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Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2021 12:41:03 -0700
From: Larry McVoy <lm@mcvoy.com>
To: Jon Steinhart <jon@fourwinds.com>
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Subject: Re: [TUHS] ATC/OSDI'21 joint keynote: It's Time for Operating
 Systems to Rediscover Hardware (Timothy Roscoe)
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On Thu, Sep 16, 2021 at 12:34:15PM -0700, Jon Steinhart wrote:
> As I've said before, I'm having difficulty distinguishing the "full stack"
> in full stack programming from a compost heap.  It's not OK to me from a
> security, safety, and reliability perspective to build on a rotting
> foundation.

Amen.

> It's my opinion that the whole container thing sort of started as a "we
> can't secure the underlying system so we'll build something secure on top"
> combined with "it's no fun to fix the unnecessary incompatible mess among
> virtually identical systems that we've made so we'll build a new fix-it
> layer" ideologies.  How long until problems are found with containers
> it's decided that the way to fix it is to build "safe deposit boxes" that
> run in container?  Is there ever an end in sight?

I think it is that the newer kids are less willing to understand stuff.
So they build something on top that they understand.  I agree that they
will hit problems and likely build "safe deposit boxes" because the
containers are "too complex".

Oh, and get off my lawn!