From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id bbf2bb9d for ; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 23:26:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 542A29BC90; Wed, 28 Aug 2019 09:26:41 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 381449BC35; Wed, 28 Aug 2019 09:26:03 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id BF3DB9BBFD; Wed, 28 Aug 2019 09:26:00 +1000 (AEST) X-Greylist: delayed 561 seconds by postgrey-1.36 at minnie.tuhs.org; Wed, 28 Aug 2019 09:26:00 AEST Received: from mail.bitblocks.com (ns1.bitblocks.com [173.228.5.8]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 420A59BBF7 for ; Wed, 28 Aug 2019 09:26:00 +1000 (AEST) Received: from bitblocks.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.bitblocks.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55E991570CEA; Tue, 27 Aug 2019 16:16:18 -0700 (PDT) To: Larry McVoy In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:40:02 -0700." <20190827224002.GB15511@mcvoy.com> References: <75a32043-4830-ba04-ee0f-023c5f5ade3f@gmail.com> <20190827003013.GS13570@mcvoy.com> <312b39a1-2944-100f-55e0-fc65b504d43d@kilonet.net> <20190827024511.GU13570@mcvoy.com> <20190827145556.GD13570@mcvoy.com> <20190827224002.GB15511@mcvoy.com> Comments: In-reply-to Larry McVoy message dated "Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:40:02 -0700." From: Bakul Shah MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <63302.1566947778.1@bitblocks.com> Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2019 16:16:18 -0700 Message-Id: <20190827231625.55E991570CEA@mail.bitblocks.com> Subject: Re: [TUHS] If not Linux, then what? X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" On Tue, 27 Aug 2019 15:40:02 -0700 Larry McVoy wrote: Larry McVoy writes: > and I can tell you that sockets are WAY WAY better. I get the "it > should have just been file I/O" except that I don't. I tried to > write a library that let you open up /net/tcp/$host:$port and do > I/O like it was a file descriptor. That works for a lot of stuff > but I ran into problems quickly. A networking connection is not > a file handle. You can make some stuff work but I couldn't figure > out how to do all of it. You end up having to do ioctls to handle > the stuff that doesn't fit well into the file system name space. > I think plan 9 did this sort of thing, maybe Rob can prove me wrong > or remember where it didn't match. Plan9 does a decent enough job. cpu% ls /net/tcp /net/tcp/0 /net/tcp/1 /net/tcp/2 /net/tcp/clone /net/tcp/stats cpu% ls /net/tcp/1 /net/tcp/1/ctl /net/tcp/1/data /net/tcp/1/err /net/tcp/1/listen /net/tcp/1/local /net/tcp/1/remote /net/tcp/1/status cpu% cd /net/tcp/1 cpu% cat local remote 192.168.1.103!17010 192.168.1.11!52027 See http://doc.cat-v.org/plan_9/4th_edition/papers/net/ Replacing ioctls with writing ascii commands to ctl files was a significant improvement. For one thing you can do all this from a shell script. plan9 would've been a big improvement over *BSD or Linux. But I think a conceptual merge was needed between some sane version of Unix and plan9 so as to not throw out all the dusty decks.