From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [IPv6:2600:3c01:e000:146::1]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DEBC272CA for ; Sat, 28 Sep 2024 20:06:08 +0200 (CEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B9A642608; Sun, 29 Sep 2024 04:06:04 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mcvoy.com (mcvoy.com [192.169.23.250]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 53AE942604 for ; Sun, 29 Sep 2024 04:06:00 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mcvoy.com (Postfix, from userid 3546) id AEEF335E9FB; Sat, 28 Sep 2024 11:05:59 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2024 11:05:59 -0700 From: Larry McVoy To: "G. Branden Robinson" Message-ID: <20240928180559.GF9067@mcvoy.com> References: <20240928165812.4uyturluj4dsuwef@illithid> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20240928165812.4uyturluj4dsuwef@illithid> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.24 (2015-08-30) Message-ID-Hash: 2ZPBWDISK4PQEXDRCMWCFBALOHNVJGCZ X-Message-ID-Hash: 2ZPBWDISK4PQEXDRCMWCFBALOHNVJGCZ X-MailFrom: lm@mcvoy.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: TUHS main list X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Minimum Array Sizes in 16 bit C (was Maximum) List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Sat, Sep 28, 2024 at 11:58:12AM -0500, G. Branden Robinson wrote: > The problem is that, like James Madison's fictive government of angels, > such entities don't exist. The staff of the CSRC itself may have been > overwhelmingly populated with frank, modest, and self-deprecating > people--and I'll emphasize here that I'm aware of no accounts that this > is anything but true--but C unfortunately played a part in stoking a > culture of pretension among software developers. "C is a language in > which wizards program. I program in C. Therefore I'm a wizard." is how > the syllogism (spot the fallacy) went. I don't know who does more > damage--the people who believe their own BS, or the ones who know > they're scamming their colleagues. I have a somewhat different view. I have a son who is learning to program and he asked me about C. I said "C is like driving a sports car on a twisty mountain road that has cliffs and no guard rails. If you want to check your phone while you are driving, it's not for you. It requires your full, focussed attention. So that sounds bad, right? Well, if you are someone who enjoys driving a sports car, and are good at it, perhaps C is for you." So I guess I fit the description of thinking I'm a wizard, sort of. I'm good at C, there is plenty of my C open sourced, you can go read it and decide for yourself. I enjoy C. But it's not for everyone, in fact, most programmers these days would be better off in Rust or something that has guardrails. I get your points, Branden, but I'd prefer that C sticks around for the people who enjoy it and are good at it. A small crowd, for sure. --lm