From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: grog@lemis.com (Greg Lehey) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 11:55:31 +1030 Subject: Where do you sign the SCO License agreement Message-ID: <19980316115531.52411@freebie.lemis.com> Maybe I'm just being overly pedantic, or maybe I don't understand US customs that well, but I can't work out where to sign the SCO license agreement. Can anybody tell me? Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA11521 for pups-liszt; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:01:49 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA11516 for ; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:01:44 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA02064 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:02:01 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803160502.QAA02064 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: Where do you sign the SCO License agreement To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:02:01 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <19980316115531.52411 at freebie.lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Mar 16, 98 11:55:31 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Greg Lehey: > Maybe I'm just being overly pedantic, or maybe I don't understand US > customs that well, but I can't work out where to sign the SCO license > agreement. Can anybody tell me? Should I put this in the getlicense web page? Warren F. The AUTHORIZED COUNTRY for this Agreement shall be ______________________. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the parties have caused this Agreement to be executed by their duly authorized representatives. LICENSEE: THE SANTA CRUZ OPERATION, INC. __________________________________ <--- Greg Lehey Mr Name Title __________________________________ <--- Your address Address __________________________________ Address __________________________________ Address __________________________________ By <---- Ignore, hangover from old AT&T licences where __________________________________ organisational license Print or Type Name and title (named above) is authorised by an individual (here) __________________________________ Phone and FAX, please <--- Phone, fax, email address __________________________________ Email address - required Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA12553 for pups-liszt; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:40:49 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA12548 for ; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:40:37 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA07244; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:10:17 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id QAA25226; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:10:17 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980316161015.07896 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:10:15 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au, PDP Unix Preservation Subject: Re: Where do you sign the SCO License agreement References: <19980316115531.52411 at freebie.lemis.com> <199803160502.QAA02064 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <199803160502.QAA02064 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>; from Warren Toomey on Mon, Mar 16, 1998 at 04:02:01PM +1100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Mon, 16 March 1998 at 16:02:01 +1100, Warren Toomey wrote: > In article by Greg Lehey: >> Maybe I'm just being overly pedantic, or maybe I don't understand US >> customs that well, but I can't work out where to sign the SCO license >> agreement. Can anybody tell me? > > Should I put this in the getlicense web page? A good idea, but... I hate to appear obtuse, but this doesn't tell me either. Are you saying I should sign where it says "By"? Greg > F. The AUTHORIZED COUNTRY for this Agreement shall be ______________________. > > IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the parties have caused this Agreement to be > executed by their duly authorized representatives. > > LICENSEE: THE SANTA CRUZ OPERATION, INC. > > __________________________________ <--- Greg Lehey Mr > Name Title > > __________________________________ <--- Your address > Address > > __________________________________ > Address > > __________________________________ > Address > > __________________________________ > By <---- Ignore, hangover from old > AT&T licences where > __________________________________ organisational license > Print or Type Name and title (named above) is authorised > by an individual (here) > __________________________________ > Phone and FAX, please <--- Phone, fax, email address > > __________________________________ > Email address - required Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA12594 for pups-liszt; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:44:01 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA12586 for ; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:43:52 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA02167 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:44:09 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803160544.QAA02167 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: Where do you sign the SCO License agreement To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 16:44:09 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <19980316161015.07896 at freebie.lemis.com> from Greg Lehey at "Mar 16, 98 04:10:15 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Greg Lehey: > On Mon, 16 March 1998 at 16:02:01 +1100, Warren Toomey wrote: > > In article by Greg Lehey: > >> Maybe I'm just being overly pedantic, or maybe I don't understand US > >> customs that well, but I can't work out where to sign the SCO license > >> agreement. Can anybody tell me? > > > > Should I put this in the getlicense web page? > > A good idea, but... > > I hate to appear obtuse, but this doesn't tell me either. Are you > saying I should sign where it says "By"? No, just fill in the top section. Leave the `by' section alone, as you ARE your own representative. The only time you'd fill out the bottom section is if you were buying a license for a company, e.g Sproggs Inc. 5 Looney road, SPOTSWOLD. NSW. 2001 by Warren Toomey etc etc etc. Hope this helps. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA12928 for pups-liszt; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 17:58:46 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from asia.Uznet.NET (asia.uznet.net [193.220.92.23]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA12923 for ; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 17:58:30 +1100 (EST) Received: (from stacy at localhost) by asia.Uznet.NET (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA00643 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 12:00:16 +0500 Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 12:00:16 +0500 From: Stacy Minkin Message-Id: <199803160700.MAA00643 at asia.Uznet.NET> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: RQDX3 problems Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hi pdp people! Few days ago I wrote about my hardware problems and asked for hardware guru. Now I've solved some of them - I checked my backplane and it was 18-bits I wired insufficient A19-A21 signals and my CPU acessed memory and now it runs ok. But! I still do not know what happens to my RQDX3! I know that this question has little relation to UNIX and apologize for that. I hardly suspect circuitry fault but may be some other reasons. It looks like this: -My RQDX3 is now connected to simple 5-inch floppy drive when I power up the machine I see no activity on ANY pin of RQDX3 to RQDX SIG. DIST. 50-pin connector! I mean there is no triggering signals hence my floppy also does nothing. When I try to execute bootstrap or simply debug RQDX3 registers from console it looks like this: RESET CLR @#1772150 MOV #100000,@#1772152 ; controller passes INIT step 1 ; no ints enabled, no vector specified, ; UDA OWN bit set. Rings are zero length MOV #xxxxxx,@#1772152 ; controller passes INIT step 2 ; specifying low address bits MOV #0,@#1772152 ; controller passes INIT step 3 - specifying ; high address bits> Does anybody know what does it mean? I also have TMSCP TQK70 controller but no tape drive for it. When I try to run it there is absolutely similar situation - I think this happens each time [T]MSCP controller tries to powerup without any drives connected to it. So I'm looking for help from somebody who can give a hint about which signal should i check to assertain in absence of hardware fault. I have no drawings for RQDX3 neither user's guide. It can even be caused by wrong setting of switches/jumpers - I dont know. Stacy. Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA14297 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 02:41:35 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from mgate.nwnexus.com (beavis.nwnexus.com [206.63.63.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA14292 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 02:41:29 +1100 (EST) Received: from halcyon.com (tide22.microsoft.com [131.107.3.32]) by mgate.nwnexus.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA17334; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 07:41:17 -0800 Message-ID: <350D481A.DAA7B5A4 at halcyon.com> Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 07:41:14 -0800 From: "David C. Jenner" Reply-To: djenner at halcyon.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au CC: PDP Unix Preservation Subject: Re: Where do you sign the SCO License agreement References: <199803160544.QAA02167 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Greg, Since none of the responses seem to really answer your question, here's what I did: I signed my name on the very first line where it says "Name". I then printed my name on the line where it says "Print or Type Name". If this is incorrect, I guess I'll get it back! Dave Warren Toomey wrote: > > In article by Greg Lehey: > > On Mon, 16 March 1998 at 16:02:01 +1100, Warren Toomey wrote: > > > In article by Greg Lehey: > > >> Maybe I'm just being overly pedantic, or maybe I don't understand US > > >> customs that well, but I can't work out where to sign the SCO license > > >> agreement. Can anybody tell me? > > > > > > Should I put this in the getlicense web page? > > > > A good idea, but... > > > > I hate to appear obtuse, but this doesn't tell me either. Are you > > saying I should sign where it says "By"? > > No, just fill in the top section. Leave the `by' section alone, as you > ARE your own representative. > > The only time you'd fill out the bottom section is if you were buying > a license for a company, e.g > > Sproggs Inc. > 5 Looney road, > SPOTSWOLD. NSW. 2001 > > by > > Warren Toomey > etc etc etc. > > Hope this helps. > > Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA15691 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 09:45:45 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA15685 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 09:45:38 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id RAA09739; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 17:45:20 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA08767; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 17:45:19 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 17:45:19 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803162245.AA08767 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Thanks to a member I now have V7 (supnik) Binary on RL02 to try out. Several questions: What hardware does it expect (besides RL02)? This is so I can configure the 11/73 or 11/23 as it expects. When I boot it on the 11/73 (1mb ram, RLV21, RX02, RQDX3(rd52/RX33), DLV11j currently) using RT-11 BOOT/FOREIGN I do get a "@" and it's not ODT. What commands do I issues to get going from there? Allison Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA15720 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 09:49:14 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA15715 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 09:49:10 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA02937 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 09:49:32 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803162249.JAA02937 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: V7 startup To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 09:49:32 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803162245.AA08767 at world.std.com> from Allison J Parent at "Mar 16, 98 05:45:19 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Allison J Parent: > > Thanks to a member I now have V7 (supnik) Binary on RL02 to try out. > > Several questions: > > What hardware does it expect (besides RL02)? This is so I can configure > the 11/73 or 11/23 as it expects. Have a look at http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/pupsfaq.html > When I boot it on the 11/73 (1mb ram, RLV21, RX02, RQDX3(rd52/RX33), > DLV11j currently) using RT-11 BOOT/FOREIGN I do get a "@" and it's > not ODT. What commands do I issues to get going from there? Instructions are in Bob Supnik's emulator readme: 2.1.3 UNIX V7 UNIX V7 is contained on a single RL02 disk image. To boot UNIX: sim> set cpu 18b sim> set rl0 RL02 sim> att rl0 unix_v7_rl.dsk sim> boot rl0 @unix login: root password: pdp # ls -l Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA17274 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 12:44:31 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA17264 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 12:44:13 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id UAA04530; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 20:44:06 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA16350; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 20:44:06 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 20:44:06 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803170144.AA16350 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Thanks Warren, >>>>< @unix <<<<<<< THAT'S what I was trying to remember! Allison Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA17613 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 14:06:14 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA17608 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 14:06:05 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id WAA15132; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 22:05:52 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA05406; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 22:05:52 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 22:05:52 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803170305.AA05406 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Well v7 binary runs seemingly well on my 11/73 with the kitchen sink (the extra and unusable accouterments). It doesn't use much though! The Rl02 disk does have about 5mb space. One thing I'd like to do is have some additional storage other than the one RL02 drive I have. I figure that could easily be a RX02 but it's not obvious how to add that (to V7unix that is). The RQDX3/RD52 would be nice but I'll settle for a RX01/2. The other is the date is 1988... month and day are setable but year? Is there any way to get it to stay in 8/n/1 (my system(s) default) rather than 7/e/1. The last one bugged me some... there is no shutdown! To kill the system all I could do was make sure there weren't any excess processes running do a sync and hit restart. I assume this is ok as I use the same method for venix on the pro350, so far I haven't mashed that system. Allison Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA17672 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 14:15:10 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA17667 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 14:15:06 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA00560 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 14:15:06 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803170315.OAA00560 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: V7 startup To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 14:15:05 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803170305.AA05406 at world.std.com> from Allison J Parent at "Mar 16, 98 10:05:52 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Allison J Parent: > One thing I'd like to do is have some additional storage other than the > one RL02 drive I have. I figure that could easily be a RX02 but it's not > obvious how to add that (to V7unix that is). The RQDX3/RD52 would be > nice but I'll settle for a RX01/2. The kernel you got probably doesn't have much else. I could build another kernel for you. Once you get the source license, you'll be able to do it youself! > The other is the date is 1988... month and day are setable but year? # man date DATE(1) DATE(1) NAME date - print and set the date SYNOPSIS date [ yymmddhhmm [ .ss ] ] DESCRIPTION If no argument is given, the current date and time are printed. If an argument is given, the current date is set. yy is the last two digits of the year; the first mm is the month number; dd is the day number in the month; hh is the hour number (24 hour system); the second mm is the minute number; .ss is optional and is the seconds. > Is there any way to get it to stay in 8/n/1 (my system(s) default) rather > than 7/e/1. What serial devices do you have? I think V7 expected hardwired things like KL-11s. Anyway, here's some of the stty(1) manual. SYNOPSIS stty [ option ... ] DESCRIPTION Stty sets certain I/O options on the current output termi- nal. With no argument, it reports the current settings of the options. The option strings are selected from the following set: even allow even parity -even disallow even parity odd allow odd parity -odd disallow odd parity 50 75 110 134 150 200 300 600 1200 1800 2400 4800 9600 exta extb Set terminal baud rate to the number given, if possible. (These are the speeds supported by the DH-11 interface). > The last one bugged me some... there is no shutdown! To kill the system > all I could do was make sure there weren't any excess processes running > do a sync and hit restart. I assume this is ok as I use the same method > for venix on the pro350, so far I haven't mashed that system. I think that's all you could do. Warren P.S Online mans at: http://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/PUPS/manpages.html Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA18069 for pups-liszt; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 15:27:38 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18064 for ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 15:27:24 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id XAA26229; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 23:27:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA08842; Mon, 16 Mar 1998 23:27:18 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Mar 1998 23:27:18 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803170427.AA08842 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk ; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 16:00:13 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id AAA00874; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 00:00:08 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA02511; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 00:00:07 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 00:00:07 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803170500.AA02511 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 02:17:58 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id KAA23948; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 10:17:52 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA22001; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 10:17:52 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 10:17:52 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803171517.AA22001 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 05:05:02 +1100 (EST) Received: from indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk [195.102.197.88] by serv1.is4.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 1.73 #1) id 0yF0j2-0006HD-00; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 18:04:33 +0000 Received: by indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk (940816.SGI.8.6.9/980207.PNT) id RAA23766; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 17:57:17 GMT Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 17:57:17 GMT From: pete@dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) X-Beware: experimental sendmail.cf 940816.SGI.8.6.9/980207.PNT Message-Id: <9803171757.ZM23764 at indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: allisonp at world.std.com (Allison J Parent) "Re: V7 startup" (Mar 16, 22:05) References: <199803170305.AA05406 at world.std.com> Reply-To: pete at dunnington.u-net.com X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail) To: allisonp at world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Subject: Re: V7 startup Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Mar 16, 22:05, Allison J Parent wrote: > Subject: Re: V7 startup > > Well v7 binary runs seemingly well on my 11/73 with the kitchen sink > (the extra and unusable accouterments). It doesn't use much though! > The Rl02 disk does have about 5mb space. > > One thing I'd like to do is have some additional storage other than the > one RL02 drive I have. I figure that could easily be a RX02 but it's not > obvious how to add that (to V7unix that is). The RQDX3/RD52 would be > nice but I'll settle for a RX01/2. I think I have the RX driver somewhere. Might take a while to find, though. > The other is the date is 1988... month and day are setable but year? Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but ISTR that the dateset at startup does just set MM/DD HH/MM and relies on reading the year last written in a file somewhere. If you run 'date' as root once the system is up, you can set the year as well. > The last one bugged me some... there is no shutdown! To kill the system > all I could do was make sure there weren't any excess processes running > do a sync and hit restart. I assume this is ok as I use the same method > for venix on the pro350, so far I haven't mashed that system. Mine has a script which includes a umount (you won't strictly need that for a single drive) and a sync or two, and a little message. It might have a 'kill -1 1' to take it to single-user mode. Other than that, just halt it after a sync. -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA20559 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:07:31 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA20554 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:07:24 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id PAA13313; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 15:07:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA14559; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 15:07:09 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 15:07:09 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803172007.AA14559 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:58:58 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA01365 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:59:03 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803172059.HAA01365 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Sunchip package [was Assember in C?] To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:59:03 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803171500.KAA03862 at link.link-systems.com> from Ken Wellsch at "Mar 17, 98 10:00:36 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Ken Wellsch: [ Ken confirms that the Xinu distribution for the PDP-11 includes the sunchip package, which is a C compiler and assembler, all written in C ] > Chip is the "Cornell Hypothetical Instructional Processor." It has a > PDP11-like architecture and supports virtual memory. > description can be found in the technical report: > > To run the simulator for this machine, you need a 4.1bsd (or newer) Unix > system. The distribution also contains a development environment for CHIP > containing a C compiler, assembler, loader and various other tools. To > run the development software, you currently need Digital Equipment Corp. > VAX computer. However, with minimal effort, all of this software should > be able to run on any host with UNIX. > > [...] > > ----------------------------------- end of README -------------------- > > P.S. As I suspected and feared, > > % diff -r Trees/V7/usr/src/cmd/c Xinu/src/cmd/cc11 > > indicates the C compiler provided in all these archives (Xinu, > CHIP, sunCHIP) are directly derived from the V6/V7 compiler. So is the DECUS C compiler, I hear. Is there any native C compiler for the PDP-11 which isn't derived from V6/V7? Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA21294 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 08:39:24 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA21289 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 08:39:19 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA01634; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 08:39:18 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803172139.IAA01634 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Sunchip compiler -- how to get it. To: Milo.Velimirovic at uwlax.edu Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 08:39:18 +1100 (EST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) In-Reply-To: <9803172136.AA03640 at toes.its.uwlax.edu> from Milo Velimirovic at "Mar 17, 98 03:36:20 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Milo Velimirovic: > Postscript to previous note, > > Where might I obtain the sunCHIP C compiler for comparison purposes? You need to fetch the Xinu distribution. I haven't got time to unpack the compiler sections right now, but you can get the whole tarball at ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/incoming/DISTR.lsi.tar.gz Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23166 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:41:54 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23161 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:41:50 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA01741 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:41:55 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803172241.JAA01741 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Real Origin of the DECUS C Compiler? To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 09:41:55 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803172238.RAA24010 at link.link-systems.com> from Ken Wellsch at "Mar 17, 98 05:38:12 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Ken Wellsch: > I wasn't aware the DECUS C compiler (written in assembler) took anything > from V6 and/or V7 but I may well be wrong. The DECUS C stuff had a > special interest to me back in the Waterloo days because I believe > a former U of Waterloo person wrote it long ago... Hmm, that's what I'd heard. Perhaps the person who told me this was wrong. Can anybody tell us the correct origins of the DECUS C compiler? Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA23726 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:23:13 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA23721 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:23:09 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA02264 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:22:59 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803180122.MAA02264 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:22:59 +1100 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 licenses. The front says: I am LEGALLY CONTAMINATED by UNIX The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. Near the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ Sound good? Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA23861 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:47:59 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA23852 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:47:52 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA10115; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:17:43 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id MAA09271; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:17:42 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980318121742.30724 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 12:17:42 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au, PDP Unix Preservation Subject: Re: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses References: <199803180122.MAA02264 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <199803180122.MAA02264 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>; from Warren Toomey on Wed, Mar 18, 1998 at 12:22:59PM +1100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Wed, 18 March 1998 at 12:22:59 +1100, Warren Toomey wrote: > I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 > licenses. The front says: > > I am > LEGALLY > CONTAMINATED > by UNIX It's a nice start, but it doesn't really demonstrate the historical nature. > The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. > Near the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ That sounds good. Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA24022 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:23:03 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from biz1.mailsrvcs.net (biz1.gte.net [207.115.153.50]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA24017 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:22:57 +1100 (EST) Received: from emusp6 (1Cust202.tnt13.dfw5.da.uu.net [153.36.233.202]) by biz1.mailsrvcs.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-40549L5000S0) with ESMTP id AAA19033; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 20:22:51 -0600 From: "emanuel stiebler" To: , "PDP Unix Preservation" Subject: Re: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 19:33:46 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19980318022245.AAA19033 at 1Cust202.tnt13.dfw5.da.uu.net> Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hi Warren ... ---------- > From: Warren Toomey > To: PDP Unix Preservation > Subject: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses > Date: Tuesday, March 17, 1998 6:22 PM > > I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 > licenses. The front says: > > I am > LEGALLY > CONTAMINATED > by UNIX > > The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. > Near the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ Do i need the SCO source license for this t-shirt ???? ;-)))) > > Sound good? > > yes Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA24057 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:42:36 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA24052 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:42:33 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA02386 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:42:39 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803180242.NAA02386 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 13:42:38 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <19980318022245.AAA19033 at 1Cust202.tnt13.dfw5.da.uu.net> from emanuel stiebler at "Mar 17, 98 07:33:46 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > > I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 > > licenses. The front says: > > > > I am > > LEGALLY > > CONTAMINATED > > by UNIX > > > > The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. > > In the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ > > Do i need the SCO source license for this t-shirt ???? ;-)))) Yes, of course you will. You will also have to kill anybody who attempts to read the back. Greg Lehey also commented: > It's a nice start, but it doesn't really demonstrate the historical nature. Hmm, how can we rectify this? How about a list of versions covered by the SCO License, arranged randomly around the `I am LEGALLY CONTAMINATED by Unix' on the front? Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24130 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:07:12 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from nighthawk.iti.gov.sg (nighthawk.iti.gov.sg [192.122.131.51]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA24122 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:06:51 +1100 (EST) Received: (from mailer at localhost) by nighthawk.iti.gov.sg (8.6.11/8.6.11) id LAA28549; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:16:38 +0800 Received: from mailhub.iti.gov.sg(192.122.132.132) by nighthawk.iti.gov.sg via smap (V1.3) id sma028546; Wed Mar 18 11:16:33 1998 Received: (from joerg at localhost) by iti.gov.sg (8.8.8/8.8.5) id KAA02180; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 10:58:21 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 10:58:21 +0800 (SGT) From: Joerg Micheel Message-Id: <199803180258.KAA02180 at iti.gov.sg> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Cc: brandt at fokus.gmd.de Subject: Re: Real Origin of the DECUS C Compiler? Reply-To: joerg at begemot.org Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk # In article by Ken Wellsch: # > I wasn't aware the DECUS C compiler (written in assembler) took anything # > from V6 and/or V7 but I may well be wrong. The DECUS C stuff had a # > special interest to me back in the Waterloo days because I believe # > a former U of Waterloo person wrote it long ago... # # Hmm, that's what I'd heard. Perhaps the person who told me this was wrong. # Can anybody tell us the correct origins of the DECUS C compiler? One thing I can tell for sure: the DECUS C Compiler and the K&R CC are completely different in their origins. I'm about 90% sure the DECUS XCC is written in MACRO-11. The reason I'm so sure is because we were looking at a suitable C compiler to run on our 11/34 back in 1989 and we first mungled with the DECUS XCC. But this one had several deficiencies, among them I remember lack of blocks within functions, local variable initialization, difficulties with typedefs/structs. Maybe, Harti could tell more. We were looking into Johnson's pcc, but this one turned out to be a too big piece of work and to slow to run on our 128 KWord machine. Harti tried to port the Whitesmith CC from RT11, and it ran, but there were deficiencies with the RT emulation, so we dropped that. Finally, we took the K&R UNIX CC and reworked it so that it would pass the DECUS XCC to produce the stage one. We wrote our own unix assembler supporting the RSX object file format from scratch. Later, we recompiled the K&R CC on RSX with itself. This system became our workhorse for the next 2 years, the compiler is still amazingly fast, both in terms of runtime and the code being produced. (Quoted: Harti) So here are the 4 different original sources of C compilers for the 11, though, admittedly, 2 of them would run on DEC's original OS, not on UNIX, which I guess, makes them somewhat irrelevant to PUPS. Am I right here ? (Where do we draw the boundary ?) Joerg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24152 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:09:56 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from nighthawk.iti.gov.sg (nighthawk.iti.gov.sg [192.122.131.51]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA24147 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:09:49 +1100 (EST) Received: (from mailer at localhost) by nighthawk.iti.gov.sg (8.6.11/8.6.11) id LAA28594; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:19:42 +0800 Received: from mailhub.iti.gov.sg(192.122.132.132) by nighthawk.iti.gov.sg via smap (V1.3) id sma028584; Wed Mar 18 11:19:11 1998 Received: (from joerg at localhost) by iti.gov.sg (8.8.8/8.8.5) id LAA02265; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:00:59 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:00:59 +0800 (SGT) From: Joerg Micheel Message-Id: <199803180300.LAA02265 at iti.gov.sg> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Cc: brandt at fokus.gmd.de Subject: Re: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Warren writes: # I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 # licenses. The front says: # # I am # LEGALLY # CONTAMINATED # by UNIX # # The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. # Near the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ Hey, hey! Gotta make a reference to the original artwork! :-) Joerg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24169 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:13:06 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA24164 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:13:03 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA02583 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:13:09 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803180313.OAA02583 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:13:09 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803180300.LAA02265 at iti.gov.sg> from Joerg Micheel at "Mar 18, 98 11:00:59 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Joerg Micheel: > Warren writes: > > # I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 > # licenses. The front says: > # > # I am > # LEGALLY > # CONTAMINATED > # by UNIX > # > # The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. > # Near the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ > > Hey, hey! Gotta make a reference to the original artwork! :-) > > Joerg I should say (and Joerg reminds me) that he & Harti sent me a t-shirt a couple of years ago with a copy of boot/login sequence of V7 on the front, and the section of the V6 kernel with the comment above on the back. I wear it quite a bit, and my fiancee likes it too, but probably for other reasons. Thanks Joerg! Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24256 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:49:47 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from nighthawk.iti.gov.sg (nighthawk.iti.gov.sg [192.122.131.51]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA24251 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 14:49:25 +1100 (EST) Received: (from mailer at localhost) by nighthawk.iti.gov.sg (8.6.11/8.6.11) id LAA29201 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:59:12 +0800 Received: from mailhub.iti.gov.sg(192.122.132.132) by nighthawk.iti.gov.sg via smap (V1.3) id sma029192; Wed Mar 18 11:58:37 1998 Received: (from joerg at localhost) by iti.gov.sg (8.8.8/8.8.5) id LAA04283 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:40:24 +0800 (SGT) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 11:40:24 +0800 (SGT) From: Joerg Micheel Message-Id: <199803180340.LAA04283 at iti.gov.sg> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: T-shirt for SCO Unix Licenses Reply-To: joerg at begemot.org Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk # > # I had this idea for a t-shirt to celebrate the release of the SCO PDP-11 # > # licenses. The front says: # > # # > # I am # > # LEGALLY # > # CONTAMINATED # > # by UNIX # > # # > # The back has as much kernel source code as you can print on a t-shirt. # > # Near the middle is the comment /* You are not expected to understand this */ # > # > Hey, hey! Gotta make a reference to the original artwork! :-) # > # I should say (and Joerg reminds me) that he & Harti sent me a t-shirt # a couple of years ago with a copy of boot/login sequence of V7 on the # front, and the section of the V6 kernel with the comment above on the # back. I wear it quite a bit, and my fiancee likes it too, but probably # for other reasons. The /* You are not expected to understand this */ is also on the second page of Peter Salus' A Quater Century of UNIX, explaining a lot of folklore behind the UNIX history, including things like "a tape was found on the street to contain ...". The "contamination" term is (as far as I can tell) originated at Berkeley. When USL sued UCB for violating AT&T UNIX copyrights, it became apparent, that anyone ever having had a look at the original sources would be "infected" and be disallowed to distribute code that vaguely resembles anything in UNIX. Kirk McKusick then showed up with "Mentally contaminated" stickers for everyone attending the 4.4BSD Kernel Internals course at the Winter 1993 USENIX Conference, since he would present us - guess, what - source code! (of 4.4BSD) I still have the sticker somewhere in my collection. Joerg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA24298 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:07:20 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA24293 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:07:17 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA02670 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:07:23 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803180407.PAA02670 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Mental contamination (was t-shirts) To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:07:23 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803180340.LAA04283 at iti.gov.sg> from Joerg Micheel at "Mar 18, 98 11:40:24 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Joerg Micheel: > The /* You are not expected to understand this */ is also on the second > page of Peter Salus' A Quater Century of UNIX, explaining a lot of folklore > behind the UNIX history, including things like "a tape was found on the > street to contain ...". Yes, I'd love to lay my hands on the `50 bugs' tape. For those who don't have Peter Salus' book (get out there & buy it!), this tape had fixes to V6, but the lawyers prevented Bell Labs from distributing it. So, someone `found' it lying in the street and that's how the patches found their way out of the Labs. >The "contamination" term is (as far as I can tell) originated at Berkeley. >Kirk McKusick showed up with "Mentally contaminated" stickers for everyone >attending the 4.4BSD Kernel Internals course at the Winter 1993 USENIX >Conference, since he would present us - guess, what - source code! (of 4.4BSD) > > I still have the sticker somewhere in my collection. I got one of the `Free the Berkeley 4.4' t-shirts. Good stuff. Kirk's the guy who is working on making the 4.xBSD releases available on CD. Please don't hassle him about it; I'll do that 8-) I've informed him that the SCO license covers 32V. Therefore, a lot of people will soon become eligible to receive 4.xBSD. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA24465 for pups-liszt; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:59:25 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA24460 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 15:59:18 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id XAA24816; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 23:59:06 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA20873; Tue, 17 Mar 1998 23:59:06 -0500 Date: Tue, 17 Mar 1998 23:59:06 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803180459.AA20873 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: V7 startup Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk That reminds me. Why can't the 11/73 boot the unix RL pack directly from console boot dialog? The system boots RSTS and RT-11 packs. Is the boot block munged/missing? I might add it boots fine using boot/foreign from rt11. It's a curiousity as having RT on floppy or HD is not a big thing for me. But if it can be fixed that would be an improvement. Allison Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id CAA26001 for pups-liszt; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 02:17:50 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from alph02.triumf.ca (alph02.Triumf.CA [142.90.114.18]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA25996 for ; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 02:17:44 +1100 (EST) Received: by alph02.triumf.ca; id AA25259; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:17:18 -0800 From: Tim Shoppa Message-Id: <9803181517.AA25259 at alph02.triumf.ca> Subject: Re: V7 startup To: allisonp at world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 07:17:18 -0800 (PST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <199803180459.AA20873 at world.std.com> from "Allison J Parent" at Mar 17, 98 11:59:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > That reminds me. Why can't the 11/73 boot the unix RL pack directly from > console boot dialog? The system boots RSTS and RT-11 packs. Is the boot > block munged/missing? I might add it boots fine using boot/foreign from > rt11. The 11/73 firmware bootstrap expects the boot block to conform to certain standards specified by DEC in the early/mid-80's. In particular, the bootstrap must begin with a NOP, but there are some other requirements I don't recall at the moment. The toggle-in bootstraps that DEC supplied didn't do any such checks (who'd want to toggle tha check in everytime, anyway?), they just read block 0 to location 0 and jump to it (well, some also assume things about the SP going somewhere reasonable, and sometimes certain register locations set to certain things.) And RT-11's BOOT/FOR doesn't make any such checks, either. > It's a curiousity as having RT on floppy or HD is not a big thing for me. > But if it can be fixed that would be an improvement. You can either rewrite the 11/73 firmware to not do the check, or you can rewrite the V7 boot block so it conforms to DEC's standard. The RL02 is a particularly stupid device and requires an inordinately large bootstrap, so there may not be a lot of free room in the V7 boot block. You can also stick a "toggle-in" RL02 bootstrap into RAM via ODT and execute that. But I've decded that for me, the solution of RT's BOOT/FOR is the best, just as you seem to have :-). Tim. (shoppa at triumf.ca) Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA28048 for pups-liszt; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 13:27:26 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA28040 for ; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 13:27:21 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id NAA04067; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 13:27:07 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803190227.NAA04067 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: What's TENIX?? To: haba at pdc.kth.se (Harald Barth) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 1998 13:27:07 +1100 (EST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) In-Reply-To: <199803190143.CAA28649 at pancake.pdc.kth.se> from Harald Barth at "Mar 19, 98 02:43:13 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Harald Barth: > One PDP-11 I have (and don't quite understand the hardware of) calls itself > Tektronix 8562. In that box (43x60x30cm) you find > LSI-11/73 (only part made by DIGITAL) > Controller with > 8'' floppy > 40Mb MFM disk with TENIX (binary of some kind of V7 Unix) > Controller with > 10 ttys Hmm, I haven't heard of Tenix before. I might punt this onto the mailing list to see if anybody can identify it. Any ideas, people?? Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA28280 for pups-liszt; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 14:44:01 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from smtp1.erols.com (smtp1.erols.com [207.172.3.234]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA28275 for ; Thu, 19 Mar 1998 14:43:43 +1100 (EST) Received: from LOCALNAME (207-172-239-202.s11.as8.rkv.erols.com [207.172.239.202]) by smtp1.erols.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA09738; Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:41:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <351093C7.5B96 at erols.com> Date: Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:40:55 -0500 From: "Sheila H.//Elwood Blues" Reply-To: shsrms at erols.com Organization: Holistic Herbal/&/WaveRider Research X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-KIT (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au CC: Harald Barth , PDP Unix Preservation Subject: Re: What's TENIX?? References: <199803190227.NAA04067 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Warren Toomey wrote: > > In article by Harald Barth: > > One PDP-11 I have (and don't quite understand the hardware of) calls itself > > Tektronix 8562. In that box (43x60x30cm) you find > > LSI-11/73 (only part made by DIGITAL) > > Controller with > > 8'' floppy > > 40Mb MFM disk with TENIX (binary of some kind of V7 Unix) > > Controller with > > 10 ttys > > Hmm, I haven't heard of Tenix before. I might punt this onto the > mailing list to see if anybody can identify it. > > Any ideas, people?? > > Warren Tenex was a PDP10 (aka DECSystem 10/20) operating system. Some 10s had 11s as consoles. bob Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id WAA03459 for pups-liszt; Fri, 20 Mar 1998 22:07:40 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from pancake.pdc.kth.se (pancake.pdc.kth.se [130.237.221.163]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA03454 for ; Fri, 20 Mar 1998 22:07:33 +1100 (EST) Received: from pancake.pdc.kth.se (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pancake.pdc.kth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA00394; Fri, 20 Mar 1998 12:06:51 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199803201106.MAA00394 at pancake.pdc.kth.se> To: shsrms at erols.com Cc: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au, haba at pdc.kth.se, pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: What's TNIX (Was: What's TENIX??) From: Harald Barth In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 Mar 1998 22:40:55 -0500" References: <351093C7.5B96 at erols.com> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.54 on Emacs 20.2.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Fri, 20 Mar 1998 12:06:44 +0100 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hi, I wrote to Warren: > > > One PDP-11 I have (and don't quite understand the hardware of) calls itself > > > Tektronix 8562. In that box (43x60x30cm) you find > > > LSI-11/73 (only part made by DIGITAL) > > > Controller with > > > 8'' floppy > > > 40Mb MFM disk with TENIX (binary of some kind of V7 Unix) > > > Controller with > > > 10 ttys Warren wrote: > > Hmm, I haven't heard of Tenix before. I might punt this onto the > > mailing list to see if anybody can identify it. shsrms at erols.com wrote: > Tenex was a PDP10 (aka DECSystem 10/20) operating system. > Some 10s had 11s as consoles. The Tektronix manuals say "Tektronix Unix" and "TNIX". Looks like I've to boot the box and have a closer look at the actual software. I'm quite sure that it is some kind of v7. Unfortunately, it's just binaries. I don't think this should be confused with Tenex and/or PDP10s which had PDP11s and PDP8s as I/O processors in different places. Harald. Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id MAA08866 for pups-liszt; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 12:45:22 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from pancake.pdc.kth.se (pancake.pdc.kth.se [130.237.221.163]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08860 for ; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 12:45:15 +1100 (EST) Received: from pancake.pdc.kth.se (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pancake.pdc.kth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA02181; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 02:44:19 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199803220144.CAA02181 at pancake.pdc.kth.se> To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au, pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Cc: bygg at sunet.se, thn at stacken.kth.se, haba at pdc.kth.se Subject: Two different 2.11? From: Harald Barth X-Mailer: Mew version 1.54 on Emacs 20.2.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 02:44:17 +0100 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Started to get 2.11BSD working on emulator and 11/70. So far: Started emulator taken from: ftp://haba at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/Boot_Images/2.11_on_rl02/ Made kernel on emulator which supports the actual hardware: DELUA at non standard addr, RA81, RL02 Moved boot RL02 to 11/70 with RSTS/E Made bootable RA81 on 11/70 Untar:ed usr from ftp://haba at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/Distributions/ucb/2.11BSD/file6.tar.gz ....And now the binaries from that tar file crash with "unknown system call" However, the binaries distributed in the disk images work. Any clues? Harald. Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA09210 for pups-liszt; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 15:23:37 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from moe.2bsd.com (0 at MOE.2BSD.COM [206.139.202.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09204 for ; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 15:23:31 +1100 (EST) Received: (from sms at localhost) by moe.2bsd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA08735 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Sat, 21 Mar 1998 20:23:15 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 1998 20:23:15 -0800 (PST) From: "Steven M. Schultz" Message-Id: <199803220423.UAA08735 at moe.2bsd.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: Two different 2.11? Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Greetings - No, there is only 1 2.11BSD (in the sense that there are NOT competing versions or distributions). What happened I believe is that the Boot_Images/2.11_on_rl02 is older than the files in Distributions/ucb/2.11BSD. I have not looked at the Boot_Images/2.11_on_rl02 files to determine when they were created (what patch level, etc.). On your RL02 system what do the first two or three lines of /VERSION? Anyhow, between the time that the 2.11_on_rl02 images were created (I did not create them) and December-1997/January-1998 several new system calls were created _AND_ the entire system was recompiled and relinked. That is why you can NOT use binaries from the Distributions/ucb/2.11BSD with earlier kernels. There is UPWARD compatibility (old binaries can run on new kernels) but not backwards compatibility. What you need to do is build a 'tape' (using 'makesimtape' if you need to use Bob's emulator) from ALL of the files in Distributions/ucb/ 2.11BSD. Steven Schultz sms at moe.2bsd.com > From: Harald Barth > > Started to get 2.11BSD working on emulator and 11/70. So far: > > Started emulator taken from: > ftp://haba at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/Boot_Images/2.11_on_rl02/ > > Made kernel on emulator which supports the actual hardware: > DELUA at non standard addr, RA81, RL02 > > Moved boot RL02 to 11/70 with RSTS/E > > Made bootable RA81 on 11/70 > > Untar:ed usr from > > ftp://haba at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/Distributions/ucb/2.11BSD/file6.tar.gz > > ....And now the binaries from that tar file crash with "unknown system > call" However, the binaries distributed in the disk images work. Any > clues? > > Harald. > > > Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA11410 for pups-liszt; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:54:56 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA11405 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:54:51 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA08277 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:55:25 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803222155.IAA08277 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: SCO processing the new licenses To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 08:55:25 +1100 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hi all, Dion at SCO writes today: We have about a dozen licenses here, all paid up and signed off. So you should start receiving your PDP Unix licenses soon. He didn't say who the first dozen were. Cheers all, Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA12569 for pups-liszt; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 14:02:33 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from renoir.op.net (root at renoir.op.net [209.152.193.4]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA12564 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 14:02:25 +1100 (EST) Received: from goppelt.op.net (d-phlarc2-09.ppp.op.net [209.152.199.105]) by renoir.op.net (o1/$Revision: 1.15 $) with SMTP id WAA21783 for ; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 22:02:11 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199803230302.WAA21783 at renoir.op.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Ed G." To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 22:02:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Building sim tapes Reply-to: edgee at cyberpass.net In-reply-to: <199803220423.UAA08735 at moe.2bsd.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > What you need to do is build a 'tape' (using 'makesimtape' if you > need to use Bob's emulator) from ALL of the files in Distributions/ucb/ > 2.11BSD. I've looked everywhere I can think of on the PUPS site, but couldn't find 'makesimtape'. I couldn't find it among the source of Bob's emulator. Where can I get a copy of this program? Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA12805 for pups-liszt; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 15:31:25 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12799 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 15:31:21 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA09463; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 15:31:20 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803230431.PAA09463 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: Building sim tapes To: edgee at cyberpass.net Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 15:31:19 +1100 (EST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <199803230302.WAA21783 at renoir.op.net> from "Ed G." at "Mar 22, 98 10:02:10 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Ed G.: > > What you need to do is build a 'tape' (using 'makesimtape' if you > > need to use Bob's emulator) from ALL of the files in Distributions/ucb/ > > 2.11BSD. > > I've looked everywhere I can think of on the PUPS site, but couldn't > find 'makesimtape'. I couldn't find it among the source of Bob's > emulator. Where can I get a copy of this program? I don't think Bob's latest emulator has got this. I've hacked at another program to do this, and I'll make it available tomorrow. Bob has asked me to submit this to him for inclusion in his simulator. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA12839 for pups-liszt; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 15:39:21 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from moe.2bsd.com (0 at MOE.2BSD.COM [206.139.202.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA12833 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 15:39:12 +1100 (EST) Received: (from sms at localhost) by moe.2bsd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA27736 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Sun, 22 Mar 1998 20:38:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 1998 20:38:48 -0800 (PST) From: "Steven M. Schultz" Message-Id: <199803230438.UAA27736 at moe.2bsd.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: Building sim tapes Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > From: "Ed G." > > > What you need to do is build a 'tape' (using 'makesimtape' if you > > need to use Bob's emulator) from ALL of the files in Distributions/ucb/ > > I've looked everywhere I can think of on the PUPS site, but couldn't > find 'makesimtape'. I couldn't find it among the source of Bob's > emulator. Where can I get a copy of this program? It's in /usr/src/sys/pdpstand. Look in file7.tar.gz from the 2.11 part of the Distributions and it should be somewhere in there. makesimtape is a hacked up version of 'maketape', the syntax and data file are the same so if you know how to use 'maketape' to create bootable tapes you're all set. The program is short enough I'll include it here. It should compile and run with minimal tweeking on any 'BSD'ish UNIX system. Steven ----------------------- /* * @(#)makesimtape.c 2.0 (2.11BSD) 1997/8/7 * Hacked 'maketape.c' to write a file in a format suitable for * use with Bob Supnik's PDP-11 simulator (V2.3) emulated tape * driver. * * NOTE: a PDP-11 has to flip the shorts within the long when writing out * the record size. Seems a PDP-11 is neither a little-endian * machine nor a big-endian one. */ #include #include #include #include #include #include #include #define MAXB 30 char buf[MAXB * 512]; char name[50]; long recsz, flipped, trl(); int blksz; int mt, fd, cnt; struct iovec iovec[3]; struct iovec tmark[2]; void usage(); main(argc, argv) int argc; char *argv[]; { int i, j = 0, k = 0, zero = 0; register char *outfile = NULL, *infile = NULL; FILE *mf; struct stat st; while ((i = getopt(argc, argv, "i:o:")) != EOF) { switch (i) { case 'o': outfile = optarg; break; case 'i': infile = optarg; break; default: usage(); /* NOTREACHED */ } } if (!outfile || !infile) usage(); /* NOTREACHED */ /* * Stat the outfile and make sure it either 1) Does not exist, or * 2) Exists but is a regular file. */ if (stat(outfile, &st) != -1 && !(S_ISREG(st.st_mode))) errx(1, "outfile must either not exist or be a regular file"); /* NOTREACHED */ mt = open(outfile, O_WRONLY|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC, 0600); if (mt < 0) err(1, "Can not create %s", outfile); /* NOTREACHED */ mf = fopen(infile, "r"); if (!mf) err(1, "Can not open %s", infile); /* NOTREACHED*/ tmark[0].iov_len = sizeof (long); tmark[0].iov_base = (char *)&zero; while (1) { if ((i = fscanf(mf, "%s %d", name, &blksz))== EOF) exit(0); if (i != 2) { fprintf(stderr,"Help! Scanf didn't read 2 things (%d)\n", i); exit(1); } if (blksz <= 0 || blksz > MAXB) { fprintf(stderr, "Block size %u is invalid\n", blksz); exit(1); } recsz = blksz * 512; /* convert to bytes */ iovec[0].iov_len = sizeof (recsz); #ifdef pdp11 iovec[0].iov_base = (char *)&flipped; #else iovec[0].iov_base = (char *)&recsz; #endif iovec[1].iov_len = (int)recsz; iovec[1].iov_base = buf; iovec[2].iov_len = iovec[0].iov_len; iovec[2].iov_base = iovec[0].iov_base; if (strcmp(name, "*") == 0) { if (writev(mt, tmark, 1) < 0) warn(1, "writev of pseudo tapemark failed"); k++; continue; } fd = open(name, 0); if (fd < 0) err(1, "Can't open %s for reading", name); /* NOTREACHED */ printf("%s: block %d, file %d\n", name, j, k); /* * we pad the last record with nulls * (instead of the bell std. of padding with trash). * this allows you to access text files on the * tape without garbage at the end of the file. * (note that there is no record length associated * with tape files) */ while ((cnt=read(fd, buf, (int)recsz)) == (int)recsz) { j++; #ifdef pdp11 flipped = trl(recsz); #endif if (writev(mt, iovec, 3) < 0) err(1, "writev #1"); /* NOTREACHED */ } if (cnt > 0) { j++; bzero(buf + cnt, (int)recsz - cnt); #ifdef pdp11 flipped = trl(recsz); #endif if (writev(mt, iovec, 3) < 0) err(1, "writev #2"); /* NOTREACHED */ } close(fd); } /* * Write two tape marks to simulate EOT */ writev(mt, tmark, 1); writev(mt, tmark, 1); } long trl(l) long l; { union { long l; short s[2]; } foo; register short x; foo.l = l; x = foo.s[0]; foo.s[0] = foo.s[1]; foo.s[1] = x; return(foo.l); } void usage() { fprintf(stderr, "usage: makesimtape -o outfilefile -i inputfile\n"); exit(1); } Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA12877 for pups-liszt; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 16:00:16 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA12872 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 16:00:12 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id QAA09569; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 16:00:45 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803230500.QAA09569 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Where ISN'T the PUPS Archive (was building sim tapes) To: sms at moe.2bsd.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 16:00:45 +1100 (EST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <199803230438.UAA27736 at moe.2bsd.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at "Mar 22, 98 08:38:48 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Steven M. Schultz: > > From: "Ed G." > > > > > What you need to do is build a 'tape' (using 'makesimtape' if you > > > need to use Bob's emulator) from ALL of the files in Distributions/ucb/ > > > > I've looked everywhere I can think of on the PUPS site, but couldn't > > find 'makesimtape'. I couldn't find it among the source of Bob's > > emulator. Where can I get a copy of this program? > It's in /usr/src/sys/pdpstand. Look in file7.tar.gz from the 2.11 part > of the Distributions and it should be somewhere in there. Ah, I should point out to the readers of the mailing list: The PUPS Archive is NOT what you get by going to ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au as anonymous. Obviously, the archive has to be password protected, and so the anonymous ftp on Minnie isn't the Archive. I suspect Ed has been walking thru the anonymous area, which is why he could only find Bob Supnik's emulator. Anyway, Steven has provided a solution. Steven, could you put in #ifdefs for particular endian architectures??? Cheers, Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA16339 for pups-liszt; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:49:18 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from renoir.op.net (root at renoir.op.net [209.152.193.4]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA16334 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 13:49:11 +1100 (EST) Received: from goppelt.op.net (d-phlarc2-06.ppp.op.net [209.152.199.102]) by renoir.op.net (o1/$Revision: 1.15 $) with SMTP id VAA27961 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 21:49:03 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199803240249.VAA27961 at renoir.op.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Ed G." To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 21:49:02 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: What's magtape good for anyway? Reply-to: edgee at cyberpass.net X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > The program is short enough I'll include it here. It should compile > and run with minimal tweeking on any 'BSD'ish UNIX system. Thanks! I was just a plain old user during my college days, so I've never had much contact with magtape. But since magtape seems the easiest way to get data into and out of Bob Supnik's emulator, I've been fooling around with (simulated) tape a lot lately. To me (or maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about) it seems like magtape has a number of deficiencies: No filenames or directory structure: just an ordered series of bytes. Which would seem to imply that people must've used tar *a lot* to get these services. True? Padding of files to a multiple of the block size. Yuck! If I have a 312 byte file, I do not want to save it and then retrieve a (to my eyes anyway) different 512 byte file which has been padded with 200 bytes I didn't put there. Did this padding of files ever have any bad effects? So I was wondering, what *did* people use magtape for on these old Unix systems? Here are my guesses: Bad Old Days What we use now ================================ Archival storage (tape, CD-Roms, Zip drives, floppies) Application Software distribution (WWW, CD-Roms, ftp, email, floppies) System software distribution (CD-Roms, ftp) Backups (tape) Transfering a little data (Floppies, email). Transfering a lot of data (CD-Roms, Zip drives, ftp, tape) Have I left any significant use for tape out? Ed G. Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA16572 for pups-liszt; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:34:14 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16567 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:34:10 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA11927 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:34:54 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803240434.PAA11927 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: What's magtape good for anyway? To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:34:54 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803240249.VAA27961 at renoir.op.net> from "Ed G." at "Mar 23, 98 09:49:02 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Ed G.: > So I was wondering, what *did* people use magtape for on these old > Unix systems? Add another one: Xmas decorations. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA16598 for pups-liszt; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:44:36 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16593 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:44:32 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA11961 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:45:17 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803240445.PAA11961 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Moving PDP-11 disk images to disk To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:45:16 +1100 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk All, I've had a few people ask the question: I have a PDP-11, you have disk and tape images for old Unixes. How do get the images onto my actual disk/tape so I can install Unix? If anybody has sucessfully done: image -> tape -> install to disk -> working PDP-11 UNIX image -> install to disk -> working PDP-11 UNIX or any other variant, using any intermediate system (e.g KSERVE & RT-11), could they please drop me a note with some _details_ of what they did. I'd like to add this to the FAQ, as I suspect this is going to be a popular question as people receive their SCO UNIX licenses. Thanks in advance! Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA16670 for pups-liszt; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:59:01 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from alph02.triumf.ca (alph02.Triumf.CA [142.90.114.18]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA16665 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 15:58:52 +1100 (EST) Received: by alph02.triumf.ca; id AA14216; Mon, 23 Mar 1998 20:58:45 -0800 From: Tim Shoppa Message-Id: <9803240458.AA14216 at alph02.triumf.ca> Subject: Re: What's magtape good for anyway? To: edgee at cyberpass.net Date: Mon, 23 Mar 1998 20:58:44 -0800 (PST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <199803240249.VAA27961 at renoir.op.net> from "Ed G." at Mar 23, 98 09:49:02 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > To me (or maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about) it seems > like magtape has a number of deficiencies: > > No filenames or directory structure: just an ordered series of > bytes. Which would seem to imply that people must've used tar *a lot* > to get these services. True? Most (non-Unix) minicomputer OS's had built-in support for ANSI labeled files, which do have filenames (and header bytes to specify record sizes and number of records). Folks who used Unix either made their own labeled tape facility (e.g. Ultrix and OSF/1 "ltf") or just used "dd" and a lot of hard work. The lack of a record structure that is built-in to the Unix filesystem really makes things like tape transfers quite irritating. The rest of the world isn't always just a stream of bytes! Tim. (shoppa at triumf.ca) Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA17996 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 01:32:09 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from math.uwaterloo.ca (kcwellsc at math.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.216.42]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA17991 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 01:32:00 +1100 (EST) Received: (from kcwellsc at localhost) by math.uwaterloo.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA09618; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 09:31:49 -0500 (EST) From: Ken Wellsch Message-Id: <199803241431.JAA09618 at math.uwaterloo.ca> Subject: Re: What's magtape good for anyway? To: shoppa at alph02.triumf.ca (Tim Shoppa) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 09:31:48 -0500 (EST) Cc: edgee at cyberpass.net, pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <9803240458.AA14216 at alph02.triumf.ca> from "Tim Shoppa" at Mar 23, 98 08:58:44 pm Organization: University of Waterloo, Math Faculty Computing Facility X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Now far for me to be defending 9-track tapes on UNIX systems, and I'm the first to admit I've not encountered *all* the various methods used everywhere to write tapes, but it took no time for me years ago to write a program that would pull blocks off a tape (by trying to read the max limit block size) and recording the actual block size read. Oddly enough when matched with a program that read this "raw format" info, it was sure trivial to reproduce the tape... but I'm sure I'm missing something. Luckily on my UNIX systems I am unencumbered by someone else's potentially proprietary or undocumented "file structure" - both by the system and by the media. -- Ken | From owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Tue Mar 24 00:09:12 1998 | | Most (non-Unix) minicomputer OS's had built-in support for | ANSI labeled files, which do have filenames (and header bytes to | specify record sizes and number of records). Folks who used Unix | either made their own labeled tape facility (e.g. Ultrix and | OSF/1 "ltf") or just used "dd" and a lot of hard work. | | The lack of a record structure that is built-in to the Unix filesystem | really makes things like tape transfers quite irritating. The rest of | the world isn't always just a stream of bytes! | | Tim. (shoppa at triumf.ca) Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA19183 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 08:18:41 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA19178 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 08:18:36 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA00742 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 08:18:39 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803242118.IAA00742 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: More on Disk Images -> Disk To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 08:18:39 +1100 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk All, I spent some time last night adding stuff to my virtual tape server. I have to test it today, but essentially: Box with serial line PDP-11 with tape server -----------> uncompress & dd + disk_image.Z (bootable) In other words, you can boot to an uncompressing dd, and suck over any disk image, without actually requiring an operating system. With this approach, you obtain an existing disk image that will work, or you use one of the PDP-11 emulators to create a disk image with a Unix kernel configured for your system. You then compress it, and suck/splat it to your real PDP-11 via the serial line. Now, what I've currently got will cope with -b12 compressed files. Can someone tell me if it would be feasible to fit a gunzip into 64K?? Even if it could only cope with gzip -1 files. Cheers all, Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA19562 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:23:05 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA19557 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:23:01 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01449 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:23:05 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803250023.LAA01449 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Compress Disk Image Install works To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:23:05 +1100 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Well, I'm currently sucking a .Z compress RK05 disk image over a 9600 baud DL11 port; it seems to be working. Pity -b12 gives such low compression, but I guess any saving at 9600 baud is worth it. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA19586 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:30:26 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from moe.2bsd.com (0 at MOE.2BSD.COM [206.139.202.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA19579 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:30:21 +1100 (EST) Received: (from sms at localhost) by moe.2bsd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA14701 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 16:24:33 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 16:24:33 -0800 (PST) From: "Steven M. Schultz" Message-Id: <199803250024.QAA14701 at moe.2bsd.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: More on Disk Images -> Disk Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Warren - >From: Warren Toomey > Now, what I've currently got will cope with -b12 compressed files. Can > someone tell me if it would be feasible to fit a gunzip into 64K?? Even > if it could only cope with gzip -1 files. If my understanding of 'gzip' is right then the alogrithm works on 32kb blocks of data and the '-N' level has little to do with the memory consumption. Rather, as the -1, ... -9 level increases the amount of work that gzip puts into the compression increases (the difference between -6 and -9 is only a few percent in final output size but the length of time taken is quite a bit higher). Of concern would be getting the gzip sources to compile with a non-ANSI compiler on a non-32bit machine (sizeof (long) == sizeof(int) is an endemic assumption I wager). Well, ok - there is the worry that you will grow old waiting for it to compress something ;-) Gzip is a lot more cpu intensive than compress. Steven Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA19600 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:32:56 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA19595 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:32:52 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA01502 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:32:56 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803250032.LAA01502 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: More on Disk Images -> Disk To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 11:32:56 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803250024.QAA14701 at moe.2bsd.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at "Mar 24, 98 04:24:33 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Steven M. Schultz: > Warren - > > >From: Warren Toomey > > > Now, what I've currently got will cope with -b12 compressed files. Can > > someone tell me if it would be feasible to fit a gunzip into 64K?? Even > > if it could only cope with gzip -1 files. > > If my understanding of 'gzip' is right then the alogrithm works on > 32kb blocks of data and the '-N' level has little to do with the > memory consumption. Rather, as the -1, ... -9 level increases the > amount of work that gzip puts into the compression increases (the > difference between -6 and -9 is only a few percent in final output > size but the length of time taken is quite a bit higher). > > Of concern would be getting the gzip sources to compile with a non-ANSI > compiler on a non-32bit machine (sizeof (long) == sizeof(int) is an > endemic assumption I wager). Well, ok - there is the worry that > you will grow old waiting for it to compress something ;-) Gzip is a > lot more cpu intensive than compress. I'm only thinking of implementing gunzip on the PDP-11. I've got uncompress -b12 running standalone right now, but gunzip would be a big win: you gzip -9 on a 32-bit system (higher compression) and gunzip on the PDP-11. I just don't know if the gunzip would fit. Isn't there a gunzip for MS-DOS? Surely we could leverage something from it? Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA20196 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 14:36:27 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA20191 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 14:36:23 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA02126 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 14:36:28 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803250336.OAA02126 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: More on Disk Images -> Disk To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 14:36:28 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: from Peter Chubb at "Mar 25, 98 02:32:00 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Peter Chubb: > > In the Linux kernel, linux/lib/inflate.c and > arch/i386/boot/compressed/misc.c there's a set of gunzip routines that > could probably be adapted -- it runs in 16 bit mode (or ought > to). inflate.c is K&R C, so it should compile under V7; misc.c is > ANSI, but is small (just wrappers around gunzip) and in any case would > bneed changing to make a proper gunzip. > > I'll see what I can do. > Peter C. I think Steven described the main thing: will it run in 64K? I've popped some mail off to Jean-loup, who was involved with writing gzip. If we can get gunzip running in 64K on V7, I can then move it to a standalone program with minimal effort: the V7 standalone library provides open, close, read, write, printf, exit. Cheers! Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20401 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:31:45 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA20396 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:31:39 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA21400; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:01:36 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id PAA22891; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:01:34 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980325150133.00427 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:01:34 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au Cc: PDP Unix Preservation Subject: Re: More on Disk Images -> Disk References: <199803250336.OAA02126 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <199803250336.OAA02126 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>; from Warren Toomey on Wed, Mar 25, 1998 at 02:36:28PM +1100 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Wed, 25 March 1998 at 14:36:28 +1100, Warren Toomey wrote: > In article by Peter Chubb: >> >> In the Linux kernel, linux/lib/inflate.c and >> arch/i386/boot/compressed/misc.c there's a set of gunzip routines that >> could probably be adapted -- it runs in 16 bit mode (or ought >> to). inflate.c is K&R C, so it should compile under V7; misc.c is >> ANSI, but is small (just wrappers around gunzip) and in any case would >> bneed changing to make a proper gunzip. >> >> I'll see what I can do. >> Peter C. > > I think Steven described the main thing: will it run in 64K? I've popped > some mail off to Jean-loup, who was involved with writing gzip. I've done a little bit of playing around with gzip 1.2.4. It works on 16 bit MS-DOS platforms with a bit of tweaking, and I got all modules to compile under 2.11BSD. Unfortunately, I ended up with a couple of undefined references on linking, and I haven't had time to look at it in more detail. On the whole, though, it looks as if it could be made to work, maybe with a little tweaking. > If we can get gunzip running in 64K on V7, I can then move it to a > standalone program with minimal effort: the V7 standalone library > provides open, close, read, write, printf, exit. Should be doable. Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20463 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:49:13 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from renoir.op.net (root at renoir.op.net [209.152.193.4]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA20458 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:49:06 +1100 (EST) Received: from goppelt.op.net (d-phlarc2-01.ppp.op.net [209.152.199.97]) by renoir.op.net (o1/$Revision: 1.15 $) with SMTP id XAA23265; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 23:48:41 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199803250448.XAA23265 at renoir.op.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Ed G." To: Tim Shoppa , pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 23:48:33 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: What's magtape good for anyway? Reply-to: edgee at cyberpass.net In-reply-to: <9803240458.AA14216 at alph02.triumf.ca> References: <199803240249.VAA27961 at renoir.op.net> from "Ed G." at Mar 23, 98 09:49:02 pm X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > OSF/1 "ltf") or just used "dd" and a lot of hard work. Is 'dd' Unix's primary tool for dealing with tape drives? > The lack of a record structure that is built-in to the Unix filesystem > really makes things like tape transfers quite irritating. The rest of > the world isn't always just a stream of bytes! There are certain areas of Unix that don't seem quite "done" to me. Printing comes to mind (compare Unix benign neglect with Windows' universal printer driver). My understanding is that the Unix philosophy was to provide raw and cooked drivers for all the devices. That way you could have access to the hardware if you needed it, or cushy operating system services if you didn't. Only the cooked mode for the tape devices doesn't seem to do much more than the raw mode. Seems to me that they could have easily added file system services for tape drives to the kernel, just like they did for hard disks. Was support for tape another area that the Wizzards at Bell Labs neglected in favor of other more urgent needs? Ed Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id PAA20456 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:49:02 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from renoir.op.net (root at renoir.op.net [209.152.193.4]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA20451 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:48:56 +1100 (EST) Received: from goppelt.op.net (d-phlarc2-01.ppp.op.net [209.152.199.97]) by renoir.op.net (o1/$Revision: 1.15 $) with SMTP id XAA23272 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 23:48:46 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199803250448.XAA23272 at renoir.op.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Ed G." To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 23:48:33 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Bug in Supnik's emulator? Reply-to: edgee at cyberpass.net X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk I don't know whether this is a bug in the factor (1) program (which seems unlikely) or the emulator. Can someone try factoring numbers on a real pdp-11 and tell me what happens? On the emulator when I type in a number, factor prints out the prime factors, followed by an infinite series of 17s. So, for example factor 6 2 3 17 17 .... I might add that I had bc running on the emulator calculate pi to 30 places and the results were identical with gnu bc on my linux box, right down to the last digit. Very impressive. Ed Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20530 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:10:24 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from moe.2bsd.com (0 at MOE.2BSD.COM [206.139.202.200]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20521 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:10:16 +1100 (EST) Received: (from sms at localhost) by moe.2bsd.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id VAA16340 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:06:26 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 1998 21:06:26 -0800 (PST) From: "Steven M. Schultz" Message-Id: <199803250506.VAA16340 at moe.2bsd.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: More on Disk Images -> Disk Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Greg - > I've done a little bit of playing around with gzip 1.2.4. It works on Are gzip and gunzip comparable in size? I'm curious if the decompression is more 'address space' hungry than the act of compression (or vice-versa). > 16 bit MS-DOS platforms with a bit of tweaking, and I got all modules > to compile under 2.11BSD. Unfortunately, I ended up with a couple of > undefined references on linking, and I haven't had time to look at it Which symbols came up missing/undefined? > > If we can get gunzip running in 64K on V7, I can then move it to a > > Should be doable. It's actually 56kb or less - have to leave room for the stack and other data (strings, etc) Steven Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20562 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:24:15 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20557 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:24:10 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA21440; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:54:02 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id PAA23064; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:54:01 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980325155401.32216 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:54:01 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: edgee at cyberpass.net, pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: Bug in Supnik's emulator? References: <199803250448.XAA23272 at renoir.op.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <199803250448.XAA23272 at renoir.op.net>; from Ed G. on Tue, Mar 24, 1998 at 11:48:33PM -0400 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Tue, 24 March 1998 at 23:48:33 -0400, Ed G. wrote: > I don't know whether this is a bug in the factor (1) program (which > seems unlikely) or the emulator. Can someone try factoring numbers on > a real pdp-11 and tell me what happens? > > On the emulator when I type in a number, factor prints out the > prime factors, followed by an infinite series of 17s. So, for > example > > factor 6 > 2 > 3 > 17 > 17 > .... I would be very surprised if this was a bug in the emulator. In any case, I tried it on the begemot emulator, running 2.11BSD: [55] root--> /usr/games/factor 6 2 3 [56] root--> Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20581 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:29:08 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20576 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:29:03 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA21447; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:58:47 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id PAA23086; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:58:47 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980325155846.17376 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 15:58:46 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: "Steven M. Schultz" , pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: More on Disk Images -> Disk References: <199803250506.VAA16340 at moe.2bsd.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: <199803250506.VAA16340 at moe.2bsd.com>; from Steven M. Schultz on Tue, Mar 24, 1998 at 09:06:26PM -0800 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Tue, 24 March 1998 at 21:06:26 -0800, Steven M. Schultz wrote: > Greg - > >> I've done a little bit of playing around with gzip 1.2.4. It works on > > Are gzip and gunzip comparable in size? They're links to the same executable. > I'm curious if the > decompression is more 'address space' hungry than the act of > compression (or vice-versa). I haven't looked at the process images on systems on which they run. I suspect it wouldn't relate directly to 16 bit platforms anyway, since they have a slightly modified algorithm. >> 16 bit MS-DOS platforms with a bit of tweaking, and I got all modules >> to compile under 2.11BSD. Unfortunately, I ended up with a couple of >> undefined references on linking, and I haven't had time to look at it > > Which symbols came up missing/undefined? Various things defined in the program. They relate to the area in which I was tweaking. >>> If we can get gunzip running in 64K on V7, I can then move it to a >> >> Should be doable. > > It's actually 56kb or less - have to leave room for the stack and > other data (strings, etc) Yes, I understand. It may of course be that we need separate I and D. Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id QAA20659 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:48:07 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20654 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:48:00 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA21467 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:17:55 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id QAA23181; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:17:55 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980325161754.63486 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:17:54 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: PDP UNIX Preservation Society Subject: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk OK, I've found the problems with gzip, and they're not encouraging. It would appear that the undefined references are undefined because they refer to data which is too large. Here's the preprocessor output: uch inbuf[ 0x8000 + 64 ]; uch outbuf[ 16384 +2048 ]; ush d_buf[ 0x8000 ]; uch window[ 2*0x8000 ]; # 194 "gzip.c" ush prev[ 1<<(16-1)]; ush tab_prefix1[ 1<<(16-1)]; uch and ush are uchar and ushort respectively. Obviously there's no way of fitting this into a 64 kB address space. Possibly there's a way of shortening the buffers, but it would take more time than I have right now. Sorry for raising your hopes. There are other zip-compatible programs out there, such as unzip. Maybe somebody should look into them. Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA20686 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:00:29 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from psychvax.psych.usyd.edu.au (psychvax.psych.usyd.edu.au [129.78.83.1]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA20681 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:00:26 +1100 (EST) Received: (from johnh at localhost) by psychvax.psych.usyd.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA02807 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:00:21 +1100 Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:00:21 +1100 From: John Holden Message-Id: <199803250600.RAA02807 at psychvax.psych.usyd.edu.au> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: What's magtape good for anyway? Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk There were several tape handling programs that were standand from edition 5 onwards, including tap, tp, dtp, itp, tar and cpio. The only major tape standard around at the time (other than IBM) was ANSI, and several programs (not from Bell) were available to handle these. The ANSI tape structure was very inefficient with tape usage, since it used small record sizes and lots of tape marks. TAR did a better job (for Unix) and only lacked labels to name the tape. Putting tape filesystem handling into the kernel was definately against the original 'small is beautiful' philosophy. In any case, tape handling was very easy via the raw interface. As a side issue, Plan 9 has the ability to mount a tape as part of the namespace and only reads the file contents if the file is opened. Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA20787 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:44:22 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from suede.sw.oz.au (firewall-user at gw.softway.com.au [203.31.96.1]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA20782 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:44:12 +1100 (EST) Received: from bookworm.softway.com.au (root at bookworm.sw.oz.au [192.41.203.51]) by suede.sw.oz.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA25023; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:43:20 +1100 (EST) Received: by bookworm.softway.com.au (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0yHjuC-000FlVC; Wed, 25 Mar 98 17:43 +1000 Message-Id: Date: Wed, 25 Mar 98 17:43 +1000 From: Peter Chubb MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: Greg Lehey Cc: PDP UNIX Preservation Society Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple In-Reply-To: <19980325161754.63486 at freebie.lemis.com> References: <19980325161754.63486 at freebie.lemis.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.35 under Emacs 20.2.2 Comments: Hyperbole mail buttons accepted, v04.023. X-Face: .slVUC18R`%{j(W3ztQe~*ATzet;h`*Wv33MZ]*M,}9AP<`+C=U)c#NzI5vK!0^d#6:<_`a {#.<}~(T^aJ~]-.C'p~saJ7qZXP-$AY==]7,9?WVSH5sQ}g3,8j>u%@f$/Z6,WR7*E~BFY.Yjw,H6< F.cEDj2$S:kO2+-5<]afj at kC!:uw\(<>lVpk)lPZs+2(=?=D/TZPG+P9LDN#1RRUPxdX Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk >>>>> "Greg" == Greg Lehey writes: Greg> OK, I've found the problems with gzip, and they're not Greg> encouraging. It would appear that the undefined references are Greg> undefined because they refer to data which is too large. Here's Greg> the preprocessor output: Greg> uch inbuf[ 0x8000 + 64 ]; uch outbuf[ 16384 +2048 ]; ush Greg> d_buf[ 0x8000 ]; uch window[ 2*0x8000 ]; # 194 "gzip.c" You need to decrease the window size -- try setting it to 8k (instead of 32k) There should be a #define WSIZE 0x8000 somewhere. It may be worth playing with a decompress only version -- compression will take more space than decompression (you need two windows rather than one, for a start). inbuf can be smaller, too. Try 512 bytes to match the disc record size. Peter C Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id SAA20848 for pups-liszt; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 18:11:48 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from allegro.lemis.com (allegro.lemis.com [192.109.197.134]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA20843 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 18:11:43 +1100 (EST) Received: from freebie.lemis.com (freebie.lemis.com [192.109.197.137]) by allegro.lemis.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA21565; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:41:37 +1030 (CST) Received: (from grog at localhost) by freebie.lemis.com (8.8.8/8.8.7) id RAA23376; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:41:37 +1030 (CST) (envelope-from grog) Message-ID: <19980325174136.47943 at freebie.lemis.com> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:41:36 +1030 From: Greg Lehey To: Peter Chubb Cc: PDP UNIX Preservation Society Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple References: <19980325161754.63486 at freebie.lemis.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.89i In-Reply-To: ; from Peter Chubb on Wed, Mar 25, 1998 at 05:43:00PM +1000 WWW-Home-Page: http://www.lemis.com/~grog Organization: LEMIS, PO Box 460, Echunga SA 5153, Australia Phone: +61-8-8388-8286 Fax: +61-8-8388-8725 Mobile: +61-41-739-7062 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Wed, 25 March 1998 at 17:43:00 +1000, Peter Chubb wrote: >>>>>> "Greg" == Greg Lehey writes: > > Greg> OK, I've found the problems with gzip, and they're not > Greg> encouraging. It would appear that the undefined references are > Greg> undefined because they refer to data which is too large. Here's > Greg> the preprocessor output: > > Greg> uch inbuf[ 0x8000 + 64 ]; uch outbuf[ 16384 +2048 ]; ush > Greg> d_buf[ 0x8000 ]; uch window[ 2*0x8000 ]; # 194 "gzip.c" > > You need to decrease the window size -- try setting it to 8k (instead > of 32k) > > There should be a > #define WSIZE 0x8000 > somewhere. Correct. Unfortunately, it's not as simple as that. Here's the definition: #ifndef WSIZE # define WSIZE 0x8000 /* window size--must be a power of two, and */ #endif /* at least 32K for zip's deflate method */ > It may be worth playing with a decompress only version -- compression > will take more space than decompression (you need two windows rather > than one, for a start). Yes, that was really what I was thinking of doing with unzip, rather than excising the unzip part from gunzip. > inbuf can be smaller, too. Try 512 bytes to match the disc record > size. Sure, once I get into serious modifications I can try a number of things. The trouble is, I just don't have the time. I thought it was worth 15 minutes to see what it would do, and the first attempts looked encouraging. Unfortunately, the second attempts didn't :-( Greg Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id AAA21748 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 00:20:28 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from serv1.is4.u-net.net (hme0.serv1.is4.u-net.net [195.102.240.153]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA21743 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 00:20:20 +1100 (EST) Received: from indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk [195.102.197.76] by serv1.is4.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 1.73 #1) id 0yHq5u-0005Qh-00; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:19:50 +0000 Received: by indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk (940816.SGI.8.6.9/980207.PNT) for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au id NAA14184; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:12:01 GMT Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:12:01 GMT From: pete@dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) X-Beware: experimental sendmail.cf 940816.SGI.8.6.9/980207.PNT Message-Id: <9803251312.ZM14182 at indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: Greg Lehey "Re: Bug in Supnik's emulator?" (Mar 25, 15:54) References: <199803250448.XAA23272 at renoir.op.net> <19980325155401.32216 at freebie.lemis.com> Reply-To: pete at dunnington.u-net.com X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail) To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: Bug in Supnik's emulator? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk On Mar 25, 15:54, Greg Lehey wrote: > Subject: Re: Bug in Supnik's emulator? > On Tue, 24 March 1998 at 23:48:33 -0400, Ed G. wrote: > > I don't know whether this is a bug in the factor (1) program (which > > seems unlikely) or the emulator. Can someone try factoring numbers on > > a real pdp-11 and tell me what happens? > > > > On the emulator when I type in a number, factor prints out the > > prime factors, followed by an infinite series of 17s. > I would be very surprised if this was a bug in the emulator. > In any case, I tried it on the begemot emulator, running 2.11BSD: > > [55] root--> /usr/games/factor 6 > 2 > 3 > [56] root--> On my PDP-11/23 running 7th Edition, factor works fine: $ factor 6 2 3 $ -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA21903 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 01:33:32 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA21898 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 01:33:25 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id JAA15854; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:33:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA22453; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:33:18 -0500 Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:33:18 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803251433.AA22453 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk I find this situation funny as in the 8080/z80 (8 bit data 64kbyte address space) world there is LZH, Crunch, ARK, ARC, LBR... compressors and decompressors. Atleast a handful are written in C. Also PDP11 address space (no I&D) is 32kW... Instructions are always words so code can eat up a fair portion of the 64k bytes. Allison Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id BAA21915 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 01:33:52 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA21910 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 01:33:47 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id JAA15971; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:33:42 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA22737; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:33:41 -0500 Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 09:33:41 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803251433.AA22737 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: What's magtape good for anyway? Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 03:04:37 +1100 (EST) Received: from cara.aiai.ed.ac.uk (cara.aiai.ed.ac.uk [129.215.105.50]) by aiai.ed.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA10436; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:04:00 GMT Received: (tfb at localhost) by cara.aiai.ed.ac.uk (8.6.13/8.6.12) id QAA13855; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:03:59 GMT Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:03:59 GMT Message-Id: <199803251603.QAA13855 at cara.aiai.ed.ac.uk> From: Tim Bradshaw MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au Cc: haba at pdc.kth.se (Harald Barth), pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Subject: Re: What's TENIX?? In-Reply-To: <199803190227.NAA04067 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> References: <199803190143.CAA28649 at pancake.pdc.kth.se> <199803190227.NAA04067 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> X-Mailer: VM 6.32 under 19.14 XEmacs Lucid Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk * Warren Toomey wrote: > In article by Harald Barth: >> One PDP-11 I have (and don't quite understand the hardware of) calls itself >> Tektronix 8562. In that box (43x60x30cm) you find >> LSI-11/73 (only part made by DIGITAL) >> Controller with >> 8'' floppy >> 40Mb MFM disk with TENIX (binary of some kind of V7 Unix) >> Controller with >> 10 ttys > Hmm, I haven't heard of Tenix before. I might punt this onto the > mailing list to see if anybody can identify it. > Any ideas, people?? I remember this. Somewhere I worked as a student there was a tektronix box which supported some kind of microcontroller development system and/or and in-circuit emulator (for things like 8048 / 8051, though I think it had personality modules). It was a box which was known to be a PDP11, and had a couple of tek terminals on it, probably another box with stuff to support the emulators/PROM blowers & stuff, and it ran Tenix. I had an account on it, but all I knew then was that it was some kind of Unix. V7 sounds right -- perhaps it was Tek's OEMd version of this, with (I guess) support for whatever HW they had + some kind of development environment / x-assemblers & so on. The box just might still exist somewhere -- I made an attempt to get hold of it after I realised that PDP11s were cool, but it was hard because it had been worth a lot of money once and the accountants went all funny about it. --tim Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA22240 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 03:30:47 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from toes.its.uwlax.edu (toes.its.uwlax.edu [138.49.128.183]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA22235 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 03:30:41 +1100 (EST) Received: by toes.its.uwlax.edu; id AA01056; NX5.67e/42; Wed, 25 Mar 98 10:32:20 -0600 Message-Id: <9803251632.AA01056 at toes.its.uwlax.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2.RR) From: Milo Velimirovic Date: Wed, 25 Mar 98 10:32:14 -0600 To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: oddball versions of Unix Reply-To: Milo_Velimirovic at uwlax.edu Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hey, does anyone know if LSX is coverd by the SCO source license? And where to get sources for it? It was a version of Unix that I played with 15 years ago on an LSI-11 system with dual AED floppy drives... it was nice in that it woudl run on a pdp11 that was lacking memory mangaement i.e. a 28kWord machine.... Shake those gray cells friends and let's see if we can scare this one out of the woodwork... it would make a lot of ancient pdp11's much more useful. Regards, Milo --- Milo Velimirovic Unix Computer Network Administrator (608) 785-8030 Information Technology Services -- Network Services University of Wisconsin - La Crosse La Crosse, Wisconsin 54601 USA 43 48 05 N 91 14 22 W Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id DAA22307 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 03:52:27 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from pancake.pdc.kth.se (pancake.pdc.kth.se [130.237.221.163]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA22302 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 03:52:20 +1100 (EST) Received: from pancake.pdc.kth.se (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pancake.pdc.kth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA23470; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:52:00 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199803251652.RAA23470 at pancake.pdc.kth.se> To: tfb at aiai.ed.ac.uk Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: What's TENIX?? From: Harald Barth In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:03:59 GMT" References: <199803251603.QAA13855 at cara.aiai.ed.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Mew version 1.54 on Emacs 20.2.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 17:51:55 +0100 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk > The box just might still exist somewhere -- I made an attempt to > get hold of it after I realised that PDP11s were cool, but it was hard > because it had been worth a lot of money once and the accountants went > all funny about it. Oh yes, very common scenario. Booted just for fun, see below. Harald. Welcome to Tnix Version 2.1 (rev b) on an 11/73 We recommend that you check the file system after TNIX has been restarted. ( Checking the file system takes about 5 minutes for a minimum system of files, longer for more files. ) Do you want to check the file system at this time? Enter y for yes, n for no, or question mark for more information : y The standard TNIX syschk command reports any problems with the file system, but does not fix them. The Standalone Utilities syschk command reports any problems with the file system, and queries you on how to fix the problems. Which file system checker? 1) standard TNIX syschk (reports problems) 2) Standalone Utilities syschk (fixes problems) Please enter a number: 1 checking /dev/rhd0: ...checking i-nodes and directory entries... ...checking tree structure... ...checking free list... free list is ok. rebuild free list? (y or n): n 75349 total blocks in filesystem 0 bad blocks (0 percent) 44112 free blocks (58 percent) 22491 free i-nodes (89 percent) TNIX shows the current date and time as Sat Mar 22 23:31:31 MET 1997 If date and time is already correct, press RETURN. Otherwise, you need to reenter the date. The format for a date entry is [dd-mmm-yy] hh:mm[:ss] Example: 22-jun-83 14:20 Please enter correct date: 25-mar-98 02:34 Wed Mar 25 02:34:51 MET 1998 Do you want to remain single user? (Enter y for yes, n for no, or question mark for more information) : y Now entering single-user mode. To exit from single-user mode, enter CTRL-D. # Do you want to remain single user? (Enter y for yes, n for no, or question mark for more information) : n When you see the login prompt, you can enter your login name, "manager", or "root". login: your login name Logs you into your personal account. The account must already have been created by the system manager. login: manager Displays information about common system manager tasks, and information about the "root" account. login: root Logs you in to the "root" account -- the account used to maintain system files. As root, you have full access to all files on the system, and no restrictions as to what you can do with the files. We recommend that you limit access to the root account, and that you assign a password to the root account. login: root Password: ******************************************************************************** * * * WELCOME TO TEKTRONIX * * * ******************************************************************************** USERS ON THE SYSTEM: ASSAR HABA MHO IF YOU HAVE ANY PROBLEMS, DO NOT ASK HABA IF HE CAN HELP YOU # ls -ltr total 499 -rw------- 1 root 58740 Apr 10 1984 tnix.old -rw------- 1 root 9852 Apr 10 1984 boot drwxr-xr-x11 bin 176 Apr 10 1984 tek -rw------- 1 root 57584 Apr 10 1984 TNIX.old -rw------- 1 root 58740 Jun 20 1985 tnix -rwx--x--x 1 root 57584 Nov 9 1985 TNIX drwxr-xr-x 2 bin 736 Sep 23 1986 lib -rw-r--r-- 1 root 1024 Oct 1 1986 .hp_memory drwxrwxrwx 2 root 176 Jan 30 1987 lost+found drwxr-xr-x 5 root 80 Sep 1 1992 home drwxr-xr-x 7 bin 4336 Sep 1 1992 bin drwxr-xr-x 2 root 928 Nov 5 1992 dev drwxr-xr-x 2 root 80 Nov 5 1992 mnt drwxrwxr-x 4 root 128 Apr 19 1993 vaxboot drwxr-xr-x 4 bin 480 Mar 25 02:36 etc drwxr-xr-x25 bin 416 Mar 25 02:36 usr drwxrwxrwx 2 root 64 Mar 25 02:36 tmp # shutdown Wait for the message on the system console saying it is all right to halt the system. System may now be safely powered down or rebooted Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id GAA22899 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 06:45:51 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from toes.its.uwlax.edu (toes.its.uwlax.edu [138.49.128.183]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA22894 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 06:45:44 +1100 (EST) Received: by toes.its.uwlax.edu; id AA01217; NX5.67e/42; Wed, 25 Mar 98 13:47:26 -0600 Message-Id: <9803251947.AA01217 at toes.its.uwlax.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3 v118.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Received: by NeXT.Mailer (1.118.2.RR) From: Milo Velimirovic Date: Wed, 25 Mar 98 13:47:24 -0600 To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Subject: Follow-up: oddball versions of Unix Reply-To: Milo_Velimirovic at uwlax.edu References: <9803251632.AA01056 at toes.its.uwlax.edu> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au id GAA22895 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hi, The system I referred to below was described in: Lycklama, H. UNIX on a Microprocessor, Bell System Technical Journal, Vol. 57, No. 6, July-August 1978, pp. 2087-2101 --Milo Begin forwarded message: > >X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f >From: Milo Velimirovic >Date: Wed, 25 Mar 98 10:32:14 -0600 >To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au >Subject: oddball versions of Unix >Reply-To: Milo_Velimirovic at uwlax.edu >Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au > >Hey, > >does anyone know if LSX is coverd by the SCO source license? And where to >get sources for it? It was a version of Unix that I played with 15 years ago >on an LSI-11 system with dual AED floppy drives... it was nice in that it >woudl run on a pdp11 that was lacking memory mangaement i.e. a 28kWord >machine.... > >Shake those gray cells friends and let's see if we can scare this one out of >the woodwork... it would make a lot of ancient pdp11's much more useful. > > >Regards, >Milo >--- >Milo Velimirovic >Unix Computer Network Administrator (608) 785-8030 >Information Technology Services -- Network Services >University of Wisconsin - La Crosse >La Crosse, Wisconsin 54601 USA 43 48 05 N 91 14 22 W > > Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id HAA23043 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:33:40 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA23038 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:33:37 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id HAA03043 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:33:46 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803252033.HAA03043 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 07:33:46 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <199803251433.AA22453 at world.std.com> from Allison J Parent at "Mar 25, 98 09:33:18 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Allison J Parent: > I find this situation funny as in the 8080/z80 (8 bit data 64kbyte address > space) world there is LZH, Crunch, ARK, ARC, LBR... compressors and > decompressors. Atleast a handful are written in C. > > Also PDP11 address space (no I&D) is 32kW... Instructions are always > words so code can eat up a fair portion of the 64k bytes. Well, I've got uncompress working, but I thought having gunzip would be good as it gives better compression results. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA23256 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:52:38 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from mercury.Sun.COM (mercury.Sun.COM [192.9.25.1]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA23251 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:52:30 +1100 (EST) Received: from Corp.Sun.COM ([129.145.35.78]) by mercury.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/mail.byaddr) with SMTP id NAA24729 for ; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:51:35 -0800 Received: from rainbow.Corp.Sun.COM by Corp.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-5.3) id NAA20782; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:51:11 -0800 Received: from zatch by rainbow.Corp.Sun.COM (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA10104; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:50:51 -0800 Message-Id: <199803252150.NAA10104 at rainbow.Corp.Sun.COM> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:50:07 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Drake Reply-To: Chris Drake Subject: Re: Follow-up: oddball versions of Unix To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: 4vG0cZlENp2tqeGyAF8ZKA== X-Mailer: dtmail 1.2.0 CDE Version 1.2 SunOS 5.6 sun4u sparc Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk >UNIX on a Microprocessor I did use something called "Mini-Unix" on a PDP-11/10, which was a single- address space machine. It worked, sort of, but had some problems - like, pipes were implemented as temporary files, so the shell broke things apart into individual sequential commands... and printing with lpr generally froze the machine up. There may have been later and better versions, though. (This was around 76/77, as I recall). - Chris Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA23267 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:54:39 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from europe.std.com (europe.std.com [199.172.62.20]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA23262 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:54:25 +1100 (EST) Received: from world.std.com by europe.std.com (8.7.6/BZS-8-1.0) id QAA05643; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:54:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by world.std.com (TheWorld/Spike-2.0) id AA26144; Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:54:11 -0500 Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 16:54:11 -0500 From: allisonp@world.std.com (Allison J Parent) Message-Id: <199803252154.AA26144 at world.std.com> To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:55:27 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA03217 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:55:36 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803252155.IAA03217 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: Follow-up: oddball versions of Unix Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 08:55:36 +1100 (EST) Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <199803252150.NAA10104 at rainbow.Corp.Sun.COM> from Chris Drake at "Mar 25, 98 01:50:07 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Chris Drake: > >UNIX on a Microprocessor > > I did use something called "Mini-Unix" on a PDP-11/10, which was a single- > address space machine. It worked, sort of, but had some problems - like, > pipes were implemented as temporary files, so the shell broke things apart > into individual sequential commands... and printing with lpr generally > froze the machine up. There may have been later and better versions, though. > (This was around 76/77, as I recall). Yep, it's in the archive! Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23322 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:04:52 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-10.mail.demon.net [193.195.0.154]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA23317 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:04:44 +1100 (EST) Received: from falstaf.demon.co.uk ([158.152.152.109]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1007927; 25 Mar 98 21:57 GMT Message-ID: <0S+aPCA11XG1EwK5 at falstaf.demon.co.uk> Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 21:56:05 +0000 To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au Cc: PDP Unix Preservation From: Robin Birch Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple In-Reply-To: <199803252033.HAA03043 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike (32) Version 3.05 Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In message <199803252033.HAA03043 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au>, Warren Toomey writes >In article by Allison J Parent: >> I find this situation funny as in the 8080/z80 (8 bit data 64kbyte address >> space) world there is LZH, Crunch, ARK, ARC, LBR... compressors and >> decompressors. Atleast a handful are written in C. >> >> Also PDP11 address space (no I&D) is 32kW... Instructions are always >> words so code can eat up a fair portion of the 64k bytes. > >Well, I've got uncompress working, but I thought having gunzip would >be good as it gives better compression results. > > Warren I looked at this several years ago and gave up at the save point as Warren. I looked at compress using 16 bits and hit the same sort of constructs. After a bit of thinking I believe there may be a way round it but at the time I didn't know the algorithms used in compress or gzip so didn't try playing. The problem is that the compression algorithm needs a 64k space to do all of its sums in, don't ask me why, if someone could tell us the algorithm them I would understand a lot better. These are defined as 64k address spaces which the data page isn't holding cos they don't fit. If you write a virtual mem system then this will work. This causes problems in the standalone world obviously but steve wrote a vm lookalike for 2.11 that uses files, yes a lump of real mem aka the partition concept with movable windows in RSX would be nice but we can't have everything, but compress and maybe gip should be able to be cooked into using such a system for vm. This would be slow but what are we after?, an all singing all dancing system or something that would work in the background whilst we get a beer and wait for the system to install?. Cheers Robin Robin Birch robin at falstaf.demon.co.uk M1ASU/2E0ARJ Old computers and radios always welcome Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23342 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:07:50 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23337 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:07:46 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA03305 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:07:35 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803252207.JAA03305 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: gzip on PDP-11: not so simple To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:07:35 +1100 (EST) In-Reply-To: <0S+aPCA11XG1EwK5 at falstaf.demon.co.uk> from Robin Birch at "Mar 25, 98 09:56:05 pm" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Robin Birch: [ not being able to run gzip on a PDP-11 ] > This would be slow but > what are we after?, an all singing all dancing system or something that > would work in the background whilst we get a beer and wait for the > system to install?. You're right I think. At least compress -b12 works, and as you say, a bit of extra wait isn't going to hurt too much. Peter Chubb seems interested in fitting gunzip into 64K. I'll see how he goes with it. Thanks all for your comments, Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA23554 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:29:54 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23549 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:29:50 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA03395 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:30:00 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803252230.JAA03395 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Available: tool to write disk images to PDP-11 To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 09:30:00 +1100 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Ok, I debugged the thing yesterday, it works well. If you want to write a PDP-11 disk image to a real PDP-11, you might like to look in: ftp://minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au/pub/PDP-11/Vtserver and at the file zcat.README there. Current disk and tapes supported: hp: RP04, RP05 and RP06 disks. rp: RP03 disks. rk: RK05 disks. rl: RL01 and RL02 disks. ht: TU16 or TE16 tape drive. tm: TU10 tape drive. vt: The Virtual Tape drive. You can download from any tape to any disk. The Virtual Tape drive allows you to download the image over a KL11 at 9,600 baud. Any type of disk image can be downloaded, not just Unix ones. You will need compress(1). And a bit of patience. Let's hope someone tries this out! Ciao, Warren P.S I plan on migrating to the 2.11BSD standalone stuff, which supports more tape drives and disk drives. Sometime. Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA24607 for pups-liszt; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 14:21:30 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from suede.sw.oz.au (firewall-user at gw.softway.com.au [203.31.96.1]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA24602 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 14:21:23 +1100 (EST) Received: from bookworm.softway.com.au (root at bookworm.sw.oz.au [192.41.203.51]) by suede.sw.oz.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA14866 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 14:21:17 +1100 (EST) Received: by bookworm.softway.com.au (Smail3.1.29.1 #4) id m0yI3EB-000FlbC; Thu, 26 Mar 98 14:21 +1000 Message-Id: Date: Thu, 26 Mar 98 14:21 +1000 From: Peter Chubb To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Subject: Progress on zcat Comments: Hyperbole mail buttons accepted, v04.023. X-Face: .slVUC18R`%{j(W3ztQe~*ATzet;h`*Wv33MZ]*M,}9AP<`+C=U)c#NzI5vK!0^d#6:<_`a {#.<}~(T^aJ~]-.C'p~saJ7qZXP-$AY==]7,9?WVSH5sQ}g3,8j>u%@f$/Z6,WR7*E~BFY.Yjw,H6< F.cEDj2$S:kO2+-5<]afj at kC!:uw\(<>lVpk)lPZs+2(=?=D/TZPG+P9LDN#1RRUPxdX Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Well... my cut-down zcat now works under Linux, and compiles and links cleanly under v7 on the simulator. But the semantics are wrong! Big problem is the lack of unsigned char and unsigned long types. I'm gradually going through and finding places where left shifts, or sign extensions are happening, and masking them explicitly. I'm almost sure that at UNSW we had a C compiler on Unix V7 that had an unsigned long data type... Anyway, there's progress. And if it all goes OK, then on machines that have separate I&D spaces, the resulting zcat will be compatible with gzip everywhere. Peter C Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id OAA29445 for pups-liszt; Fri, 27 Mar 1998 14:51:52 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from renoir.op.net (root at renoir.op.net [209.152.193.4]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA29440 for ; Fri, 27 Mar 1998 14:51:43 +1100 (EST) Received: from goppelt.op.net (d-phlarc1-04.ppp.op.net [209.152.199.68]) by renoir.op.net (o1/$Revision: 1.15 $) with SMTP id WAA01451 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 1998 22:51:32 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199803270351.WAA01451 at renoir.op.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Ed G." To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 22:51:31 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Bug in Bob Supnik's Emulator! Reply-to: edgee at cyberpass.net X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk As you know, I wrote this list recently about a bug in Bob Supnik's emulator which manifests when running factor (1). I've had a chance to do some further research on this, and it seems to me that the bug is definitely in Supnik's emulator. What do you all think? Am I onto something? If so, what part of Supnik's code is probably to blame? Here's what I've learned so far: 1. factor on Supnik's emulator fails most of the time (see below for examples). 2. factor works fine on Ersatz-11 2. On the off-chance that I munged the disk images and somehow corrupted factor, I reextracted virgin images from the tar ball. factor still fails while running on Supnik's emulator. 3. Peter Turnbull wrote me that factor running on under uv7 on his PDP-11/23 runs the test case 'factor 6' without error. Here's what factor does on Supnik's emulator for a variety of values: factor 6 2 3 17 17 etc. factor 257 263 263 etc. factor 263 269 269 etc. factor 1009 (works correctly) 1009 Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id RAA29824 for pups-liszt; Fri, 27 Mar 1998 17:28:35 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from serv1.is4.u-net.net (hme0.serv1.is4.u-net.net [195.102.240.153]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA29819 for ; Fri, 27 Mar 1998 17:28:24 +1100 (EST) Received: from indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk [195.102.197.88] by serv1.is4.u-net.net with smtp (Exim 1.73 #1) id 0yIScK-0003gU-00; Fri, 27 Mar 1998 06:27:52 +0000 Received: by indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk (940816.SGI.8.6.9/980207.PNT) id GAA27285; Fri, 27 Mar 1998 06:28:52 GMT Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1998 06:28:52 GMT From: pete@dunnington.u-net.com (Pete Turnbull) X-Beware: experimental sendmail.cf 940816.SGI.8.6.9/980207.PNT Message-Id: <9803270628.ZM27283 at indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: "Ed G." "Bug in Bob Supnik's Emulator!" (Mar 26, 22:51) References: <199803270351.WAA01451 at renoir.op.net> Reply-To: pete at dunnington.u-net.com X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.2 10apr95 MediaMail) To: edgee at cyberpass.net Subject: Re: Bug in Bob Supnik's Emulator! Cc: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk Hi, Ed. > I've had a chance to do some further research on this, and it seems > to me that the bug is definitely in Supnik's emulator. What do you > all think? Am I onto something? If so, what part of Supnik's code > is probably to blame? Interesting... did you use the same binary on both Bob's emulator and Ersatz? > 3. Peter Turnbull wrote me that factor running on under uv7 on his > PDP-11/23 runs the test case 'factor 6' without error. Ah, I meant to mail that to the list. No matter, it got to where it was most needed, obviously :-) I'd suggest you recompile factor if you have the source, but add some debugging. If you can't do that, you could try running it with adb (the debugger, man 1 adb for details). -- Pete Peter Turnbull Dept. of Computer Science University of York Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id LAA02487 for pups-liszt; Sat, 28 Mar 1998 11:50:54 +1100 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA02482 for ; Sat, 28 Mar 1998 11:50:48 +1100 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id LAA05410; Sat, 28 Mar 1998 11:50:54 +1100 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803280050.LAA05410 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Re: Bug in Bob Supnik's Emulator! To: pete at dunnington.u-net.com Date: Sat, 28 Mar 1998 11:50:54 +1100 (EST) Cc: edgee at cyberpass.net, pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au In-Reply-To: <9803270628.ZM27283 at indy.dunnington.york.ac.uk> from Pete Turnbull at "Mar 27, 98 06:28:52 am" Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk In article by Pete Turnbull: > Hi, Ed. > > > I've had a chance to do some further research on this, and it seems > > to me that the bug is definitely in Supnik's emulator. What do you > > all think? Am I onto something? If so, what part of Supnik's code > > is probably to blame? > > Interesting... did you use the same binary on both Bob's emulator and Ersatz? > > > 3. Peter Turnbull wrote me that factor running on under uv7 on his > > PDP-11/23 runs the test case 'factor 6' without error. > I'd suggest you recompile factor if you have the source, but add some > debugging. If you can't do that, you could try running it with adb (the > debugger, man 1 adb for details). I suspect the FP emulation in Bob's Emulator, so it might be worth watching the floating point values in the program. Bob mailed me during the week, and I sent him a virgin binary of factor so he could verify that there is a bug. Warren Received: (from major at localhost) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA05778 for pups-liszt; Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:52:20 +1000 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au: major set sender to owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au using -f Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA05773 for ; Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:52:16 +1000 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA06132 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:52:45 +1000 (EST) Received: from henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (henry.cs.adfa.oz.au [131.236.21.158]) by minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA05734 for ; Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:41:06 +1000 (EST) Received: (from wkt at localhost) by henry.cs.adfa.oz.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA06110 for pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au; Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:41:33 +1000 (EST) From: Warren Toomey Message-Id: <199803282341.JAA06110 at henry.cs.adfa.oz.au> Subject: Digest of PUPS mail available To: pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au (PDP Unix Preservation) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 1998 09:41:33 +1000 (EST) Reply-To: wkt at cs.adfa.oz.au X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL22 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au Precedence: bulk The PUPS mailing list seems to be getting busier. For those `lurkers' who want to follow the list, but don't want to be pestered by incoming email every 10 minutes, I've set up a digest form of the list. The digest will be sent out every Monday and Thursday, or if the incoming e-mail exceeds 40K in total. To get the digest version, and to unsubscribe from the normal list, send e-mail to majordomo at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au with the commands in the message body: subscribe pups-digest unsubscribe pups You still need to send mail to pups at minnie.cs.adfa.oz.au for it to go to the PUPS list and to be included in the digest. Warren