From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [IPv6:2600:3c01:e000:146::1]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0C5B21626 for ; Fri, 5 Jul 2024 02:12:55 +0200 (CEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB82A436B0; Fri, 5 Jul 2024 10:12:51 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mcvoy.com (mcvoy.com [192.169.23.250]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 07C354365F for ; Fri, 5 Jul 2024 10:12:48 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mcvoy.com (Postfix, from userid 3546) id 88F2A35EA3B; Thu, 4 Jul 2024 17:12:47 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2024 17:12:47 -0700 From: Larry McVoy To: Stuff Received Message-ID: <20240705001247.GK26356@mcvoy.com> References: <93529CA0-7097-443C-999B-384BE6BD5683@canb.auug.org.au> <17b4e96d-724d-0394-7a95-50be7a76f695@riddermarkfarm.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <17b4e96d-724d-0394-7a95-50be7a76f695@riddermarkfarm.ca> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Message-ID-Hash: UQTAGXOJZSBU73HNMDT6AHHJOEMZWQBO X-Message-ID-Hash: UQTAGXOJZSBU73HNMDT6AHHJOEMZWQBO X-MailFrom: lm@mcvoy.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: tuhs@tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Anyone ever heard of teaching a case study of Initial Unix? List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Thu, Jul 04, 2024 at 08:03:10PM -0400, Stuff Received wrote: > On 2024-07-04 16:34, Nevin Liber wrote (in part): > >On Thu, Jul 4, 2024 at 3:24???AM Vincenzo Nicosia >> wrote: > > > > I agree my view is cynical. Maybe that's because I cannot find anything > > romantic or poetic in "financing, regulatory constraints, product > > schedules, commitments, staffing issues, and everything else that isn't > > coding". > > > > > >Real Artists Ship: https://folklore.org/Real_Artists_Ship.html > > > > > >How would you have ever seen Unix had it not been for financing > >(engineers, even passionate??ones, kind of like to eat and have a roof > >over their heads)??? Without regulatory??constraints (while not perfect), > >applying Unix to anything that is safety critical (lives directly on the > >line) would be a disaster.?? I can make a similar statement for every > >single thing in that list which isn't coding. > > In full agreement. Having worked at startups, engineers often do all of > these other tasks and know their importance. I'm friends with one of the ZFS guys (and I hired the other guy at Sun) and one Bill's interview questions for a startup candidate is "If we need you to, will you sweep the floors". Bill likes people who can do whatever is needed.