From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 28306 invoked from network); 29 Mar 2021 15:50:04 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 29 Mar 2021 15:50:04 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 7AF639C835; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 01:50:02 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9138F9C82C; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 01:49:49 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 4840D9C82C; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 01:49:47 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mcvoy.com (mcvoy.com [192.169.23.250]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6E2A49C82B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2021 01:49:46 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mcvoy.com (Postfix, from userid 3546) id 4775F35E1C8; Mon, 29 Mar 2021 08:49:45 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 08:49:45 -0700 From: Larry McVoy To: Clem Cole Message-ID: <20210329154945.GE4209@mcvoy.com> References: <20210329143449.GA28080@mcvoy.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Subject: Re: [TUHS] Remember the ed thread? X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" That's an excellent book. After that, try this one: https://www.amazon.com/Advanced-UNIX-Programming-Marc-Rochkind/dp/0131411543 On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 11:37:57AM -0400, Clem Cole wrote: > Anders -- good for you. > > That said, as one of those 'grey beards,' can I recommend that you stop, > and go to a technical library or bookstore and find yourself a copy of Rob > and Brian's wonderful book: "*The Unix Programming Environment*" (*a.k.a* > "UPE" or ISBN 0-13-937699-2) *then do the exercises*. That book is still > relevant today - a little secret, I give a copy of it and "*Advanced > Programming in the Unix Environment*" (*a.k.a.* "APUE") to all my new > engineers - even though they are all using 'Linux' for their work. To > those that object at first, I remind them, Linux is just the current and > most popular implementation of the ideas from Ken, Dennis, Doug, and > friends and I'm sure they will learn something from the time invested[1]. > > FWIW: Besides learning ed (which will help you unlock some of the mysteries > of other UNIX tools like grep and sed), take a shot at looking at the > introduction to nroff/troff (as has been discussed here - not to restart a > war). Learning to use a 'document compiler' like the troff family is never > a bad investment. > > Have fun, > Clem > > > 1.] BTW I have yet had a young engineer that actually did try the > exercises not come back and say something like "Wow, I never knew ...." I > don't gloat, but I smile inside, know that I just made them a more > effective for our team. If they ask, I point out I had been using UNIX and > hacking on the kernel most every day for at least 10 years when it first > appeared in the early 80's (84/85 I think), and I learned a few tricks when > I read it. > ??? > ??? > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 11:16 AM Anders Damsgaard > wrote: > > > * Larry McVoy [2021-03-29 07:34:49 -0700]: > > > > >I had *.clients.your-server.de crawling mcvoy.com in violation of my > > >robots.txt. For whatever reason, the tty settings (or something) > > >made vi not work, I dunno what the deal is, stty -tabs didn't help. > > > > > >So I had to resort to ed to write and debug the little program below. > > >It was surprisingly pleasant, it's probably the first time I've used ed > > >for anything real in at least a decade. My fingers still know it. > > > > > >+1 for ed. It's how many decades old and still useful? > > > > I recently learned ed(1) for the first time (I have a unix beard, but it's > > not grey yet). I found ed to be very efficient and useful for small fixes, > > even on slow connections. This beginner's tutorial was very helpful > > for me: gopher://katolaz.net/0/ed_tutorial.txt > > > > (https mirror for non-gopher clients: > > https://adamsgaard.dk/npub/ed_tutorial.txt ) > > -- --- Larry McVoy lm at mcvoy.com http://www.mcvoy.com/lm