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[99.139.148.170]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a1sm357273oti.56.2020.11.06.07.40.52 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Nov 2020 07:40:53 -0800 (PST) To: Clem Cole References: <20201106014109.GP26296@mcvoy.com> From: Will Senn Message-ID: <175409f6-af94-601e-3db3-a5af5d7f64d0@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 6 Nov 2020 09:40:52 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------032783CB051CAB532496DBFE" Content-Language: en-GB Subject: Re: [TUHS] The Elements Of Style: UNIX As Literature X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------032783CB051CAB532496DBFE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Clem, It figures. I should have known there was a reason for the shorter lines other than display. Conventions are sticky and there appears to be a generation gap. I use single spaces between sentences, but my ancestors used 2... who knows why? :). Will On 11/6/20 9:07 AM, Clem Cole wrote: > Will, I do still the same thing, but the reason for 72 for email being > that way is still card-based.  In FORTRAN the first column defines if > the card is new (a blank), a comment (a capital C), no zero a > 'continuation' of the last card.  But column 73-80 were 'special' and > used to store sequence #s (this was handy when you dropped your card > deck, card sorters could put it back into canonical order).  So > characters in those columns were typically ignored.   Thus when "Model > 28 ASR" (a.k.a. ASR-28) created it had 72 columns. It's interesting > that when its follow on the Model 33 was created, it actually had 74, > but most SW configured it to 72 [search for a manual on bit savers or > the like if you want the details]. > > IIRC, the original DEC 'Glass TTY' - the VT-05 was 72, but later > terminals like the VT-52 were 80 columns, as was the ADM 3A. > > The one thing I will give the 'tyranny of 80-columns" is when I look > at code it starts to break that line size by a lot, I often think that > is a bell-weather of something that needs to be rewritten and > simplified, and/or the abstraction might not be right.   Like, > most/many rules there >>are<< often break exceptions, but when I do > look code with really long lines, I admit I am suspect. > > > Clem > > > On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 8:21 AM Will Senn > wrote: > > On 11/6/20 12:34 AM, Rob Pike wrote: > > > https://github.com/golang/go/commit/a625b919163e76c391f2865d1f956c0f16d90f83 > > > > > > > Hilarious. I use fixed font - Monaco 14. But, 80 columns? not on your > life. I hate wrapped text output, if I can avoid it. That said, I > set my > soft word wrap in the text editor at 72 :). My convention comes from > early email though, not punched cards. > > Will > > -- > GPG Fingerprint: 68F4 B3BD 1730 555A 4462  7D45 3EAA 5B6D A982 BAAF > -- GPG Fingerprint: 68F4 B3BD 1730 555A 4462 7D45 3EAA 5B6D A982 BAAF --------------032783CB051CAB532496DBFE Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Clem,

It figures. I should have known there was a reason for the shorter lines other than display. Conventions are sticky and there appears to be a generation gap. I use single spaces between sentences, but my ancestors used 2... who knows why? :).

Will

On 11/6/20 9:07 AM, Clem Cole wrote:
Will, I do still the same thing, but the reason for 72 for email being that way is still card-based.  In FORTRAN the first column defines if the card is new (a blank), a comment (a capital C), no zero a 'continuation' of the last card.  But column 73-80 were 'special' and used to store sequence #s (this was handy when you dropped your card deck, card sorters could put it back into canonical order).  So characters in those columns were typically ignored.   Thus when "Model 28 ASR" (a.k.a. ASR-28) created it had 72 columns.  It's interesting that when its follow on the Model 33 was created, it actually had 74, but most SW configured it to 72 [search for a manual on bit savers or the like if you want the details].

IIRC, the original DEC 'Glass TTY' - the VT-05 was 72, but later terminals like the VT-52 were 80 columns, as was the ADM 3A.

The one thing I will give the 'tyranny of 80-columns" is when I look at code it starts to break that line size by a lot, I often think that is a bell-weather of something that needs to be rewritten and simplified, and/or the abstraction might not be right.   Like, most/many rules there >>are<< often break exceptions, but when I do look code with really long lines, I admit I am suspect.


Clem 


On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 8:21 AM Will Senn <will.senn@gmail.com> wrote:
On 11/6/20 12:34 AM, Rob Pike wrote:
> https://github.com/golang/go/commit/a625b919163e76c391f2865d1f956c0f16d90f83
> <https://github.com/golang/go/commit/a625b919163e76c391f2865d1f956c0f16d90f83>
Hilarious. I use fixed font - Monaco 14. But, 80 columns? not on your
life. I hate wrapped text output, if I can avoid it. That said, I set my
soft word wrap in the text editor at 72 :). My convention comes from
early email though, not punched cards.

Will

--
GPG Fingerprint: 68F4 B3BD 1730 555A 4462  7D45 3EAA 5B6D A982 BAAF



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