From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 80d67df1 for ; Mon, 16 Sep 2019 20:47:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id E55719BFDA; Tue, 17 Sep 2019 06:47:41 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04B4D94794; Tue, 17 Sep 2019 06:47:31 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 9E79994794; Tue, 17 Sep 2019 06:47:29 +1000 (AEST) Received: from darkstar.fourwinds.com (fourwinds.com [63.64.179.162]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 365799478F for ; Tue, 17 Sep 2019 06:47:29 +1000 (AEST) Received: from darkstar.fourwinds.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by darkstar.fourwinds.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id x8GKlStI001638 for ; Mon, 16 Sep 2019 13:47:28 -0700 Received: from darkstar.fourwinds.com (jon@localhost) by darkstar.fourwinds.com (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id x8GKlSbX001635 for ; Mon, 16 Sep 2019 13:47:28 -0700 Message-Id: <201909162047.x8GKlSbX001635@darkstar.fourwinds.com> From: Jon Steinhart To: tuhs@tuhs.org In-reply-to: <20190916202153.wbpzx3jn3a7rs6kb@localhost.localdomain> References: <20190915232524.9A5491570CE9@mail.bitblocks.com> <7F62BF6B-8FEA-4C43-9E35-05BDE9BF04EA@ccc.com> <20190916023738.F34E81570CE9@mail.bitblocks.com> <20190916202153.wbpzx3jn3a7rs6kb@localhost.localdomain> Comments: In-reply-to "G. Branden Robinson" message dated "Tue, 17 Sep 2019 06:21:56 +1000." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <1633.1568666847.1@darkstar.fourwinds.com> Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2019 13:47:27 -0700 X-JON-SPAM: local delivery Subject: Re: [TUHS] INed/Rand Editor/Ned [was Re: My EuroBSDcon talk (preview for commentary) X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" G. Branden Robinson writes: > > At 2019-09-16T17:16:12+0100, Warner Losh wrote: > > I got to look at the source to a few other editors of the era. All has > > the terminal codes hard coded into them... it was common to do that > > before things like termcap... > > It's still common today. Everything the developer cares to think about, > let alone test on, interprets EMCA-48 SGR escape sequences. My favorite > recent example is "spectre-meltdown-checker", which has such edifying > lines as: > > _info_nol "> \033[46m\033[30mSTATUS:\033[0m " > > Why write something portable when you can be "close to the metal"? :-/ > > I gently steer people to better ways when the occasion presents itself. > > Regards, > Branden We can have an interesting discussion of the definition of "better ways". I see termcap as a great solution for the days in which there was little standardization. But it's probably pretty hard to find a non-conforming terminal nowadays so I think that it's better to avoid obfuscation. Were it me I would have a comment that referenced the page and section number in the standard. Since we like debating the merits of old technology, somebody can kick off a termcap versus terminfo discussion :-) Jon