[TUHS] Re: Any Bell 8-bit UNIX Efforts?

[Larry McVoy <lm@mcvoy.com>]

Well if you think about how hard the orginal folks worked to fit useful 
programs in 64K, it's hard to imagine there was much appetite for trying
to fit in smaller processors.  All the focus was on machines with more
memory, banked PDP-11s and then the VAX.  The 8 bit market was all home
owner CP/M machines.

On Tue, Feb 28, 2023 at 06:59:14PM +0000, segaloco via TUHS wrote:
> Sounds like Idris and uNIX are the closest we get with ex-Bell personnel being involved with both projects.
> 
> I haven't found anything in the surviving Bell streams that suggests any 8-bit attempts internally, and various portability documents suggest 16-bit and 32-bit targets abound but nothing like a 6502 or Z80 running UNIX inside Bell, again not that it would really be that worthwhile of an experiment at the time given their focus on minis.  Anywho, if anything ever does show up in my study I'll happily share the details.
> 
> - Matt G.
> 
> ------- Original Message -------
> On Monday, February 27th, 2023 at 2:57 AM, Jonathan Gray <jsg@jsg.id.au> wrote:
> 
> 
> > On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 07:48:45PM +0000, segaloco via TUHS wrote:
> > 
> > > So in working on an unrelated 6502 project, I got to wondering about
> > > UNIX on it and other 8-bits. Did some Googling, and while I was
> > > able to turn up some attempts at UNIX-likes on 6502 as well as Z80,
> > > the only one I found that might have some Bell connection is "uNIX"
> > > as documented here: https://bitsavers.org/pdf/uNIX/uNIX_Jan82.pdf
> > > 
> > > A forum post I read suggested those involved were some former Bell
> > > folks from NJ. In any case, this begs the question for me: Were
> > > there ever any serious attempts at an 8-bit UNIX in the labs or
> > > Bell System at large? Certainly it would've provided quite the
> > > challenge without much return compared with 16 and 32-bit efforts,
> > > but does anyone know if, say, an LSX/Mini-UNIX-ish attempt was ever
> > > made at the 6502, Z80, or other 8-bits? Thanks all!
> > > 
> > > - Matt G.
> > 
> > 
> > If by Bell connection you mean people. Plauger left in 1975,
> > joined Yourdon Inc in 1975, started Whitesmiths Ltd in 1978[1].
> > Whitesmiths created Idris, a clone of Unix.
> > 
> > "Idris can run comfortably where UNIX can't event fit: On an
> > MC68000 with no memory management hardware, for example.
> > On a bank-switched 8080 or Z80. Or on any LS-11 or PDP-11
> > with memory management."
> > Whitesmiths advertisement in Computerworld, Mar 1983 [2].
> > 
> > Yourdon Inc, announced Omnix in 1980, a Unix-like system for Z80[3].
> > By 1981 it "had to be withdrawn when Yourdon were let down by its
> > developers" [4].
> > 
> > [1] https://indico.cern.ch/event/318305/attachments/612388/842557/PJPlauger-ITSeminar-Fifty_years.pdf
> > [2] https://books.google.com/books?id=RAe4jAHXAgwC&pg=PA50
> > [3] https://www.tuhs.org/Archive/Documentation/AUUGN/AUUGN-V02.3.pdf
> > [4] https://dl.acm.org/doi/pdf/10.1145/1164679.1164681
> > 
> > The last article is "UNIX on a Micro" by Cornelia Boldyreff.
> > It briefly mentions other 8-bit Unix-likes: Cromemco's Cromix,
> > Thinker Toys/Morrow's Micronix, Technical Systems Consultants' UniFLEX.

-- 
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Larry McVoy           Retired to fishing          http://www.mcvoy.com/lm/boat