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[64.90.62.162]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.17.2); Thu, 27 Jun 2019 00:22:11 +0000 X-MC-Relay: Neutral X-MailChannels-SenderId: dreamhost|x-authsender|cmhanson@eschatologist.net X-MailChannels-Auth-Id: dreamhost X-Trade-Lettuce: 6ac1e76f582f27f8_1561594931810_3863811362 X-MC-Loop-Signature: 1561594931810:3471308178 X-MC-Ingress-Time: 1561594931810 Received: from pdx1-sub0-mail-a53.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pdx1-sub0-mail-a53.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14BDA83F1C; Wed, 26 Jun 2019 17:22:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed; d=eschatologist.net; h= content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; s= eschatologist.net; bh=VugC1/Pn6deXW3FL2qHTF3VFSmE=; b=w9+0wq3qh6 lzjOkcB+YOy5YrxN9NX6kYhdKL7CJAL9ATjflLF46asf3ZtLlDEXNN6qA0HmpP2K +WG30EAfUVaPu9L2WahTS1RWSajwlknYDd6em6r9T7dN8oGfQKAhKtLC6riRRoI0 irWwUcSjr95feWJkvYhD5vHd1r8zv20OU= Received: from [17.212.150.151] (unknown [17.212.150.151]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: cmhanson@eschatologist.net) by pdx1-sub0-mail-a53.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 378FD83F19; Wed, 26 Jun 2019 17:22:06 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\)) X-DH-BACKEND: pdx1-sub0-mail-a53 From: Chris Hanson In-Reply-To: <20190626202125.GA1206@mcvoy.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2019 17:22:05 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <200E87FD-9B9C-4AEC-B3E1-95C9C84068A4@eschatologist.net> References: <20190625000630.GA7655@mcvoy.com> <20190625003120.GA28608@mit.edu> <20190625004523.GB7655@mcvoy.com> <20190626024503.GA43970@wopr> <20190626025646.GR925@mcvoy.com> <20190626151143.GC3116@mit.edu> <20190626174431.GT925@mcvoy.com> <34DB62C2-7D8C-468B-99E1-CA035C9141A2@eschatologist.net> <04827B96-5B5E-473E-A95F-67C4292B69D1@cogs.com> <20190626202125.GA1206@mcvoy.com> To: Larry McVoy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11) X-VR-OUT-STATUS: OK X-VR-OUT-SCORE: -100 X-VR-OUT-SPAMCAUSE: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeduvddrudejgdefhecutefuodetggdotefrodftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucggtfgfnhhsuhgsshgtrhhisggvpdfftffgtefojffquffvnecuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenucfjughrpegtggfuhfgjfffgkfhfvffosehtqhhmtdhhtdejnecuhfhrohhmpeevhhhrihhsucfjrghnshhonhcuoegtmhhhrghnshhonhesvghstghhrghtohhlohhgihhsthdrnhgvtheqnecukfhppedujedrvdduvddrudehtddrudehudenucfrrghrrghmpehmohguvgepshhmthhppdhhvghloheplgdujedrvdduvddrudehtddrudehudgnpdhinhgvthepudejrddvuddvrdduhedtrdduhedupdhrvghtuhhrnhdqphgrthhhpeevhhhrihhsucfjrghnshhonhcuoegtmhhhrghnshhonhesvghstghhrghtohhlohhgihhsthdrnhgvtheqpdhmrghilhhfrhhomheptghmhhgrnhhsohhnsegvshgthhgrthholhhoghhishhtrdhnvghtpdhnrhgtphhtthhopehtuhhhshesmhhinhhnihgvrdhtuhhhshdrohhrghenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt Subject: Re: [TUHS] CMU Mach sources? X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: Tuhs Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" On Jun 26, 2019, at 1:21 PM, Larry McVoy wrote: >=20 > I also agree with whoever said the Mach guys were trying out all sorts > of different ideas, that's cool. What's not cool is that when those > ideas didn't pan out they left in all the substrate that had proven to > be not needed. It seems like you=E2=80=99re still missing the point. All the different ideas weren=E2=80=99t implemented by =E2=80=9Cthe Mach = [people] trying all sorts of different ideas=E2=80=9D in-tree, they were = implemented by a variety of researchers *atop* the large set of = abstractions and layers Mach provided. All the substrate *wasn=E2=80=99t* proven to be not needed, if anything = it was proven to be very useful in performing OS research experiments = without having to do a lot of work on the substrate itself. I also read a lot of the Mach code very early in my career and found it = pretty comprehensible. -- Chris