From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Msuck: nntp://news.gmane.io/gmane.text.pandoc/23282 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Denis Maier Newsgroups: gmane.text.pandoc Subject: Re: citeproc and "related" field Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2019 02:54:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: References: <6a9af74f-d011-4733-a984-7c8f460ee41c@googlegroups.com> <_YdyL8q3jBoJ-JMffharjdfWIMGA7ANVgMtHkCOOd7CneS3SPlY32aCAKl1VkkVLkrNoomKBp42dHQ3crkF5-OAsr330aQphFgdAvZ4j43k=@protonmail.com> Reply-To: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_Part_2353_172017179.1566294886656" Injection-Info: blaine.gmane.org; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:195.159.176.226"; logging-data="11759"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@blaine.gmane.org" To: pandoc-discuss Original-X-From: pandoc-discuss+bncBCQOJL5Q2QMRB2EG57VAKGQEUHYOB7Q-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org Tue Aug 20 11:54:56 2019 Return-path: Envelope-to: gtp-pandoc-discuss@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from mail-ot1-f55.google.com ([209.85.210.55]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from ) id 1i00qt-0002kl-It for gtp-pandoc-discuss@m.gmane.org; Tue, 20 Aug 2019 11:54:55 +0200 Original-Received: by mail-ot1-f55.google.com with SMTP id t26sf3693076otm.9 for ; Tue, 20 Aug 2019 02:54:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20161025; h=sender:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject :mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe; bh=ZlrUVdvqNnoIHySj9wkqR5jFyVquiPygvad/4+IOJ0E=; b=euuw+Dln9ZUsfwWICmYzDpt/dIziVGa4bKnl2nVP4zuW/JZdE7UtxHLWWMdJbeoDe4 v1ityUF75XZHt1kW4+2TAC0nyVYG+m9iFcH+8lTq4CtLko3tYddhwLswN8RtUfYAb6au etkh47g9c+7miaMm2qAZrBZR3bG+1ZELFG9cSkdV3dlZqUZ2Vbjjq1Mv+Z5ILqPB8tno Qhh7PcBX584xX9RWLPLL8LvUPTLT4yGeRWusoVKK5Z0DAunZmiyCNXDkqzikHKJ3r/f4 66tsihcbtgzZsFjCbLveW9KmOZ4yN/L/2xoUV498n+jzHCGSO/Kv+buuo+L/QAFcIqkh 2tcA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to:references:subject:mime-version :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=ZlrUVdvqNnoIHySj9wkqR5jFyVquiPygvad/4+IOJ0E=; b=YoOs99KQPXnEOL2xDcbdnNIMZpfexq+zTbrdNSFt9Mbl2PE/oB+ldF5sOLMoSgh2ZN ruNyOiggrJM5f+R1zIWUueaTw4IVbE5tIMpGYlmgN4lCUXIWeuAUY0sb5mhPU/4RyVjE 7I4IkW+srwjz+hqtwJC/k8KVeO4DkYYonYKwjCgRv8MoCVcAcmdj7n77EL5AHSHcLW4a OG7nI8RLS4FRcBquKXbJUKT88z9t3LbwMRrXfcLUgnvlDj95r14fwEXtybo03U25gtqh IyBQVZl1CYcsV+CPW+va86pHrcubRwINFXL6dmcxAOI5hxxkkDLKjsOPAh5coF3M+XPx 8rZA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=sender:x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:message-id:in-reply-to :references:subject:mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-spam-checked-in-group:list-post :list-help:list-archive:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe; bh=ZlrUVdvqNnoIHySj9wkqR5jFyVquiPygvad/4+IOJ0E=; b=PqeULqUJB6Uizuv6HWD6JCmN3oJYEvTDPMouo8e+tNJjNN5M+3gj7Ah3grJH+DfBmb iW81Z0kB13UxTI9sb+Pr2S6iftajx6egTDHYf+RxKWzfGCqNrDNU2pMnw0ysh+x2dq0B UGFG91mr4zWFMzED6/UQydj9q04YMcigYQxNYq8bv3m+Sd32o0t15u/pHMX96VBPf2O4 suyQV4pnnAbQkzw4aYZg7ShMfflWCPMsMbiq5WumypZqxqKGQU/CLSETSw6clhls9x3d 4Qcq+vyClSP00SEhu27zaLiJZgFrJuBShZRkzVtSf3miLph6n6n/3Grc4IE1rwYnPPwb jBaQ== Original-Sender: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVNqo0LvbZjud330AvfS2VErzMlqRWpRd/LfUSlrTkRZXzFddwV nCmMWLBDMqYC0E2iZHzfCCo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw7iAA/9n8phcy6dxeST6KVbQ7vennAc4N5C4vTa2cWR3JAAVfUl3Yz3YU4am7ewV7dtaT6fA== X-Received: by 2002:aca:5652:: with SMTP id k79mr16708639oib.175.1566294888585; Tue, 20 Aug 2019 02:54:48 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org Original-Received: by 2002:a9d:6250:: with SMTP id i16ls2900800otk.1.gmail; Tue, 20 Aug 2019 02:54:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a05:6830:45c:: with SMTP id d28mr13610390otc.166.1566294887457; Tue, 20 Aug 2019 02:54:47 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: X-Original-Sender: maier.de-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org Precedence: list Mailing-list: list pandoc-discuss-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org; contact pandoc-discuss+owners-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 1007024079513 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.text.pandoc:23282 Archived-At: ------=_Part_2353_172017179.1566294886656 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_2354_1729199623.1566294886657" ------=_Part_2354_1729199623.1566294886657 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Of course, it is worth to submit an issue for this. But don't expect this to be incorporated to quickly. There are still quite= =20 a few old debts left ... Denis Am Dienstag, 20. August 2019 10:22:57 UTC+2 schrieb Guido Milanese: > > Thank you. Indeed, the CSL variables for translation/reprint and the like= =20 > are the same of the old BibTeX files, now deprecated by the Biblatex=20 > format. This new format is much more practical, but I agree that a=20 > conversion would be a bit heavy. A sort of pre-filter should read the=20 > related entry, extract the needed data (e.g. title), add data with a new= =20 > label (e.g. original-title), and reshape the cited item. Not difficult,= =20 > but a bit cumbersome. Do you think that a proposal would be worth=20 > submitting? > > Il giorno mar 20 ago 2019 alle ore 09:06 'Nick Bart' via pandoc-discuss < > pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org > ha scritto: > >> To the best of my knowledge, CSL does not provide any mechanisms for=20 >> dealing with relations between different items. (For example, that=E2=80= =99s why=20 >> pandoc-citeproc needs to pull all the data from a `crossref`ed item and= =20 >> fold it into the `crossref`ing item when translating from bibtex/biblate= x=20 >> to CSL JSON/YAML.) >> >> CSL-M has =E2=80=9C`cs:alternative` to add supplementary reference infor= mation to=20 >> a cited item, such as a translation or reprint=E2=80=9D ( >> https://citeproc-js.readthedocs.io/en/latest/csl-m/index.html#cs-alterna= tive-extension),=20 >> but even if we were to consider adding CSL-M extensions to pandoc-citepr= oc,=20 >> we would still have to fold all the information from a number of differe= nt=20 >> biblatex items (translation/reprint; orig. lang. version; earlier print;= =E2=80=A6)=20 >> into one CSL JSON/YAML item. >> >> Anyone who sees this a unsatisfactory could of course submit a proposal= =20 >> for enhancing CSL itself ( >> https://github.com/citation-style-language/schema/issues). >> >> >> =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original= Message =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 >> On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 6:17 AM, John MacFarlane > > wrote: >> >> > The question is whether CSL has any variables corresponding to >> > these things. >> > >> >=20 >> http://docs.citationstyles.org/en/stable/specification.html#standard-var= iables >> > >> > If so, we could try to be smarter about translating from >> > bibtex/biblatex to citeproc json. If not, then it's out of scope >> > for pandoc-citeproc. >> > >> > Guido Milanese guido....-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org writes: >> > >> > > I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" as an=20 >> interesting >> > > alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to writ= e=20 >> and >> > > then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex. I >> > > noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" field (e.g. a= n >> > > article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "related"= =20 >> fields, >> > > such as "translationof", "multivolume" and the like. Is this feature >> > > planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data in= =20 >> BibTeX >> > > format. >> > > Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly useful and truly= =20 >> smart. >> > > guido (NW Italy) >> > > -- >> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google= =20 >> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >> > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,=20 >> send an email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org . >> > > To view this discussion on the web visit=20 >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/6a9af74f-d011-4733-a984= -7c8f460ee41c%40googlegroups.com >> . >> > >> > -- >> > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google=20 >> Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send= =20 >> an email to pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org . >> > To view this discussion on the web visit=20 >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/m2pnl0icnm.fsf%40johnma= cfarlane.net >> . >> >> >> --=20 >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the= =20 >> Google Groups "pandoc-discuss" group. >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit=20 >> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/pandoc-discuss/gcv2qSIRn0c/unsubscribe= . >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to=20 >> pandoc-...-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org . >> To view this discussion on the web visit=20 >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/_YdyL8q3jBoJ-JMffharjdf= WIMGA7ANVgMtHkCOOd7CneS3SPlY32aCAKl1VkkVLkrNoomKBp42dHQ3crkF5-OAsr330aQphFg= dAvZ4j43k%3D%40protonmail.com >> . >> > > > --=20 > Guido Milanese - Professor of Classics - Docteur H.C. Paris ICP > Universita' Cattolica d.S.C., Milano - Brescia > http://docenti.unicatt.it/ita/guido_fabrizio_milanese=20 > > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= pandoc-discuss" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to pandoc-discuss+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFF+G/Ez6ZCGd0@public.gmane.org To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/= pandoc-discuss/f8bb8e36-e9ad-4498-904c-1424d726dfa8%40googlegroups.com. ------=_Part_2354_1729199623.1566294886657 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Of course, it is worth to submit an issue for this.
Bu= t don't expect this to be incorporated to quickly. There are still quit= e a few old debts left ...

Denis

Am Dienst= ag, 20. August 2019 10:22:57 UTC+2 schrieb Guido Milanese:
Thank you. Indeed, the CS= L variables for translation/reprint and the like are the same of the old Bi= bTeX files, now deprecated by the Biblatex format. This new=C2=A0 format is= much more practical, but I agree that a conversion would be a bit heavy. A= sort of pre-filter should read the related entry, extract the needed data = (e.g. title), add data with a new label (e.g.=C2=A0 original-title), and re= shape the cited item. Not difficult, but a bit cumbersome. Do you think tha= t a proposal would be worth submitting?

Il giorno mar 20 ago 2019 alle ore 09:06 'Nick = Bart' via pandoc-discuss <pandoc-...@googlegroups.com> ha scr= itto:
To the bes= t of my knowledge, CSL does not provide any mechanisms for dealing with rel= ations between different items. (For example, that=E2=80=99s why pandoc-cit= eproc needs to pull all the data from a `crossref`ed item and fold it into = the `crossref`ing item when translating from bibtex/biblatex to CSL JSON/YA= ML.)

CSL-M has =E2=80=9C`cs:alternative` to add supplementary reference informat= ion to a cited item, such as a translation or reprint=E2=80=9D (https://citeproc-js.readthedocs.io/en/lat= est/csl-m/index.html#cs-alternative-extension), but even if w= e were to consider adding CSL-M extensions to pandoc-citeproc, we would sti= ll have to fold all the information from a number of different biblatex ite= ms (translation/reprint; orig. lang. version; earlier print; =E2=80=A6) int= o one CSL JSON/YAML item.

Anyone who sees this a unsatisfactory could of course submit a proposal for= enhancing CSL itself (https://github.com/citation-st= yle-language/schema/issues).


=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90 Original Me= ssage =E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90=E2=80=90
On Tuesday, August 20, 2019 6:17 AM, John MacFarlane <j...-TVLZxgkOlNX2fBVCVOL8/A@public.gmane.org&g= t; wrote:

> The question is whether CSL has any variables corresponding to
> these things.
>
> http://docs.citationstyles.org/en/stable/specification.= html#standard-variables
>
> If so, we could try to be smarter about translating from
> bibtex/biblatex to citeproc json. If not, then it's out of scope > for pandoc-citeproc.
>
> Guido Milanese guido....-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org writes:
>
> > I am seriously experimenting pandoc filter "citeproc" a= s an interesting
> > alternative to the workflow I am more used to, i.e. markdown to w= rite and
> > then compilation -- through pandoc -- as LaTeX + biber + Biblatex= . I
> > noticed that the filter supports the BibTeX "crossref" = field (e.g. an
> > article published in a volume of Proceedings) but not the "r= elated" fields,
> > such as "translationof", "multivolume" and th= e like. Is this feature
> > planned? This would be a great advantage for those who save data = in BibTeX
> > format.
> > Thank you. The pandoc "constellation" is incredibly use= ful and truly smart.
> > guido (NW Italy)
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Googl= e Groups "pandoc-discuss" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,= send an email to pandoc-...@googlegroups.com.
> > To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups= .google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/6a9af74f-d011-4733-a984-7c8f46= 0ee41c%40googlegroups.com.
>
> --
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Gro= ups "pandoc-discuss" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send= an email to pandoc-...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit http= s://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pandoc-discuss/m2pnl0icnm.fsf%= 40johnmacfarlane.net.


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To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to pandoc-...@<= wbr>googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/= msgid/pandoc-discuss/_YdyL8q3jBoJ-JMffharjdfWIMGA7ANVgMtHkCOOd7C<= wbr>neS3SPlY32aCAKl1VkkVLkrNoomKBp42dHQ3crkF5-OAsr330aQphFgdAvZ4j= 43k%3D%40protonmail.com.


--
Guido Milanese - Professor of Classics - Doc= teur H.C. Paris ICP
Universita' Cattolica d.S.C., Milano - Bresciahttp://docenti.unicatt.it/ita/guido_fabrizio_milanese
=

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