From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 5d84a7f5 for ; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 01:46:01 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id BCAD0A22EF; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 11:45:59 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D034A2162; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 11:45:31 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id A4960A2162; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 10:58:01 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mcvoy.com (mcvoy.com [192.169.23.250]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 487B5A2152 for ; Wed, 31 Oct 2018 10:58:01 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mcvoy.com (Postfix, from userid 3546) id 7C5AC35E0E8; Tue, 30 Oct 2018 17:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2018 17:58:00 -0700 From: Larry McVoy To: Steve Johnson Message-ID: <20181031005800.GA5670@mcvoy.com> References: <5DB0D670-6B65-4558-9CCE-7F80FE5B62BA@kdbarto.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Subject: Re: [TUHS] Archaic yacc C grammar X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" I'm coming into this late (and tired, been working on my water system and the carbs on my boat all day) but I *loved* the single namespace for all structure fields. Instead of p->size we have p->st_size and I instantly know that p is a struct stat pointer. I get that it doesn't scale but man, oh man, do I love the early Unix data structures that had one namespace. I kinda wish you hadn't fixed that Steve. What was the push that made you fix it? On Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 03:01:55PM -0700, Steve Johnson wrote: > The closest I came was when we went from a single namespace for all > structure names to a namespace for each structure, and references that > were checked using the pointer type of the structure pointer. > My code was a nightmare, and some of the old Unix code was at least a > bad dream.???? I had to start out pretending to have a single > namespace, but when I saw the use of an actual structure pointer I had > > > to do it the new way.?? As I recall when I saw something that would > not have been legal with the old rules (for example, two different > structures with the same element name but different offsets) then I > threw > the switch and demanded the new way.?? > > There were certainly system changes that were flash cut.?? For > example, changing the file system format -- there was no attempt to > allow both, which meant that the conversion program got one shot to > get it right.?? And it didn't always manage that... > > Steve > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > david@kdbarto.org > > To: > "Steve Johnson" > Cc: > "The Eunuchs Hysterical Society" > Sent: > Mon, 29 Oct 2018 12:02:29 -0700 > Subject: > Re: [TUHS] Archaic yacc C grammar > > On Oct 29, 2018, at 10:52 AM, Steve Johnson > wrote: > > We actually had a pretty good system for making changes like that.?? > First, we would change > the compiler to accept both the old and the new.???? Then we would > produce a warning > that on a particular date the old would no longer work.?? Then we made > the old an error > and printed a message about how to fix it.???? Eventually, we just let > it be a syntax error. > This process was applied many times on the way from typeless B to > strongly typed C. > > Was there ever a time when a change was desired that you couldn???t > accept both > the old and the new? > > David > > > > Links: > ------ > [1] mailto:scj@yaccman.com > -- --- Larry McVoy lm at mcvoy.com http://www.mcvoy.com/lm