From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [IPv6:2600:3c01:e000:146::1]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 500FD2C8CE for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2024 15:47:44 +0200 (CEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 237F243789; Tue, 1 Oct 2024 23:47:40 +1000 (AEST) Received: from freefriends.org (frenzy.freefriends.org [198.99.81.75]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 95E2243766 for ; Tue, 1 Oct 2024 23:47:36 +1000 (AEST) X-Envelope-From: arnold@skeeve.com Received: from freefriends.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by freefriends.org (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPS id 491DlAwh423778 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Tue, 1 Oct 2024 07:47:10 -0600 Received: (from arnold@localhost) by freefriends.org (8.16.1/8.14.7/Submit) id 491DlAsJ423777; Tue, 1 Oct 2024 07:47:10 -0600 From: arnold@skeeve.com Message-Id: <202410011347.491DlAsJ423777@freefriends.org> X-Authentication-Warning: frenzy.freefriends.org: arnold set sender to arnold@skeeve.com using -f Date: Tue, 01 Oct 2024 07:47:10 -0600 To: lm@mcvoy.com, arnold@skeeve.com References: <20240928165812.4uyturluj4dsuwef@illithid> <20240928180138.aygrwqdwrvq3n6xt@illithid> <202410011313.491DD4ac421643@freefriends.org> <20241001133231.GE13777@mcvoy.com> In-Reply-To: <20241001133231.GE13777@mcvoy.com> User-Agent: Heirloom mailx 12.5 7/5/10 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID-Hash: PMQPV5GQFODHD7FUL75PEROBKS6LOCM2 X-Message-ID-Hash: PMQPV5GQFODHD7FUL75PEROBKS6LOCM2 X-MailFrom: arnold@skeeve.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: tuhs@tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Minimum Array Sizes in 16 bit C (was Maximum) List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Larry McVoy wrote: > On Tue, Oct 01, 2024 at 07:13:04AM -0600, arnold@skeeve.com wrote: > > Would the word have been better off if Ada had caught on everywhere? > > Probably. When I was in grad school studying language design, circa 1982, > > it was expected to do so. But the language was VERY challenging for > > compiler writers. > > Huh. Rob Netzer and I, as grad students, took cs701 and cs702 at UW Madison. > It was the compilers course (701) and the really hard compilers course (702) > at the time. The first course was to write a compiler for a subset of Ada > and the second on increased the subset to be almost complete. > > We were supposed to do it on an IBM mainframe because the professor had his > own version of lex/yacc there. Rob had a 3b1 and asked if we could do it > there if he rewrote the parser stuff. Prof said sure. > > In one semester we had a compiler, no optimizer and not much in the > way of graceful error handling, but it compiled stuff that ran. We did > all of Ada other than late binding of variables (I think that was Ada's > templates) and threads and probably some other stuff I don't remember. Did you do generics? That and the run time, which had some real-time bits to it (*IIRC*, it's been a long time), as well as the cross object code type checking, would have been real bears. Like many things, the first 90% is easy, the second 90% is hard. :-) > I don't consider myself to be that good of a programmer, I can point to > dozens of people my age that can run circles around me and I'm sure there > are many more. You are undoubtedly better than you give yourself credit for, even if there were people who could run circles around you. I learned a long time ago, that no matter how good you are, there's always someone better than you at something. I decided long ago to not try to compete with Superman. > But apparently the bar is pretty low these days and I agree, that's sad. And it makes it much less fun to be out in the working world. :-( Arnold