the qualities of great hackers: good tools, space, interesting problems, other good hackers"
  author:
  - family: "Graham"
    given: "Paul"
  custom2: "merit.mm"
  issued:
    year: 2004
    month: 07
    day: 11
  keyword: "geek"
  title: "Great hackers"
  URL: "http://www.paulgraham.com/gh.html"
  accessed:
    year: 2015
    month: 03
    day: 11
- id: Graham2004wh
  type: post-weblog
  genre: Web log message
  author:
  - family: "Graham"
    given: "Paul"
  custom2: "merit.mm"
  issued:
    year: 2004
    month: 04
    day: 11
  keyword: "geek"
  title: "The word \'Hacker\'"
  URL: "http://www.paulgraham.com/gba.html"
  accessed:
    year: 2015
    month: 03
    day: 11
- id: SilverCoscarelli2014nsl
  type: article-magazine
  author:
  - family: "Silver"
    given: "Nate"
  - family: "Coscarelli"
    given: "Joe"
  container-title: "New York Magazine"
  custom2: "merit.mm"
  issued:
    year: 2014
    month: 03
    day: 13
  keyword: "privilege"
  title: "Nate Silver on the launch of ESPN's new FiveThirtyEight, burritos, and being a fox"
  URL: "http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2014/03/nate-silver-interview-fivethirtyeight-espn.html"
  accessed:
    year: 2016
    month: 09
    day: 15

...

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: Problem with reference.docx
       [not found] ` <c0b93bcf-ff76-372b-87cd-4d113cd314eb-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-15 19:17   ` Denis José Navas Vega
       [not found]     ` <92e3e708-055d-477d-9b5a-2684d4fb3051-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 19:28   ` odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx) Joseph Reagle
  2017-03-15 20:58   ` Problem with reference.docx John MacFarlane
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Denis José Navas Vega @ 2017-03-15 19:17 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 693 bytes --]

The manual instructs to use the docx generated by pandoc. If you compare 
the blank docx of word will note differences. 

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[-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 1108 bytes --]

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found] ` <c0b93bcf-ff76-372b-87cd-4d113cd314eb-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 19:17   ` Denis José Navas Vega
@ 2017-03-15 19:28   ` Joseph Reagle
       [not found]     ` <cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 20:58   ` Problem with reference.docx John MacFarlane
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-15 19:28 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss

Instead of monkeying around with Word---which I loathe---I sometimes think it'd be better to create a template for ODT. My needs are fairly simple, simple headings, double space, bibliographic endnotes (when using a note CSL).

However, the default template creates page footnotes. In Libre Office, you can go to Tools/Footnotes and Endnotes/Position and change it to "End of Document," but either pandoc's template or my version of Libre Office leads to a bug of mis-numbering the notes (even if I select number "per document).
So there's that. There's also the question of how do you do simple styling in an ODT template?

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: Problem with reference.docx
       [not found]     ` <92e3e708-055d-477d-9b5a-2684d4fb3051-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-15 19:31       ` Joseph Reagle
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-15 19:31 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

On 3/15/17 3:17 PM, Denis José Navas Vega wrote:
> The manual instructs to use the docx generated by pandoc. If you
> compare the blank docx of word will note differences.

Denis, I do not understand. As a first step, can you open the docx file attached in the last message in Windows Word 2013 (or some other version)? That is a generated docx using pandoc's own reference.

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]     ` <cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-15 20:25       ` Denis José Navas Vega
       [not found]         ` <5c2ef4d5-613e-48b3-b88b-5700ff1d2f80-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 20:32       ` Denis José Navas Vega
                         ` (2 subsequent siblings)
  3 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Denis José Navas Vega @ 2017-03-15 20:25 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1418 bytes --]

Pandoc inserts styles with names in english. LibreOffice (OpenOffice) 
default styles can not be renamed. Therefore, you need to modify the styles 
with the stylel you wish to use. If you start with a odt generated by 
pandoc, can write the needed styles (using the same names as Pandoc uses). 
To write the styles, you need to open the vertical bar at the right of 
LibreOffice and select the operation you wish to do.

The "default.opendocument" only have:

 -  $automatic-styles$
 -  $header-includes$
 -  $title$
 -  $author$
 -  $date$
 -  $include-before$
 -  $include-after$

Therefore, you need to examine wich automatic style applies to the fragment 
that needs that style adapted to the APA specification. 

I include also an template for APA 6 reports and anothe one for the 
previous APA, with the hope that could give you resources.

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[-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 1897 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #2: default.opendocument --]
[-- Type: application/octet-stream, Size: 2097 bytes --]

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" ?>
<office:document-content xmlns:office="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:office:1.0" xmlns:style="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:style:1.0" xmlns:text="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:text:1.0" xmlns:table="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:table:1.0" xmlns:draw="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:drawing:1.0" xmlns:fo="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:xsl-fo-compatible:1.0" xmlns:xlink="http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:meta="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:meta:1.0" xmlns:number="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:datastyle:1.0" xmlns:svg="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:svg-compatible:1.0" xmlns:chart="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:chart:1.0" xmlns:dr3d="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:dr3d:1.0" xmlns:math="http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML" xmlns:form="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:form:1.0" xmlns:script="urn:oasis:names:tc:opendocument:xmlns:script:1.0" xmlns:ooo="http://openoffice.org/2004/office" xmlns:ooow="http://openoffice.org/2004/writer" xmlns:oooc="http://openoffice.org/2004/calc" xmlns:dom="http://www.w3.org/2001/xml-events" xmlns:xforms="http://www.w3.org/2002/xforms" xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema" xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance" office:version="1.2">
  <office:font-face-decls>
    <style:font-face style:name="Courier New" style:font-family-generic="modern" style:font-pitch="fixed" svg:font-family="'Courier New'" />
  </office:font-face-decls>
  <office:automatic-styles>
    $automatic-styles$
  </office:automatic-styles>
$for(header-includes)$
  $header-includes$
$endfor$
<office:body>
<office:text>
$if(title)$
<text:p text:style-name="Title">$title$</text:p>
$endif$
$for(author)$
<text:p text:style-name="Author">$author$</text:p>
$endfor$
$if(date)$
<text:p text:style-name="Date">$date$</text:p>
$endif$
$for(include-before)$
$include-before$
$endfor$
$body$
$for(include-after)$
$include-after$
$endfor$
</office:text>
</office:body>
</office:document-content>

[-- Attachment #3: apa6th_template.ott --]
[-- Type: application/vnd.oasis.opendocument.text-template, Size: 12442 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #4: apa_paper.ott --]
[-- Type: application/vnd.oasis.opendocument.text-template, Size: 15337 bytes --]

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]     ` <cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 20:25       ` Denis José Navas Vega
@ 2017-03-15 20:32       ` Denis José Navas Vega
  2017-03-16 15:04       ` BP Jonsson
  2017-03-16 16:39       ` BP Jonsson
  3 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Denis José Navas Vega @ 2017-03-15 20:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 673 bytes --]

Should have included this image of the style editor in LibreOffice, to make 
clear my previous post.

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[-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 1088 bytes --]

[-- Attachment #2: editor-estilos.png --]
[-- Type: image/png, Size: 91900 bytes --]

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]         ` <5c2ef4d5-613e-48b3-b88b-5700ff1d2f80-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-15 20:41           ` Denis José Navas Vega
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Denis José Navas Vega @ 2017-03-15 20:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 950 bytes --]

I forget about the attachments. 

Here I give links to the attached files in previous message.


default.opendocument  
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AtZgNAKNKaEG1iauPT9G1ILPQSTj

apa_paper.ott  
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AtZgNAKNKaEG1ih5VKF_bjHTNbBD

apa6th_template.ott  
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AtZgNAKNKaEG1ifQoVvGxa2u6F5i

editor-estilos.png  
https://1drv.ms/i/s!AtZgNAKNKaEG1iVOd0akUXBcIxqZ

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[-- Attachment #1.2: Type: text/html, Size: 1415 bytes --]

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: Problem with reference.docx
       [not found] ` <c0b93bcf-ff76-372b-87cd-4d113cd314eb-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 19:17   ` Denis José Navas Vega
  2017-03-15 19:28   ` odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx) Joseph Reagle
@ 2017-03-15 20:58   ` John MacFarlane
       [not found]     ` <20170315205838.GA91086-l/d5Ua9yGnxXsXJlQylH7w@public.gmane.org>
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: John MacFarlane @ 2017-03-15 20:58 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

> pandoc -f markdown+mmd_title_block+yaml_metadata_block+implicit_header_references+superscript+subscript+tex_math_dollars+autolink_bare_uris -w html -s --smart --tab-stop 4 -o myfile.docx --mathjax --filter pandoc-citeproc myfile.md

You're combining `-w html` ("write HTML") with `-o
myfile.docx`, so you're going to get an HTML file
with a docx extension.  That's the problem, I'll wager.


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: Problem with reference.docx
       [not found]     ` <20170315205838.GA91086-l/d5Ua9yGnxXsXJlQylH7w@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-15 21:51       ` Joseph Reagle
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-15 21:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

On 3/15/17 4:58 PM, John MacFarlane wrote:
>> pandoc -f
>> markdown+mmd_title_block+yaml_metadata_block+implicit_header_references+superscript+subscript+tex_math_dollars+autolink_bare_uris
>> -w html -s --smart --tab-stop 4 -o myfile.docx --mathjax --filter
>> pandoc-citeproc myfile.md
> 
> You're combining `-w html` ("write HTML") with `-o myfile.docx`, so
> you're going to get an HTML file with a docx extension.  That's the
> problem, I'll wager.

You are right, I introduced a typo/bug there in my efforts to create a minimal working example. Creating a minimal example is not easy as I have to tweak the source file, generate the docx, and then load it in MS Word in a slow virtual machine and repeat.
 
I'm going to go back to the start and see that where that gets me.


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]     ` <cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-15 20:25       ` Denis José Navas Vega
  2017-03-15 20:32       ` Denis José Navas Vega
@ 2017-03-16 15:04       ` BP Jonsson
       [not found]         ` <459616ad-794b-9a03-6ab7-e6ea8cf9a5cb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
  2017-03-16 16:39       ` BP Jonsson
  3 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: BP Jonsson @ 2017-03-16 15:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

Den 2017-03-15 kl. 20:28, skrev Joseph Reagle:
> Instead of monkeying around with Word---which I loathe---I sometimes think it'd be better to create a template for ODT. My needs are fairly simple, simple headings, double space, bibliographic endnotes (when using a note CSL).
>
> However, the default template creates page footnotes. In Libre Office, you can go to Tools/Footnotes and Endnotes/Position and change it to "End of Document," but either pandoc's template or my version of Libre Office leads to a bug of mis-numbering the notes (even if I select number "per document).
> So there's that. There's also the question of how do you do simple styling in an ODT template?
>

(N.B: I only have a Swedish version of LibreOffice, so I'm 
guessing what the various menus/controls may be called in English...)

What you probably have come up against some things which are 
confusing with note settings in LibreOffice:

Footnotes and endnotes are fundamentally different beasts, as you 
will see in the Insert-->Foot-/endnote dialog.
That's also why there are one tab for footnotesd and one for 
endnotes in Tools-->Foot-/endnotes. However, confusingly, in the 
Footnotes tab there are two radio buttons where you can choose to 
place *Footnotes* at the end of the page or the end of the 
document.  Actual endnotes are still distinct and will show up 
after the footnotes if you choose to place footnotes at the end of 
the document. This means that for styling purposes footnotes are 
still called footnotes even if they appear at the end of the document.

As for numbering there is a dropdown menu -- the second from the 
top in Tools-->Foot-/endnotes-->Footnotes below the one where you 
choose numbering style --, where you can choose to number 
footnotes per page, per chapter or per document *if you have 
chosen the foot of page placement for footnotes*.

I have no idea how Word will handle the LibreOffice 
Footnote/Footnote-at-end-of-document/Endnote distinction.
There may well be hilarity lurking.

/bpj

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]         ` <459616ad-794b-9a03-6ab7-e6ea8cf9a5cb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-16 15:08           ` BP Jonsson
       [not found]             ` <dd07e004-43f9-1593-7f31-9543521e1466-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: BP Jonsson @ 2017-03-16 15:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

FWIW I just noticed that the per-page footnote numbering in 
LibreOffice *is* buggy. I made a test document containing 70 
paragraphs with one footnote in each, and footnote numbers on the 
very last page continue from the second to last page.
So there is a bug in LibreOffice.

/bpj


Den 2017-03-16 kl. 16:04, skrev BP Jonsson:
> Den 2017-03-15 kl. 20:28, skrev Joseph Reagle:
>> Instead of monkeying around with Word---which I loathe---I
>> sometimes think it'd be better to create a template for ODT. My
>> needs are fairly simple, simple headings, double space,
>> bibliographic endnotes (when using a note CSL).
>>
>> However, the default template creates page footnotes. In Libre
>> Office, you can go to Tools/Footnotes and Endnotes/Position and
>> change it to "End of Document," but either pandoc's template or
>> my version of Libre Office leads to a bug of mis-numbering the
>> notes (even if I select number "per document).
>> So there's that. There's also the question of how do you do
>> simple styling in an ODT template?
>>
>
> (N.B: I only have a Swedish version of LibreOffice, so I'm
> guessing what the various menus/controls may be called in English...)
>
> What you probably have come up against some things which are
> confusing with note settings in LibreOffice:
>
> Footnotes and endnotes are fundamentally different beasts, as you
> will see in the Insert-->Foot-/endnote dialog.
> That's also why there are one tab for footnotesd and one for
> endnotes in Tools-->Foot-/endnotes. However, confusingly, in the
> Footnotes tab there are two radio buttons where you can choose to
> place *Footnotes* at the end of the page or the end of the
> document.  Actual endnotes are still distinct and will show up
> after the footnotes if you choose to place footnotes at the end of
> the document. This means that for styling purposes footnotes are
> still called footnotes even if they appear at the end of the
> document.
>
> As for numbering there is a dropdown menu -- the second from the
> top in Tools-->Foot-/endnotes-->Footnotes below the one where you
> choose numbering style --, where you can choose to number
> footnotes per page, per chapter or per document *if you have
> chosen the foot of page placement for footnotes*.
>
> I have no idea how Word will handle the LibreOffice
> Footnote/Footnote-at-end-of-document/Endnote distinction.
> There may well be hilarity lurking.
>
> /bpj


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]             ` <dd07e004-43f9-1593-7f31-9543521e1466-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-16 15:15               ` Joseph Reagle
       [not found]                 ` <024d2360-eb01-34f2-4375-e78369936656-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-16 15:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

On 3/16/17 11:08 AM, BP Jonsson wrote:
> FWIW I just noticed that the per-page footnote numbering in LibreOffice *is* buggy. I made a test document containing 70 paragraphs with one footnote in each, and footnote numbers on the very last page continue from the second to last page.
> So there is a bug in LibreOffice.

I was able to resolve this by upgrading LO to 5.3.0, which version you are using?


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]                 ` <024d2360-eb01-34f2-4375-e78369936656-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-16 15:41                   ` BP Jonsson
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: BP Jonsson @ 2017-03-16 15:41 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

Den 2017-03-16 kl. 16:15, skrev Joseph Reagle:
> On 3/16/17 11:08 AM, BP Jonsson wrote:
>> FWIW I just noticed that the per-page footnote numbering in LibreOffice *is* buggy. I made a test document containing 70 paragraphs with one footnote in each, and footnote numbers on the very last page continue from the second to last page.
>> So there is a bug in LibreOffice.
>
> I was able to resolve this by upgrading LO to 5.3.0, which version you are using?
>

4.2.8.2 from the Ubuntu repositories, and that was recently 
updated! I'll see if I can install from what libreoffice.org 
offers without the software manager insisting on the repo version.

Thanks!

/bpj


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]     ` <cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
                         ` (2 preceding siblings ...)
  2017-03-16 15:04       ` BP Jonsson
@ 2017-03-16 16:39       ` BP Jonsson
       [not found]         ` <CAFC_yuRseC-hyAxxJgawiDJuHyUf-nVaJGfnfJkn+Hka9NmsMQ-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
  3 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: BP Jonsson @ 2017-03-16 16:39 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3299 bytes --]

Are you aware that LO handles DOCX just fine, and pandoc is perfectly fine
with reference DOCX files modified in LO. Pandoc's DOCX support is much
better than its ODT support, including the custom-style attribute for those
times when you need something out of the ordinary (like me underlining
parts of already italicized word forms to highlight differences between
grammatical forms.)

/bpj

ons 15 mars 2017 kl. 20:28 skrev Joseph Reagle <joseph.2011-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>:

> Instead of monkeying around with Word---which I loathe---I sometimes think
> it'd be better to create a template for ODT. My needs are fairly simple,
> simple headings, double space, bibliographic endnotes (when using a note
> CSL).
>
> However, the default template creates page footnotes. In Libre Office, you
> can go to Tools/Footnotes and Endnotes/Position and change it to "End of
> Document," but either pandoc's template or my version of Libre Office leads
> to a bug of mis-numbering the notes (even if I select number "per document).
> So there's that. There's also the question of how do you do simple styling
> in an ODT template?
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "pandoc-discuss" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
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> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997%40reagle.org
> .
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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]         ` <CAFC_yuRseC-hyAxxJgawiDJuHyUf-nVaJGfnfJkn+Hka9NmsMQ-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-16 17:04           ` Joseph Reagle
       [not found]             ` <ae2732ef-7ab0-41c9-2e7b-59111a8f4098-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-16 17:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

On 3/16/17 12:39 PM, BP Jonsson wrote:
> Are you aware that LO handles DOCX just fine, and pandoc is perfectly
> fine with reference DOCX files modified in LO.

That is good too know.

Would it be possible for the new reference.foo files pandoc creates to have examples of the representative types instead of "hello world"? That would make customizing them easier.


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]             ` <ae2732ef-7ab0-41c9-2e7b-59111a8f4098-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-16 19:48               ` John MacFarlane
       [not found]                 ` <20170316194851.GB96043-l/d5Ua9yGnxXsXJlQylH7w@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: John MacFarlane @ 2017-03-16 19:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

+++ Joseph Reagle [Mar 16 17 13:04 ]:
>On 3/16/17 12:39 PM, BP Jonsson wrote:
>Would it be possible for the new reference.foo files pandoc creates to have examples of the representative types instead of "hello world"? That would make customizing them easier.

That's not a bad idea.  However, we've found that there are
often problems when the reference docx contains footnotes or
lists, so there's probably a limit to how many things you
can include there.


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]                 ` <20170316194851.GB96043-l/d5Ua9yGnxXsXJlQylH7w@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-16 20:21                   ` Joseph Reagle
       [not found]                     ` <570b3beb-3783-6cc6-8611-5b9415957ae3-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph Reagle @ 2017-03-16 20:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

On 3/16/17 3:48 PM, John MacFarlane wrote:
> +++ Joseph Reagle [Mar 16 17 13:04 ]:
>> On 3/16/17 12:39 PM, BP Jonsson wrote: Would it be possible for the
>> new reference.foo files pandoc creates to have examples of the
>> representative types instead of "hello world"? That would make
>> customizing them easier.
> 
> That's not a bad idea.  However, we've found that there are often
> problems when the reference docx contains footnotes or lists, so
> there's probably a limit to how many things you can include there.

The styles I often modify are author, date, title, heading {1..3}, first paragraph, body text, block quote, and bibliography (though pandoc doesn't seem to style/type the bibliography).


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]                     ` <570b3beb-3783-6cc6-8611-5b9415957ae3-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-03-17  9:02                       ` John MacFarlane
       [not found]                         ` <20170317090222.GE95891-OxLvLm65mLQb39ziVc0YHliXCkzTwxkR/z7RTEddyNg@public.gmane.org>
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: John MacFarlane @ 2017-03-17  9:02 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw

Go ahead and put up an issue (enhancement request) on the tracker,
so we don't lose track of this suggestion.

+++ Joseph Reagle [Mar 16 17 16:21 ]:
>On 3/16/17 3:48 PM, John MacFarlane wrote:
>> +++ Joseph Reagle [Mar 16 17 13:04 ]:
>>> On 3/16/17 12:39 PM, BP Jonsson wrote: Would it be possible for the
>>> new reference.foo files pandoc creates to have examples of the
>>> representative types instead of "hello world"? That would make
>>> customizing them easier.
>>
>> That's not a bad idea.  However, we've found that there are often
>> problems when the reference docx contains footnotes or lists, so
>> there's probably a limit to how many things you can include there.
>
>The styles I often modify are author, date, title, heading {1..3}, first paragraph, body text, block quote, and bibliography (though pandoc doesn't seem to style/type the bibliography).
>
>-- 
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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx)
       [not found]                         ` <20170317090222.GE95891-OxLvLm65mLQb39ziVc0YHliXCkzTwxkR/z7RTEddyNg@public.gmane.org>
@ 2017-12-19 14:21                           ` Joseph
  0 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Joseph @ 2017-12-19 14:21 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: pandoc-discuss


[-- Attachment #1.1: Type: text/plain, Size: 917 bytes --]

On Friday, March 17, 2017 at 5:03:12 AM UTC-4, John MacFarlane wrote:
>
> Go ahead and put up an issue (enhancement request) on the tracker, 
> so we don't lose track of this suggestion. 
>

Sorry for delay: "reference.docx should include exemplars of the styles to 
aid in their customization #4175"

https://github.com/jgm/pandoc/issues/4175 

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2017-12-19 14:21 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 19+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2017-03-15 17:50 Problem with reference.docx Joseph Reagle
     [not found] ` <c0b93bcf-ff76-372b-87cd-4d113cd314eb-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-15 19:17   ` Denis José Navas Vega
     [not found]     ` <92e3e708-055d-477d-9b5a-2684d4fb3051-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-15 19:31       ` Joseph Reagle
2017-03-15 19:28   ` odt endnote bug and odt formatting (Was: Problem with reference.docx) Joseph Reagle
     [not found]     ` <cd5efe86-0c26-cda6-8006-0954fafec997-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-15 20:25       ` Denis José Navas Vega
     [not found]         ` <5c2ef4d5-613e-48b3-b88b-5700ff1d2f80-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-15 20:41           ` Denis José Navas Vega
2017-03-15 20:32       ` Denis José Navas Vega
2017-03-16 15:04       ` BP Jonsson
     [not found]         ` <459616ad-794b-9a03-6ab7-e6ea8cf9a5cb-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-16 15:08           ` BP Jonsson
     [not found]             ` <dd07e004-43f9-1593-7f31-9543521e1466-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-16 15:15               ` Joseph Reagle
     [not found]                 ` <024d2360-eb01-34f2-4375-e78369936656-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-16 15:41                   ` BP Jonsson
2017-03-16 16:39       ` BP Jonsson
     [not found]         ` <CAFC_yuRseC-hyAxxJgawiDJuHyUf-nVaJGfnfJkn+Hka9NmsMQ-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-16 17:04           ` Joseph Reagle
     [not found]             ` <ae2732ef-7ab0-41c9-2e7b-59111a8f4098-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-16 19:48               ` John MacFarlane
     [not found]                 ` <20170316194851.GB96043-l/d5Ua9yGnxXsXJlQylH7w@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-16 20:21                   ` Joseph Reagle
     [not found]                     ` <570b3beb-3783-6cc6-8611-5b9415957ae3-T1oY19WcHSwdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-17  9:02                       ` John MacFarlane
     [not found]                         ` <20170317090222.GE95891-OxLvLm65mLQb39ziVc0YHliXCkzTwxkR/z7RTEddyNg@public.gmane.org>
2017-12-19 14:21                           ` Joseph
2017-03-15 20:58   ` Problem with reference.docx John MacFarlane
     [not found]     ` <20170315205838.GA91086-l/d5Ua9yGnxXsXJlQylH7w@public.gmane.org>
2017-03-15 21:51       ` Joseph Reagle

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