From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 8357 invoked from network); 4 Aug 2022 08:21:44 -0000 Received: from alyss.skarnet.org (95.142.172.232) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 4 Aug 2022 08:21:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 15064 invoked by uid 89); 4 Aug 2022 08:22:08 -0000 Mailing-List: contact supervision-help@list.skarnet.org; run by ezmlm Sender: Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Received: (qmail 15057 invoked from network); 4 Aug 2022 08:22:08 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; h=X-Originating-IP:Message-ID:Subject:From:To:Date:In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:User-Agent:MIME-Version; s=default; d=troubleshooters.com; b=i3O1Zt96ykQZpTDCb9Zr0mmO2pB3/kwaXv6hNtQTZL4riWB2LittsOnGhALEi5PdUZJv64/vus1DgIW2yVusIuhUTgMYjAxWOesbdzxs8noT4O+Sbc/bGCzFrbMaWy1JOc6lXZLwmIUQA5nn+TGJQvT5RqnDoKS2XsBbSi+rj44=; DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/simple; d=troubleshooters.com; s=default; t=1659601296; bh=rA1UX5GlPMtCOJLPwTofFQQoeoE=; l=2257; h=X-Originating-IP:Message-ID:Subject:From:To:Date:In-Reply-To: References:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:User-Agent: MIME-Version; b=oXODAqNHoxYNz5WlgfKqfw+pqZkPeiiJrDH5rIU5AkWHApY/KoczfaQoCaDS9TyQ0 YpGenvC3kcdjLPMfXpVl/unGpY0JOoAhaR/uWvQ+0pEgdHIW1UkgY7iBgh6eHs6qz6 sqwBiMtfypzwszy27LLv3mDrdXfCOyRRMEm90mN8= X-Originating-IP: [184.90.131.91] Message-ID: <7ee45cee99f3f84093ca674ac5caaf1e6a8b8421.camel@troubleshooters.com> Subject: Re: Be prepared for the fall of systemd From: Steve Litt To: dng@lists.dyne.org, supervision@list.skarnet.org Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2022 04:21:36 -0400 In-Reply-To: <75OjPiNdg7k-TrGOB10JwBnln7qJjJRtcsOdg1Dm_gk72TwWJ2Te1njPOEgXz-khoRDvkvqjOfB2kUNj5_iAXtoHivgeGVZwoUzvQod4vIo=@so.dang.cool> References: <4234078aeca178d4b1b5136a9463617d97cef66b.camel@troubleshooters.com> <75OjPiNdg7k-TrGOB10JwBnln7qJjJRtcsOdg1Dm_gk72TwWJ2Te1njPOEgXz-khoRDvkvqjOfB2kUNj5_iAXtoHivgeGVZwoUzvQod4vIo=@so.dang.cool> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Evolution 3.44.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 On Wed, 2022-08-03 at 17:19 +0000, J.R. Hill wrote: > There are a few things that need to be in place for a smooth transition. >=20 > For general trust in the project... >=20 > 1. the init system itself should be maintained by more than a single huma= n. This hasn't been the case with runit. It's so darn simple people *do* trust= it, even though it was written by one guy and he stepped away. > 2. the maintainers should be willing to respond to a large audience. (If = a project > is used widely across distributions and is critical to operation and secu= rity, > it'll attract attention from armies of newbies and large cloud corporatio= ns > alike.) This means there needs to be an ability to move slow (maintain ba= ckwards > compatibility) and also to move fast (in security situations) True. All I can say is runit does one thing and does it well, appears to ha= ve no known security flaws, has a small attack surface, so there's little call fo= r updates. > 3. the project should be available from some trusted platform with versio= ning and > source history. >=20 > For ease of transition... >=20 > 4. many init scripts need to exist, or they need to be trivial to write. The originator of runit gives many example scripts, AND they are trivial to= write. See http://smarden.org/runit/runscripts.html . >=20 > I'll give some thoughts on runit: >=20 > I'll start by saying that I've used Void linux for a few years now, and I= love > using runit. It's simple, it works, and it's understandable. That's the o= pposite > of my experience with systemd. I'm not passionately against systemd (or t= he > developers, or RedHat, or even IBM), and I think systemd is technically i= mpressive > and ambitious. But also I don't really want to use it or anything like it= . >=20 > > It's maintained by the Void Linux project... >=20 > Unfortunately I don't think this is true. It's used by Void, but we're pa= ckaging > it by building from the source tarball like anyone else. I guess what I meant was https://github.com/void-linux/runit . That's the s= ource code, maintained by the Void Linux project, and it's up to individual distr= os to package it for their distro. SteveT